Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I get what you're saying and claiming. Labeling OKG as racist, though, implies that Petersen deliberately puts up standards that he believes/thinks/knows that poor black kids can't meet. I don't think that's what you actually believe. If you want to say Pete's OKG standards are biased against people from certain backgrounds I think you'd get more traction there, and I would probably agree with you on some level. Outright and intentional racism though?
Watching white people squirm is entertaining.
I appreciate you trying to help out my traction, but I'm doing fine thanks. Only white people don't understand this issue.
Great non-answer, as always. I give you credit for sticking to your guns no matter how irrational you might sound. Yes, I get it. You're black and only you can understand racism because of that fact. I should trust you when you call something racist no matter how irrational that claim may be.
DDY isn't black...
That's exactly what Dennis is communicating.
How about you message board heroes let the actually people associated with the program speak on perceived racism. Maybe our NFL players who promote the program on twitter, or Buffy Miller?
The people we WANT to become associated with the program but aren't converting are the bellwether here not the people that have been all in for years.
Smalls, Rodgers, Scott, Phillips, Flowe, Ricks, DJ Johnson, Treshaun, Jeremiah Martin, etc are saying they have a problem with our recruiting or program.
So if I understand this correctly, it seems like Dennis is trying to point out that the perception is there. Which is fair.
But what others are trying to point out is that perception alone isn't proof that racism exists. And if there is no proof that it exists, then we should assume it doesn't. So where are we supposed to go from there?
And if a guy doesn't fit the locker room and the current players on the roster don't like him, than that's that. Some of you think it's all Petersen behind recruiting decisions but it's also about the players on the roster who are hosting recruits on their visits and have been empowered to report back to Petersen if they think a guy is or isn't a fit in the locker room. JT Daniels was not a fit after he visited. A guy like Josh Rosen would have never been signed by UW. Not a fit with the rest of the players. If a guy is not going to be able to get along with the players we already have, he's probably not going to be successful here and will end up transferring out anyways. We're better off identifying those kinds of guy beforehand and not signing them in the first place. #TEAMOKG
Now, if we could just combine the OKG/BFL philosophy with FUN and EXCITEMENT that resonates beyond the program out to fans and recruits...we'd really be onto to something.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I get what you're saying and claiming. Labeling OKG as racist, though, implies that Petersen deliberately puts up standards that he believes/thinks/knows that poor black kids can't meet. I don't think that's what you actually believe. If you want to say Pete's OKG standards are biased against people from certain backgrounds I think you'd get more traction there, and I would probably agree with you on some level. Outright and intentional racism though?
A policy or procedure can be racist even if not intentionally so if it has a disparate impact.
We can get into a debate over structural racism in current society and in history and why black people on average are worse off socioeconomically, educationally, criminally. We can also get into a debate over fast strategy/slow strategy theory of culture.
But we don't need to. All that matters is that UW is recruiting and signing black players at what is the lowest rate in my lifetime so the disparate impact is clearly present.
Whether that is random chance or because we just decided that we had great momentum with Polys or because OKG is unintentionally racist is arguably up for debate. Maybe its all three.
But the perception of bias/racism is out there and is being used by our rivals.
So CP needs to make changes and adapt. It isn't going away.
They are also winning at a greater rate than in your lifetime. So, there's that.
So if I understand this correctly, it seems like Dennis is trying to point out that the perception is there. Which is fair.
But what others are trying to point out is that perception alone isn't proof that racism exists. And if there is no proof that it exists, then we should assume it doesn't. So where are we supposed to go from there?
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I get what you're saying and claiming. Labeling OKG as racist, though, implies that Petersen deliberately puts up standards that he believes/thinks/knows that poor black kids can't meet. I don't think that's what you actually believe. If you want to say Pete's OKG standards are biased against people from certain backgrounds I think you'd get more traction there, and I would probably agree with you on some level. Outright and intentional racism though?
A policy or procedure can be racist even if not intentionally so if it has a disparate impact.
We can get into a debate over structural racism in current society and in history and why black people on average are worse off socioeconomically, educationally, criminally. We can also get into a debate over fast strategy/slow strategy theory of culture.
But we don't need to. All that matters is that UW is recruiting and signing black players at what is the lowest rate in my lifetime so the disparate impact is clearly present.
Whether that is random chance or because we just decided that we had great momentum with Polys or because OKG is unintentionally racist is arguably up for debate. Maybe its all three.
But the perception of bias/racism is out there and is being used by our rivals.
So CP needs to make changes and adapt. It isn't going away.
They are also winning at a greater rate than in your lifetime. So, there's that.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I get what you're saying and claiming. Labeling OKG as racist, though, implies that Petersen deliberately puts up standards that he believes/thinks/knows that poor black kids can't meet. I don't think that's what you actually believe. If you want to say Pete's OKG standards are biased against people from certain backgrounds I think you'd get more traction there, and I would probably agree with you on some level. Outright and intentional racism though?
Watching white people squirm is entertaining.
I appreciate you trying to help out my traction, but I'm doing fine thanks. Only white people don't understand this issue.
Great non-answer, as always. I give you credit for sticking to your guns no matter how irrational you might sound. Yes, I get it. You're black and only you can understand racism because of that fact. I should trust you when you call something racist no matter how irrational that claim may be.
DDY isn't black...
That's exactly what Dennis is communicating.
How about you message board heroes let the actually people associated with the program speak on perceived racism. Maybe our NFL players who promote the program on twitter, or Buffy Miller?
The people we WANT to become associated with the program but aren't converting are the bellwether here not the people that have been all in for years.
Smalls, Rodgers, Scott, Phillips, Flowe, Ricks, DJ Johnson, Treshaun, Jeremiah Martin, etc are saying they have a problem with our recruiting or program.
Maybe we should hear that and adapt.
Can you please expound on the things Rodgers, Scott, Phillips, Flowe, Ricks, DJ Johnson, Treshaun, and Jeremiah Martin have said about our program? I need those juicy deets.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I get what you're saying and claiming. Labeling OKG as racist, though, implies that Petersen deliberately puts up standards that he believes/thinks/knows that poor black kids can't meet. I don't think that's what you actually believe. If you want to say Pete's OKG standards are biased against people from certain backgrounds I think you'd get more traction there, and I would probably agree with you on some level. Outright and intentional racism though?
A policy or procedure can be racist even if not intentionally so if it has a disparate impact.
We can get into a debate over structural racism in current society and in history and why black people on average are worse off socioeconomically, educationally, criminally. We can also get into a debate over fast strategy/slow strategy theory of culture.
But we don't need to. All that matters is that UW is recruiting and signing black players at what is the lowest rate in my lifetime so the disparate impact is clearly present.
Whether that is random chance or because we just decided that we had great momentum with Polys or because OKG is unintentionally racist is arguably up for debate. Maybe its all three.
But the perception of bias/racism is out there and is being used by our rivals.
So CP needs to make changes and adapt. It isn't going away.
FYFMFE for weighing in on the topic. But this is a less hyperventilated post that is much easier to respond to. The 23-and-me, pseudo brown paper bag tests of the other threads was too much for me, as a (partially) white person.
A policy or procedure can be racist even if not intentionally so if it has a disparate impact.
I understand what you're saying here in broad terms, but it does not apply to this OKG thing. Racist is inherently negative and carries intent with it. Furthermore, we're not talking crack cocaine sentencing here. These are are football scholarships, accompanied by expectations, offered voluntarily to recruits for voluntary acceptance. If you can show some egregious imbalance in offers to black athletes, maybe racist comes into play. I doubt it. So far, the only numbers are of who's on the roster.
The rest I agree with.
Petersen is not going to change his fundamental principles on the OKG thing. If you want OKG gone, Petersen must go first. Dennis knows this. Dennis also has said how beneficial the Built for Life program/values can be for young men no matter color, background, etc. Adaptation then is a matter of communication, speaker->message->receiver, focusing on the message. The speaker and his principles are not going to change, the receivers (baller ass recruits) probably not going to change, then it must be the messaging. Dennis, et al, have shown repetedly (lol) the public messaging has failed. I suspect Petersen feels that any change in messaging betrays his fundamentals. I disagree with that.
But I'm (partially) white so you can ignore this opinion if you like.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I think OKG is stupid, but isn't it itself racist to assume that OKG doesn't include black people, or somehow discriminates against them? Black dudes can be OKG much as white people. Otherwise, Pete would have to just have an issue with black people, and I don't think he does.
If this is about what Race was discussing the other day, different deal. You can (and should) recruit a few maniacs, and they come in all colors, shapes and sizes.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I think OKG is stupid, but isn't it itself racist to assume that OKG doesn't include black people, or somehow discriminates against them? Black dudes can be OKG much as white people. Otherwise, Pete would have to just have an issue with black people, and I don't think he does.
If this is about what Race was discussing the other day, different deal. You can (and should) recruit a few maniacs, and they come in all colors, shapes and sizes.
As I said in another thread, I don’t think Pete is racist. I don’t think OKG is racist. But perception is reality and the perception is clearly out there - first by local HS coaches, now by rival recruiters.
It doesn’t matter that it’s not grounded in truth, the perception is out there, and it’s probably the worst accusation that could come against a football program. It literally just cost us the best player to come out of our area in nineteen years. At least.
I’m not 100% sure how Pete fixes this but i am sure ignoring it and hoping it goes away is the wrong idea. Pete needs to empower the Shaq’s, John Ross’s, Myles Gaskins, Budda Bakers, Sidney Jones and Jordan Milers of the world to hit back against this A the fuck SAP.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I get what you're saying and claiming. Labeling OKG as racist, though, implies that Petersen deliberately puts up standards that he believes/thinks/knows that poor black kids can't meet. I don't think that's what you actually believe. If you want to say Pete's OKG standards are biased against people from certain backgrounds I think you'd get more traction there, and I would probably agree with you on some level. Outright and intentional racism though?
Watching white people squirm is entertaining.
I appreciate you trying to help out my traction, but I'm doing fine thanks. Only white people don't understand this issue.
Great non-answer, as always. I give you credit for sticking to your guns no matter how irrational you might sound. Yes, I get it. You're black and only you can understand racism because of that fact. I should trust you when you call something racist no matter how irrational that claim may be.
DDY isn't black...
That's exactly what Dennis is communicating.
How about you message board heroes let the actually people associated with the program speak on perceived racism. Maybe our NFL players who promote the program on twitter, or Buffy Miller?
The people we WANT to become associated with the program but aren't converting are the bellwether here not the people that have been all in for years.
Smalls, Rodgers, Scott, Phillips, Flowe, Ricks, DJ Johnson, Treshaun, Jeremiah Martin, etc are saying they have a problem with our recruiting or program.
Maybe we should hear that and adapt.
Can you please expound on the things Rodgers, Scott, Phillips, Flowe, Ricks, DJ Johnson, Treshaun, and Jeremiah Martin have said about our program? I need those juicy deets.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I get what you're saying and claiming. Labeling OKG as racist, though, implies that Petersen deliberately puts up standards that he believes/thinks/knows that poor black kids can't meet. I don't think that's what you actually believe. If you want to say Pete's OKG standards are biased against people from certain backgrounds I think you'd get more traction there, and I would probably agree with you on some level. Outright and intentional racism though?
Watching white people squirm is entertaining.
I appreciate you trying to help out my traction, but I'm doing fine thanks. Only white people don't understand this issue.
Great non-answer, as always. I give you credit for sticking to your guns no matter how irrational you might sound. Yes, I get it. You're black and only you can understand racism because of that fact. I should trust you when you call something racist no matter how irrational that claim may be.
DDY isn't black...
That's exactly what Dennis is communicating.
How about you message board heroes let the actually people associated with the program speak on perceived racism. Maybe our NFL players who promote the program on twitter, or Buffy Miller?
The people we WANT to become associated with the program but aren't converting are the bellwether here not the people that have been all in for years.
Smalls, Rodgers, Scott, Phillips, Flowe, Ricks, DJ Johnson, Treshaun, Jeremiah Martin, etc are saying they have a problem with our recruiting or program.
Maybe we should hear that and adapt.
Grouping all of those players together just because they're black is stupid. There have been plenty of white kids and poly kids who felt like UW wasn't for them either and that's fine. It's not for everybody and there are some other great options out there. Every individual recruit is his own person and his recruitment by UW is nuanced and different from the recruitment of others. Half those kids you mentioned just weren't interested in UW at all from the jump. Has nothing to do with the way they were recruited. Like I said before, some just aren't interested in academics and the built for life shit. They don't care which if fine. Rodgers and Scott have never been offered. They are completely irrelevant. Just because they're in-state recruits doesn't mean they're at all relevant to UW recruiting. The only guys who are relevant are guys that UW offers and wants. On top of that, DJ Johnson wanted to transfer to UW over Oregon. UW did their homework on him and passed. Sometimes kids or their parents want to be paid and UW doesn't pay so that eliminates us as well. UW just might not be "cool" enough for some kids. Wearing a UW uniform might not make a kid feel cool or swaggy compared to wearing a Texas or Florida uniform. Maybe that will change with the Adidas uniforms and winning big bowl games. There are all sorts of difference nuanced reasons as to why UW doesn't get a guy or isn't interested in a guy and it's different for every single recruit.
You idiots are perpetuating a false narrative and doing damage to your own team. Just stop.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I think OKG is stupid, but isn't it itself racist to assume that OKG doesn't include black people, or somehow discriminates against them? Black dudes can be OKG much as white people. Otherwise, Pete would have to just have an issue with black people, and I don't think he does.
If this is about what Race was discussing the other day, different deal. You can (and should) recruit a few maniacs, and they come in all colors, shapes and sizes.
Michael Irvin and Stan Emptermann could not be more different in upbringing and color yet both provided that vital leadership that said - follow me boys we're going to fuck some people up today
Stan was more feared than any opponent or coach. I'm not sure if Michael led in exactly that way, I saw him more as get on my back we got these fuckers beat. We're better than them
Current UW and most teams since most teams are losers go into a game wondering if they can win - like out post season games. By the time they realize they can its too late. They lost
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I think OKG is stupid, but isn't it itself racist to assume that OKG doesn't include black people, or somehow discriminates against them? Black dudes can be OKG much as white people. Otherwise, Pete would have to just have an issue with black people, and I don't think he does.
If this is about what Race was discussing the other day, different deal. You can (and should) recruit a few maniacs, and they come in all colors, shapes and sizes.
As I said in another thread, I don’t think Pete is racist. I don’t think OKG is racist. But perception is reality and the perception is clearly out there - first by local HS coaches, now by rival recruiters.
It doesn’t matter that it’s not grounded in truth, the perception is out there, and it’s probably the worst accusation that could come against a football program. It literally just cost us the best player to come out of our area in nineteen years. At least.
I’m not 100% sure how Pete fixes this but i am sure ignoring it and hoping it goes away is the wrong idea. Pete needs to empower the Shaq’s, John Ross’s, Myles Gaskins, Budda Bakers, Sidney Jones and Jordan Milers of the world to hit back against this A the fuck SAP.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I get what you're saying and claiming. Labeling OKG as racist, though, implies that Petersen deliberately puts up standards that he believes/thinks/knows that poor black kids can't meet. I don't think that's what you actually believe. If you want to say Pete's OKG standards are biased against people from certain backgrounds I think you'd get more traction there, and I would probably agree with you on some level. Outright and intentional racism though?
Watching white people squirm is entertaining.
I appreciate you trying to help out my traction, but I'm doing fine thanks. Only white people don't understand this issue.
Great non-answer, as always. I give you credit for sticking to your guns no matter how irrational you might sound. Yes, I get it. You're black and only you can understand racism because of that fact. I should trust you when you call something racist no matter how irrational that claim may be.
DDY isn't black...
That's exactly what Dennis is communicating.
How about you message board heroes let the actually people associated with the program speak on perceived racism. Maybe our NFL players who promote the program on twitter, or Buffy Miller?
The people we WANT to become associated with the program but aren't converting are the bellwether here not the people that have been all in for years.
Smalls, Rodgers, Scott, Phillips, Flowe, Ricks, DJ Johnson, Treshaun, Jeremiah Martin, etc are saying they have a problem with our recruiting or program.
Maybe we should hear that and adapt.
Can you please expound on the things Rodgers, Scott, Phillips, Flowe, Ricks, DJ Johnson, Treshaun, and Jeremiah Martin have said about our program? I need those juicy deets.
They said they are committing to other programs.
They commit to other programs and you construe that as them saying they have a problem with UW's recruiting or program? You have got to be shitting me with that response. Get over yourself.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I think OKG is stupid, but isn't it itself racist to assume that OKG doesn't include black people, or somehow discriminates against them? Black dudes can be OKG much as white people. Otherwise, Pete would have to just have an issue with black people, and I don't think he does.
If this is about what Race was discussing the other day, different deal. You can (and should) recruit a few maniacs, and they come in all colors, shapes and sizes.
As I said in another thread, I don’t think Pete is racist. I don’t think OKG is racist. But perception is reality and the perception is clearly out there - first by local HS coaches, now by rival recruiters.
It doesn’t matter that it’s not grounded in truth, the perception is out there, and it’s probably the worst accusation that could come against a football program. It literally just cost us the best player to come out of our area in nineteen years. At least.
I’m not 100% sure how Pete fixes this but i am sure ignoring it and hoping it goes away is the wrong idea. Pete needs to empower the Shaq’s, John Ross’s, Myles Gaskins, Budda Bakers, Sidney Jones and Jordan Milers of the world to hit back against this A the fuck SAP.
Black people: “yeah I definitely see how OKG stuff could be construed as racist”
White people: “I don’t”
I think OKG is stupid, but isn't it itself racist to assume that OKG doesn't include black people, or somehow discriminates against them? Black dudes can be OKG much as white people. Otherwise, Pete would have to just have an issue with black people, and I don't think he does.
If this is about what Race was discussing the other day, different deal. You can (and should) recruit a few maniacs, and they come in all colors, shapes and sizes.
Fuck you for saying shit I actually agree with and have stated before.
And if a guy doesn't fit the locker room and the current players on the roster don't like him, than that's that. Some of you think it's all Petersen behind recruiting decisions but it's also about the players on the roster who are hosting recruits on their visits and have been empowered to report back to Petersen if they think a guy is or isn't a fit in the locker room. JT Daniels was not a fit after he visited. A guy like Josh Rosen would have never been signed by UW. Not a fit with the rest of the players. If a guy is not going to be able to get along with the players we already have, he's probably not going to be successful here and will end up transferring out anyways. We're better off identifying those kinds of guy beforehand and not signing them in the first place. #TEAMOKG
Now, if we could just combine the OKG/BFL philosophy with FUN and EXCITEMENT that resonates beyond the program out to fans and recruits...we'd really be onto to something.
Imagine Washington's offense with JRoss & Company and Rosen throwing the ball instead of the Cobra.
Over the years, I've been aware of a lot of players at Washington who weren't frat bros with the rest of the team.
A certain Pro Bowl center for the Chicago Bears comes immediately to mind. There have been plenty of others.
Comments
Smalls, Rodgers, Scott, Phillips, Flowe, Ricks, DJ Johnson, Treshaun, Jeremiah Martin, etc are saying they have a problem with our recruiting or program.
Maybe we should hear that and adapt.
But what others are trying to point out is that perception alone isn't proof that racism exists. And if there is no proof that it exists, then we should assume it doesn't. So where are we supposed to go from there?
Now, if we could just combine the OKG/BFL philosophy with FUN and EXCITEMENT that resonates beyond the program out to fans and recruits...we'd really be onto to something.
A policy or procedure can be racist even if not intentionally so if it has a disparate impact.
I understand what you're saying here in broad terms, but it does not apply to this OKG thing. Racist is inherently negative and carries intent with it. Furthermore, we're not talking crack cocaine sentencing here. These are are football scholarships, accompanied by expectations, offered voluntarily to recruits for voluntary acceptance. If you can show some egregious imbalance in offers to black athletes, maybe racist comes into play. I doubt it. So far, the only numbers are of who's on the roster.
The rest I agree with.
Petersen is not going to change his fundamental principles on the OKG thing. If you want OKG gone, Petersen must go first. Dennis knows this. Dennis also has said how beneficial the Built for Life program/values can be for young men no matter color, background, etc. Adaptation then is a matter of communication, speaker->message->receiver, focusing on the message. The speaker and his principles are not going to change, the receivers (baller ass recruits) probably not going to change, then it must be the messaging. Dennis, et al, have shown repetedly (lol) the public messaging has failed. I suspect Petersen feels that any change in messaging betrays his fundamentals. I disagree with that.
But I'm (partially) white so you can ignore this opinion if you like.
If this is about what Race was discussing the other day, different deal. You can (and should) recruit a few maniacs, and they come in all colors, shapes and sizes.
It doesn’t matter that it’s not grounded in truth, the perception is out there, and it’s probably the worst accusation that could come against a football program. It literally just cost us the best player to come out of our area in nineteen years. At least.
I’m not 100% sure how Pete fixes this but i am sure ignoring it and hoping it goes away is the wrong idea. Pete needs to empower the Shaq’s, John Ross’s, Myles Gaskins, Budda Bakers, Sidney Jones and Jordan Milers of the world to hit back against this A the fuck SAP.
You idiots are perpetuating a false narrative and doing damage to your own team. Just stop.
Stan was more feared than any opponent or coach. I'm not sure if Michael led in exactly that way, I saw him more as get on my back we got these fuckers beat. We're better than them
Current UW and most teams since most teams are losers go into a game wondering if they can win - like out post season games. By the time they realize they can its too late. They lost
Over the years, I've been aware of a lot of players at Washington who weren't frat bros with the rest of the team.
A certain Pro Bowl center for the Chicago Bears comes immediately to mind. There have been plenty of others.
#nobodyeverlikedWarrenSapp