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Academis questions for Creep
Comments
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Same - but these threads depress me on all the schools I was accepted to back when I was young, impressionable and didn't care much beyond hot sorority girls and kegs as a school choice criteria.Swaye said:
I showed up at the UW and stayed drunk for 4 years. Figured it all out later. Worked for me!creepycoug said:Agree with @FireCohen and @Pitchfork51 ... I would have been nervous if any of my kids were ballz to the wall sure they wanted to do "X" at 18 and then got into some narrow educational pursuit for it.
One of the many reasons I'm a classic well-rounded education at undergrad guy. Travel light, keep your options open, get a good education that will enable you to move in a multitude of directions, and focus on it more toward the end of your undergrad rather than the beginning.
This, of course, assumes you have a safety net. If you need to be making dollars day 1 after graduation, we have to have a different conversation.
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I went to college with the "plan" to be a Wall Street wiz, when my real plan was to get laid, get drunk, and play baseball. I had no idea what I wanted to study, or even if I wanted to study. I got a degree in a field I never worked a day in, and went to grad school for what I wanted to do, once I figured it out.
What I got from my BA is general knowledge, life skills, and a track record after the fact, of the "system", how it functions, and how to function within it. I was able to do it with average grades, average effort, and great test scores. My grad advisor couldn't believe how much better my grades were in grad school, compared to undergrad. I found something I was passionate about.
One daughter got a BS in Anthro, and got a MA in a completely different field, which she now works in. The other one is in grad school right now, after struggling to get traction with a BA. I told them both to find something they are passionate about, and follow it.
There are a lot of people walking around that have degrees in something they thought they wanted to do at one time, and are now locked into jobs they hate. My goal was to not be that guy. -
I went to college to row, get drunk, go to Husky games and fornicate. Going to class was an afterthought. Still graduated in 4 years. Thank you AP credits !!!Fishpo31 said:I went to college with the "plan" to be a Wall Street wiz, when my real plan was to get laid, get drunk, and play baseball. I had no idea what I wanted to study, or even if I wanted to study. I got a degree in a field I never worked a day in, and went to grad school for what I wanted to do, once I figured it out.
What I got from my BA is general knowledge, life skills, and a track record after the fact, of the "system", how it functions, and how to function within it. I was able to do it with average grades, average effort, and great test scores. My grad advisor couldn't believe how much better my grades were in grad school, compared to undergrad. I found something I was passionate about.
One daughter got a BS in Anthro, and got a MA in a completely different field, which she now works in. The other one is in grad school right now, after struggling to get traction with a BA. I told them both to find something they are passionate about, and follow it.
There are a lot of people walking around that have degrees in something they thought they wanted to do at one time, and are now locked into jobs they hate. My goal was to not be that guy. -
I hated college but loved crushing college grads in business. If I was in a nasty mood I let them know they lost to Oly High
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RaceBannon said:
I hated college but loved crushing college grads in business. If I was in a nasty mood I let them know they lost to Oly High
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@Fishpo31 , great post. I've always struggled to come up with a succinct way of articulating why you want a good, solid, and broad foundation at the undergrad level. And, to be clear, that also means some exposure to STEM. Whether you take a biology, genetics (I took the intro course at UW), maff, Stats (everybody should have some exposure to stats), etc.Fishpo31 said:I went to college with the "plan" to be a Wall Street wiz, when my real plan was to get laid, get drunk, and play baseball. I had no idea what I wanted to study, or even if I wanted to study. I got a degree in a field I never worked a day in, and went to grad school for what I wanted to do, once I figured it out.
What I got from my BA is general knowledge, life skills, and a track record after the fact, of the "system", how it functions, and how to function within it. I was able to do it with average grades, average effort, and great test scores. My grad advisor couldn't believe how much better my grades were in grad school, compared to undergrad. I found something I was passionate about.
One daughter got a BS in Anthro, and got a MA in a completely different field, which she now works in. The other one is in grad school right now, after struggling to get traction with a BA. I told them both to find something they are passionate about, and follow it.
There are a lot of people walking around that have degrees in something they thought they wanted to do at one time, and are now locked into jobs they hate. My goal was to not be that guy.
Anyway, your post captures it perfectly. -
Take it to the Flooring Empire board old man!RaceBannon said:I hated college but loved crushing college grads in business. If I was in a nasty mood I let them know they lost to Oly High
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I’m gonna need new floors soon.creepycoug said:
Take it to the Flooring Empire board old man!RaceBannon said:I hated college but loved crushing college grads in business. If I was in a nasty mood I let them know they lost to Oly High
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An Empire is an Empire
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@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
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I love math now. Have since I had to use it in business
Turns out I'm kind of an idiot savant.
At least half -
Is it Inland?RaceBannon said:An Empire is an Empire
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I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people. -
If he built the one on Aitutaki, it’s still holding up.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
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It blows my mind how adept (good) construction/trade guys are at math. I deal with numbers all day long but I don't remember/can't calculate shit without my spreadsheet. That's because I only have a certain amount of brain cells and I don't want to store shit in there that I know I can offload elsewhere.RaceBannon said:I love math now. Have since I had to use it in business
Turns out I'm kind of an idiot savant.
At least half
But, damn, those guys remember and can slice and dice dimensions like motherfuckers. -
Como se dice philosopher king en espanol?creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people. -
I'm not gonna lie I'm really enjoying the creep board. Its good stuff. I like hearing about you guys and all this crap.
Much better than the tug -
Its really interesting to me that the IT field is almost entirely dudes yet I believe the amount of women in the sciences hasn't actually changed. They just go into medicine.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people.
I cant really think of any real reason it should be guys over girls in the tech stuff. Uncle Bob's talk on the future of programming was interesting because apparently until the mid to late 80s it was about 50 50 -
Thanks for the feedback. Appreciate your support.Pitchfork51 said:I'm not gonna lie I'm really enjoying the creep board. Its good stuff. I like hearing about you guys and all this crap.
Much better than the tug -
The number of women engineers and scientists is growing by leaps and bounds. As for programmers and other IT workers, there’s definitely a lag, but they’ll get there. Many of the lady IT people I know hail from Asia (India, China). I think US women will eventually catch up too, but it will be a little longer.Pitchfork51 said:
Its really interesting to me that the IT field is almost entirely dudes yet I believe the amount of women in the sciences hasn't actually changed. They just go into medicine.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people.
I cant really think of any real reason it should be guys over girls in the tech stuff. Uncle Bob's talk on the future of programming was interesting because apparently until the mid to late 80s it was about 50 50
@creepycoug is right, I lost my love for math and comp sci freshman year of high school, for all the reasons he listed. (Remember, the internet was just getting off the ground at this point.) It wasn’t until my senior year that I took statistics that I got a teacher that was supportive and never spoke to me in a condescending manner. My senior project received the highest grade in the class. But by then the damage had been done and even though my SAT scores in math were high I had already told myself a STEM major wasn’t for me. -
Yeah it's strange because in like a high school math class or something the girls did just as well or better than the boys. And yet it's entirely dominated by men.Doog_de_Jour said:
The number of women engineers and scientists is growing by leaps and bounds. As for programmers and other IT workers, there’s definitely a lag, but they’ll get there. Many of the lady IT people I know hail from Asia (India, China). I think US women will eventually catch up too, but it will be a little longer.Pitchfork51 said:
Its really interesting to me that the IT field is almost entirely dudes yet I believe the amount of women in the sciences hasn't actually changed. They just go into medicine.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people.
I cant really think of any real reason it should be guys over girls in the tech stuff. Uncle Bob's talk on the future of programming was interesting because apparently until the mid to late 80s it was about 50 50
@creepycoug is right, I lost my love for math and comp sci freshman year of high school, for all the reasons he listed. (Remember, the internet was just getting off the ground at this point.) It wasn’t until my senior year that I took statistics that I got a teacher that was supportive and never spoke to me in a condescending manner. My senior project received the highest grade in the class. But by then the damage had been done and even though my SAT scores in math were high I had already told myself a STEM major wasn’t for me.
I'm thinking it has to change. How can it not? -
Maff died for me in like the 7th grade. Algebra was hard and my dad was a slacker frat boy who didn’t push us. Now, history on the hand, is some fascinating shit that can really pay dividends down the road. Lulz.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people. -
More focus needs to be done on those studies I mentioned. You have to get girls in middle school or they're gone for good. I don't know if they internalize the set backs more than the boys, but for whatever reason, once they make that decision in their minds they rarely recover.Pitchfork51 said:
Yeah it's strange because in like a high school math class or something the girls did just as well or better than the boys. And yet it's entirely dominated by men.Doog_de_Jour said:
The number of women engineers and scientists is growing by leaps and bounds. As for programmers and other IT workers, there’s definitely a lag, but they’ll get there. Many of the lady IT people I know hail from Asia (India, China). I think US women will eventually catch up too, but it will be a little longer.Pitchfork51 said:
Its really interesting to me that the IT field is almost entirely dudes yet I believe the amount of women in the sciences hasn't actually changed. They just go into medicine.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people.
I cant really think of any real reason it should be guys over girls in the tech stuff. Uncle Bob's talk on the future of programming was interesting because apparently until the mid to late 80s it was about 50 50
@creepycoug is right, I lost my love for math and comp sci freshman year of high school, for all the reasons he listed. (Remember, the internet was just getting off the ground at this point.) It wasn’t until my senior year that I took statistics that I got a teacher that was supportive and never spoke to me in a condescending manner. My senior project received the highest grade in the class. But by then the damage had been done and even though my SAT scores in math were high I had already told myself a STEM major wasn’t for me.
I'm thinking it has to change. How can it not?
Boys do much better fucking it up and then deciding to get back to it, pay the price to catch up, and get back on track in high school. Girls just don't. And they've really narrowed it down to that one year: 8th grade. Not 7th or 9th ... 8th grade. That's where we lose them. -
I'm just thinking out loud. I hired my 3rd dude under me today and I'd take our accounts receivable manager chick over probably any of the dudes I've hired. Not that they are bad just that she's sharp and if she just spent maybe three months learning some of this stuff shed take my job for sure.creepycoug said:
More focus needs to be done on those studies I mentioned. You have to get girls in middle school or they're gone for good. I don't know if they internalize the set backs more than the boys, but for whatever reason, once they make that decision in their minds they rarely recover.Pitchfork51 said:
Yeah it's strange because in like a high school math class or something the girls did just as well or better than the boys. And yet it's entirely dominated by men.Doog_de_Jour said:
The number of women engineers and scientists is growing by leaps and bounds. As for programmers and other IT workers, there’s definitely a lag, but they’ll get there. Many of the lady IT people I know hail from Asia (India, China). I think US women will eventually catch up too, but it will be a little longer.Pitchfork51 said:
Its really interesting to me that the IT field is almost entirely dudes yet I believe the amount of women in the sciences hasn't actually changed. They just go into medicine.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people.
I cant really think of any real reason it should be guys over girls in the tech stuff. Uncle Bob's talk on the future of programming was interesting because apparently until the mid to late 80s it was about 50 50
@creepycoug is right, I lost my love for math and comp sci freshman year of high school, for all the reasons he listed. (Remember, the internet was just getting off the ground at this point.) It wasn’t until my senior year that I took statistics that I got a teacher that was supportive and never spoke to me in a condescending manner. My senior project received the highest grade in the class. But by then the damage had been done and even though my SAT scores in math were high I had already told myself a STEM major wasn’t for me.
I'm thinking it has to change. How can it not?
Boys do much better fucking it up and then deciding to get back to it, pay the price to catch up, and get back on track in high school. Girls just don't. And they're really narrowed it down to that one year: 8th grade. Not 7th or 9th ... 8th grade. That's where we lose them.
And by that I mean I'd feel super comfortable her being able to learn and actually make people do things that makes the company money.
The it thing for me is weird. I was a pro sales rep and then had my own thing (failed) then I do and love doing this. But I think these people have no concept of business value so I do my best to teach them. -
Thinking out loud again I would highly recommend people to start a side hustle, incorporate it, etc.
Not even that you make a lot off of it but it totally changes your perspective on why for example your ceo might be cheap about stuff.
Because once you have skin in the game and it's coming out of your pocket the whole game changes.
As far as I'm concerned I have to sell shit on why I think this project or this project is valuable and why he should pay people to do it as far as I sold shit back in the day. Because I'm buds with the guy and I realize it comes directly out of his pocket and I get it. -
I hear you. I have someone on my team like that now. I had another one a few years back ... we all used to joke that none of us wanted to take and IQ test with her and compare scores because we were pretty sure she'd eat us up. She was just a rock star and made me look good way beyond reality. She was also a handful of credits shy from her BA from UC Santa Cruz, deferred to me like I lived on Mt. Olympus and generally just didn't have high expectations. I suppose she was just happy doing what she was doing; but it was plain to see that she was leaving a lot of horsepower on the table. I asked her once why she just didn't knock out a class or two at Seattle U or UW and get the UC Santa Cruz BA and go to fucking law school and get paid. She would just say "I don't know," and all of her confidence would just fade.Pitchfork51 said:
I'm just thinking out loud. I hired my 3rd dude under me today and I'd take our accounts receivable manager chick over probably any of the dudes I've hired. Not that they are bad just that she's sharp and if she just spent maybe three months learning some of this stuff shed take my job for sure.creepycoug said:
More focus needs to be done on those studies I mentioned. You have to get girls in middle school or they're gone for good. I don't know if they internalize the set backs more than the boys, but for whatever reason, once they make that decision in their minds they rarely recover.Pitchfork51 said:
Yeah it's strange because in like a high school math class or something the girls did just as well or better than the boys. And yet it's entirely dominated by men.Doog_de_Jour said:
The number of women engineers and scientists is growing by leaps and bounds. As for programmers and other IT workers, there’s definitely a lag, but they’ll get there. Many of the lady IT people I know hail from Asia (India, China). I think US women will eventually catch up too, but it will be a little longer.Pitchfork51 said:
Its really interesting to me that the IT field is almost entirely dudes yet I believe the amount of women in the sciences hasn't actually changed. They just go into medicine.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people.
I cant really think of any real reason it should be guys over girls in the tech stuff. Uncle Bob's talk on the future of programming was interesting because apparently until the mid to late 80s it was about 50 50
@creepycoug is right, I lost my love for math and comp sci freshman year of high school, for all the reasons he listed. (Remember, the internet was just getting off the ground at this point.) It wasn’t until my senior year that I took statistics that I got a teacher that was supportive and never spoke to me in a condescending manner. My senior project received the highest grade in the class. But by then the damage had been done and even though my SAT scores in math were high I had already told myself a STEM major wasn’t for me.
I'm thinking it has to change. How can it not?
Boys do much better fucking it up and then deciding to get back to it, pay the price to catch up, and get back on track in high school. Girls just don't. And they're really narrowed it down to that one year: 8th grade. Not 7th or 9th ... 8th grade. That's where we lose them.
Things like this are not as simple as they are discussed as being in the Tug. There's subtlety involved with people and what happened to them growing up. Gender is a big part of that. -
Lol I was thinking about that today because my go to move is to walk in the accounting area to answer something and then it's like "hey Steph what about this"creepycoug said:
I hear you. I have someone on my team like that now. I had another one a few years back ... we all used to joke that none of us wanted to take and IQ test with her and compare scores because we were pretty sure she'd eat us up. She was just a rock star and made me look good way beyond reality. She was also a handful of credits shy from her BA from UC Santa Cruz, deferred to me like I lived on Mt. Olympus and generally just didn't have high expectations. I suppose she was just happy doing what she was doing; but it was plain to see that she was leaving a lot of horsepower on the table. I asked her once why she just didn't knock out a class or two at Seattle U or UW and get the UC Santa Cruz BA and go to fucking law school and get paid. She would just say "I don't know," and all of her confidence would just fade.Pitchfork51 said:
I'm just thinking out loud. I hired my 3rd dude under me today and I'd take our accounts receivable manager chick over probably any of the dudes I've hired. Not that they are bad just that she's sharp and if she just spent maybe three months learning some of this stuff shed take my job for sure.creepycoug said:
More focus needs to be done on those studies I mentioned. You have to get girls in middle school or they're gone for good. I don't know if they internalize the set backs more than the boys, but for whatever reason, once they make that decision in their minds they rarely recover.Pitchfork51 said:
Yeah it's strange because in like a high school math class or something the girls did just as well or better than the boys. And yet it's entirely dominated by men.Doog_de_Jour said:
The number of women engineers and scientists is growing by leaps and bounds. As for programmers and other IT workers, there’s definitely a lag, but they’ll get there. Many of the lady IT people I know hail from Asia (India, China). I think US women will eventually catch up too, but it will be a little longer.Pitchfork51 said:
Its really interesting to me that the IT field is almost entirely dudes yet I believe the amount of women in the sciences hasn't actually changed. They just go into medicine.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people.
I cant really think of any real reason it should be guys over girls in the tech stuff. Uncle Bob's talk on the future of programming was interesting because apparently until the mid to late 80s it was about 50 50
@creepycoug is right, I lost my love for math and comp sci freshman year of high school, for all the reasons he listed. (Remember, the internet was just getting off the ground at this point.) It wasn’t until my senior year that I took statistics that I got a teacher that was supportive and never spoke to me in a condescending manner. My senior project received the highest grade in the class. But by then the damage had been done and even though my SAT scores in math were high I had already told myself a STEM major wasn’t for me.
I'm thinking it has to change. How can it not?
Boys do much better fucking it up and then deciding to get back to it, pay the price to catch up, and get back on track in high school. Girls just don't. And they're really narrowed it down to that one year: 8th grade. Not 7th or 9th ... 8th grade. That's where we lose them.
Things like this are not as simple as they are discussed as being in the Tug. There's subtlety involved with people and what happened to them growing up. Gender is a big part of that.
You just naturally gravitate to the people who get shit done.
And so my best bud is her boss and Im like bro. Keep giving her money but send her to school man. Literally anyone you ever get is just simply not going to be as good. -
I actually think the system that failed me is being slowly fixed now...I remember reading somewhere half of the degrees in science fields and engineering are being awarded to women (computer science is still way behind...I think it’s closer to 20% there). The next hurdle of getting these women hired, promoted, and retained is what needs to be cleared next.creepycoug said:
More focus needs to be done on those studies I mentioned. You have to get girls in middle school or they're gone for good. I don't know if they internalize the set backs more than the boys, but for whatever reason, once they make that decision in their minds they rarely recover.Pitchfork51 said:
Yeah it's strange because in like a high school math class or something the girls did just as well or better than the boys. And yet it's entirely dominated by men.Doog_de_Jour said:
The number of women engineers and scientists is growing by leaps and bounds. As for programmers and other IT workers, there’s definitely a lag, but they’ll get there. Many of the lady IT people I know hail from Asia (India, China). I think US women will eventually catch up too, but it will be a little longer.Pitchfork51 said:
Its really interesting to me that the IT field is almost entirely dudes yet I believe the amount of women in the sciences hasn't actually changed. They just go into medicine.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people.
I cant really think of any real reason it should be guys over girls in the tech stuff. Uncle Bob's talk on the future of programming was interesting because apparently until the mid to late 80s it was about 50 50
@creepycoug is right, I lost my love for math and comp sci freshman year of high school, for all the reasons he listed. (Remember, the internet was just getting off the ground at this point.) It wasn’t until my senior year that I took statistics that I got a teacher that was supportive and never spoke to me in a condescending manner. My senior project received the highest grade in the class. But by then the damage had been done and even though my SAT scores in math were high I had already told myself a STEM major wasn’t for me.
I'm thinking it has to change. How can it not?
Boys do much better fucking it up and then deciding to get back to it, pay the price to catch up, and get back on track in high school. Girls just don't. And they've really narrowed it down to that one year: 8th grade. Not 7th or 9th ... 8th grade. That's where we lose them. -
See when I did pro sales (at a good company with high level sales) they promoted and we're crazy about promoting women. Not in a bad way. I just think that in certain fields where you have to hire grinders sometimes women can get in the door better. It really depends on industry but it was about 80 percent really sharp girls.Doog_de_Jour said:
I actually think the system that failed me is being slowly fixed now...I remember reading somewhere half of the degrees in science fields and engineering are being awarded to women (computer science is still way behind...I think it’s closer to 20% there). The next hurdle of getting these women hired, promoted, and retained is what needs to happen next.creepycoug said:
More focus needs to be done on those studies I mentioned. You have to get girls in middle school or they're gone for good. I don't know if they internalize the set backs more than the boys, but for whatever reason, once they make that decision in their minds they rarely recover.Pitchfork51 said:
Yeah it's strange because in like a high school math class or something the girls did just as well or better than the boys. And yet it's entirely dominated by men.Doog_de_Jour said:
The number of women engineers and scientists is growing by leaps and bounds. As for programmers and other IT workers, there’s definitely a lag, but they’ll get there. Many of the lady IT people I know hail from Asia (India, China). I think US women will eventually catch up too, but it will be a little longer.Pitchfork51 said:
Its really interesting to me that the IT field is almost entirely dudes yet I believe the amount of women in the sciences hasn't actually changed. They just go into medicine.creepycoug said:
I think a lot of kids run away from math around the time of middle school, because that's the time during which the serious kids hunker down and start doing the harder stuff, and incidentally that's the time when the public schools start offering different math tracks. So if you're like 75% of 13 to 15 year olds, you don't want to bust your ass doing hard math, so you leave it and, for most, never come back to it.Fishpo31 said:
@creepycoug I hated math/science (my Pops was an engineer and math wiz with 1 semester of college, but got his education building landing strips in the South Pacific during WWII). When I got to grad school, (at age 24), I ate it up. There is no way I could have gone thru a math / science curriculum as an 18 year old...I wasn't mature enough to handle it.
They have done studies that show that girls who mentally check out of math almost always do so in the 8th grade, and they never come back. Tragic. That has so much to do with caring about what boys think of them, not wanting to show them up in class, and dealing with asshole teachers. Private school has an edge here; because you're going to achieve some level of math curriculum or you're not graduating. There's no "math for _________" at a real college prep school. Public school is different.
The point of this is that there are a lot of people with innate talent for mathematics who, because of various life circumstances, aren't ready to be married to it at 12 or 13, and as soon as they make that decision, their fate is sealed. I would venture to say this happens to a whole bunch of people.
I cant really think of any real reason it should be guys over girls in the tech stuff. Uncle Bob's talk on the future of programming was interesting because apparently until the mid to late 80s it was about 50 50
@creepycoug is right, I lost my love for math and comp sci freshman year of high school, for all the reasons he listed. (Remember, the internet was just getting off the ground at this point.) It wasn’t until my senior year that I took statistics that I got a teacher that was supportive and never spoke to me in a condescending manner. My senior project received the highest grade in the class. But by then the damage had been done and even though my SAT scores in math were high I had already told myself a STEM major wasn’t for me.
I'm thinking it has to change. How can it not?
Boys do much better fucking it up and then deciding to get back to it, pay the price to catch up, and get back on track in high school. Girls just don't. And they've really narrowed it down to that one year: 8th grade. Not 7th or 9th ... 8th grade. That's where we lose them. -
Although I'm not gonna lie and I know this sounds bad. But I'll never work for a woman.
My boss lost 30 lbs and got veneers and all I wanted to do was get down. It was bad.
