Wichita St and the NCAA Tournament
Comments
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Bo Ryan has been to the dance 13 straight years and has made it past the sweet 16 once, he's basically the mark few of the big ten. On certain nights creighton has looked elite, like both games against nova. At the same time they've lost to the likes of SJU, Providence, George Washington, etc. I don't love either team
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I realize that, but Oklahoma State isn't good and it's not like they have a history of doing anything in March either.dhdawg said:
actually it isn't, Few in March? please. It's 90-10 Okie StateRoadDawg55 said:
I wish we could bet on that. Oklahoma State was overrated at the beginning of the year because of Smart. 50-50 that Oklahoma State beats Gonzaga.CuntWaffle said:Oklahoma State will beat Arizona.
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I thought Tequilla reached the douche pinnacle by saying "Okie Lite". But then he said "McBuckets" and soared to new heights.
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APAG,
Let me give you a bit of a perspective on Okie Lite because I understand where you're coming from. Living in the Southwest, every school has some bastardized nickname that gets thrown around from fan base to fan base. Examples being TAMU calling Texas the "t(ea) sippers," Texas Tech getting crap for their tortilla slinging, and Oklahoma St being called Okie Lite because they do everything they can to be Oklahoma but they never are quite as good as them at anything.
Regarding "McBuckets," I'm not sure what's so douchy about that one. Unfortunately everybody is saying that right now ... which sucks. It's a pretty good nickname for him given his name. It's far better than something like "Dougie Fresh." -
50/50? You mean 50 points? Gonzaga plays three guards who are under 6 Ft, one who couldn't have started on my high school team.RoadDawg55 said:
I wish we could bet on that. Oklahoma State was overrated at the beginning of the year because of Smart. 50-50 that Oklahoma State beats Gonzaga.CuntWaffle said:Oklahoma State will beat Arizona.
The good news is Few said "Some people are really screwed up frankly. It's way harder to win the WCC than to win 2 or even 3 games in the NCAA tourney."
Factcheck: Few has NEVER won three games in the NCAA tourney, and hasn't won 2 in a looonnnggg time.
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This thread is getting kind of doogish.Gary Bell and Kevin Pangos are pretty good. The freshman one looks like he will be good too. The only one who sucks is Stockton.mobey said:
50/50? You mean 50 points? Gonzaga plays three guards who are under 6 Ft, one who couldn't have started on my high school team.RoadDawg55 said:
I wish we could bet on that. Oklahoma State was overrated at the beginning of the year because of Smart. 50-50 that Oklahoma State beats Gonzaga.CuntWaffle said:Oklahoma State will beat Arizona.
The good news is Few said "Some people are really screwed up frankly. It's way harder to win the WCC than to win 2 or even 3 games in the NCAA tourney."
Factcheck: Few has NEVER won three games in the NCAA tourney, and hasn't won 2 in a looonnnggg time.
I get that Gonzaga hasn't done well in the tourney, but OK State isn't good. It's not like Few has never won a game in the tournament. The will get plungered by Arizona in round 2, but they can beat OK State.
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Disagree. They got by far the best 8 seed (4 seed on metrics) in UK, the best 3 seed in Duke and the best team my metrics in the country in Louisville as a 4. We all remember what happens when you have to face an underseeded Ville in the S16. Wichita State is a legit #1, obviously much better than that UW 1 seed was, but this Louisville team is also better than the one UW faced.Tequilla said:I love all the people whining and crying about the "draw" that Wichita State has to get to the Final Four.
People talk about Kentucky ... a Kentucky team that has lost 10 games playing in a dreckfest of a conference in the SEC that has 2.5 teams in the NCAA Tournament. The same Kentucky team that is being said to be "hitting their stride" yet has lost 4 of their last 7? Apparently moral losses against a Florida team that everybody says is great that I'm still not 100% sold on them being anything more than a talented but somewhat hot/cold offensive team that is viewed as being a great defensive team because of the competition that they've played in the SEC. Kansas St is at least as talented as Kentucky (from what they've shown - although certainly Kentucky probably has a higher ceiling if they both play their best) yet everybody thinks it's a given that Kentucky will just waltz on through that game?
Then everybody talks about how great Louisville is but that conference they play in is full of teams that are either decent with limited offensive ability or just downright terrible. It's definitely not the same team that they were last year when they won a national title ... even though everybody would make you want to think that they are.
Michigan is probably the weakest 2 seed along with Villanova. And Duke's shown time after time this year that they are great as long as you don't hit them in the mouth but they definitely aren't physical.
Not saying that Wichita State's path is easy ... but people making it out to be the hardest path in the world might as well just say that they don't think that their record is for real and that their team is talented. Something tells me that since Gregg Marshall is a good coach (hello Kim Jong Vino) that he'll make sure that he has his team properly motivated and fully aware that most people don't think that they are worth a damn.
It's by far the TUFFest draw of any 1 seed I've seen in a long time.
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Kentucky has talent ... but it really hasn't played that well at all all year. They were sloppy in a very piss poor SEC. If they play their best game, I'd agree that Wichita State will be in a dogfight. But I find it hard to believe that Kentucky will play a game like that and not just get carved up by a far more disciplined team that gives consistent effort every game.
I get that the metrics provide that Louisville is great. I just don't buy it. They aren't anywhere close to as good as they were last year and in all honesty, a lot of their metrics were built up playing teams that didn't belong on the court with them.
It's not that I discredit Duke or Michigan ... I just personally think that they don't matchup well and in particular Duke. Duke is a team that has a ton of young guys that don't react well when they get hit in the mouth. Wichita State hits you in the mouth. And in my opinion, Michigan has outperformed their talent all year. They aren't a particularly strong 2 seed.
I get that it's a tough bracket. But the team that can beat Wichita State would be Louisville. Everybody else in my opinion is people suggesting that Wichita State isn't that good because of the conference they play in (big conference >>> little conference card). They are solid. And as you mentioned, a legit #1 seed. They are easily one of the top teams in the country.
In my bracket, I have them losing in the title game to Michigan State - who is the most talented team in the country. -
Arizona doesnt get past Oregon. Sorry to burst everyones bubble
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Look I don't trust Sean Miller. But watching SDSU, and NDSU play they practically have a walk to the elite eight. I think there's some validity to what phineas says, Oregon is hot, and I picked them to go to the elite eight, mostly because it's impossible to trust a Bo Ryan team in March, and I'm not a huge creighton fan.
If Arizona meets oregon there is no way Oregon beats them on a neutral site.
Arizona has by far the softest region -
Gonzaga is the basketball version of Oregon to Doogs. Even you guys went full doog over them. I mentioned it earlier, but didn't realize how bad it was until I looked some things up. Gonzaga hasn't lost their first tournament game since 2008 to Davidson.
But they can't beat Oklahoma State. What a powerhouse Oklahoma State is. Oklahoma State's run to the second round in 2009 was special. Good teams have 7 game losing streaks during conference play. Small, little Gonzaga from the shitty conference never does anything in the tournament and has no chance. I'm hearing Gonzaga has three 6'0" guards that couldn't start on some high school teams.
Disclaimer: I have hated Gonzaga ever since Dan Dickau and Casey Calvery graduated. They have a good program though, despite choking a time or two (Adam Morrison years, last year) in the tournament. -
Doogs hate GU, but that doesn't mean the Zags rep is wrong.RoadDawg55 said:Gonzaga is the basketball version of Oregon to Doogs. Even you guys went full doog over them. I mentioned it earlier, but didn't realize how bad it was until I looked some things up. Gonzaga hasn't lost their first tournament game since 2008 to Davidson.
But they can't beat Oklahoma State. What a powerhouse Oklahoma State is. Oklahoma State's run to the second round in 2009 was special. Good teams have 7 game losing streaks during conference play. Small, little Gonzaga from the shitty conference never does anything in the tournament and has no chance. I'm hearing Gonzaga has three 6'0" guards that couldn't start on some high school teams.
Disclaimer: I have hated Gonzaga ever since Dan Dickau and Casey Calvery graduated. They have a good program though, despite choking a time or two (Adam Morrison years, last year) in the tournament.
They've made it past the round of 32 just twice since 2001 (and never past the S16). That's two Sweet 16s in their last 12 tournaments. They have a losing record in the NCAAs (11-12) in that time period.
Lorenzo Romar, who we all agree sucks, has made it past the round of 32 three times in that time period. Few's tournament winning percentage is 51.7. Romar's is 57.1. Anytime you come up poorly in a comparison to Lorenzo Romar, you're doing something wrong.
This despite GU being in the tournament every single year and often being seeded well - they've failed to reach the Sweet 16 as a 1 (2013), 3 (2005), and a 2 (2004).
Yes, they should beat OK State, but there is a decent chance they won't. Mark Few is as underachieving of a tournament coach as there is anywhere in America. -
I still don't understand this thread, but I learned about McBuckets, so it's cool.
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THIS.dnc said:
Doogs hate GU, but that doesn't mean the Zags rep is wrong.RoadDawg55 said:Gonzaga is the basketball version of Oregon to Doogs. Even you guys went full doog over them. I mentioned it earlier, but didn't realize how bad it was until I looked some things up. Gonzaga hasn't lost their first tournament game since 2008 to Davidson.
But they can't beat Oklahoma State. What a powerhouse Oklahoma State is. Oklahoma State's run to the second round in 2009 was special. Good teams have 7 game losing streaks during conference play. Small, little Gonzaga from the shitty conference never does anything in the tournament and has no chance. I'm hearing Gonzaga has three 6'0" guards that couldn't start on some high school teams.
Disclaimer: I have hated Gonzaga ever since Dan Dickau and Casey Calvery graduated. They have a good program though, despite choking a time or two (Adam Morrison years, last year) in the tournament.
They've made it past the round of 32 just twice since 2001 (and never past the S16). That's two Sweet 16s in their last 12 tournaments. They have a losing record in the NCAAs (11-12) in that time period.
Lorenzo Romar, who we all agree sucks, has made it past the round of 32 three times in that time period. Few's tournament winning percentage is 51.7. Romar's is 57.1. Anytime you come up poorly in a comparison to Lorenzo Romar, you're doing something wrong.
This despite GU being in the tournament every single year and often being seeded well - they've failed to reach the Sweet 16 as a 1 (2013), 3 (2005), and a 2 (2004).
Yes, they should beat OK State, but there is a decent chance they won't. Mark Few is as underachieving of a tournament coach as there is anywhere in America.
The magical elite 8 run was made by Monson not Few which most Doogs/Zoogs(?) probably don't realize.
Since 2001 they have lived off that Cinderella rep despite mostly choking in the tournament. We've seen Butler, VCU, Witchita State and George Mason make much more impressive runs than them even.
They've earned their rep as choke artists and it's been since Clinton was in office the last time they pulled off a major upset in March. -
@dnc I agree with your post, but saying they can't beat Ok State and saying they have 3 guards that can't start on a high school team is a doog statement. I guess it doesn't really matter. Whoever wins will lose to Arizona in the next round.
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Road was right, and I don't even think the zags are that good. OSU is now 3-11 from the line and never do anything but shoot from the perimeter. If you want an example of what attacking can do for a team watch Arizona state last night. Even though they lost driving got them to the line and opened up easy buckets for bachybski and gilling. Fuck Kansas got outscored 30-0 from the e point line today and still won by doue digits. I hate perimeter shooting teams
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You can shoot from the perimeter and be successful ... but you HAVE to get into the lane one way or another.
There's good 3 point shots and bad 3 point shots ... teams that can't get into the lane will end up shooting a ton of bad 3's. -
Yep, and Oklahoma state takes bad 3's, especially forte, out of rhythm off the dribble, early in clock 3's, terrible
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Gonzaga isn't that good. It's just that Oklahoma State sucks. Smart is easily the most overrated player in the country and their coach is terrible.
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Smart drifts a lot ... he rarely plays a consistent 40 minutes.
When I watched them in Vegas ... it was very clear watching them how much he drifts. When he wants to play, he's almost impossible to stop.
He's also a fucking idiot. -
15 points, 8 rebounds, 6 assists and 6 steals. He has glaring flaws but he can play.RoadDawg55 said:Gonzaga isn't that good. It's just that Oklahoma State sucks. Smart is easily the most overrated player in the country and their coach is terrible.
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Didn't even watch today. I've seen him play quite a few times though and have never been impressed.allpurpleallgold said:
15 points, 8 rebounds, 6 assists and 6 steals. He has glaring flaws but he can play.RoadDawg55 said:Gonzaga isn't that good. It's just that Oklahoma State sucks. Smart is easily the most overrated player in the country and their coach is terrible.
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I swear watching that whole game I thought I was watching a romar team, had superior athletes but fouled a ton, took bad shots and was dogshif from the line. Travis ford is now 1-5 in the dance
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Surprised Road Dawg didn't come into this thread just to beat his chest. Guess he's going to last long.........
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I only said it was 50-50 and it was stupid that everyone counted Gonzaga out. I had watched Oklahoma State a few times and knew that they sucked. Looks like you need to learn the difference. I was just calling out the dooginess of the Gonzaga hate. Few has underachieved many times in the tournament, but this is the 6th year in a row he has won his first game.He_Needs_More_Time said:Surprised Road Dawg didn't come into this thread just to beat his chest. Guess he's going to last long.........
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I hate Few ... don't hate Gonzaga. If they had a non-douchebag coach there, I'd probably actually root for them. In general, I like how they play.
I'm surprised they won just simply because of the fact that they are so unathletic in a comparative sense. But then again, Oklahoma State generally doesn't disappoint if you bet on them to be a bunch of idiots. -
Thought the exact same thing.dhdawg said:I swear watching that whole game I thought I was watching a romar team, had superior athletes but fouled a ton, took bad shots and was dogshif from the line. Travis ford is now 1-5 in the dance
Clueless on how to take advantage, AT LEAST OFFENSIVELY, of three small unathletic guards. When Dayton beat GU earlier this year they simply cleared out and butchered their guards.
Not that difficult.
I've always said Few can come up with a game plan but is terrible in game when it's not working. Ro is bad at game planning and terrible in game both. Ford is similar to Ro before Ro gave up.
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Thoughts on Andrew Wiggins in the NBA? Dude completely disappeared against Stanford and only took 6 shots. He is soft and seems like a #2 scoring option in the NBA, not someone you run the offense through.
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I think he will be pretty good. He was averaging 28 in the 4 games before this one. He doesn't dominate yet like you would want, but his game is effortless so I think it translates well to the NBA.SteveInShelton said:Thoughts on Andrew Wiggins in the NBA? Dude completely disappeared against Stanford and only took 6 shots. He is soft and seems like a #2 scoring option in the NBA, not someone you run the offense through.
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It really sucks that they lost. And it had to be to Cali tucking pari
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