Remember now, Charter Schools are failures
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I'd pay up to 150% of what I'm currently paying in taxes, just to have schools that worked and had accountability. Apparently, so would most people.Sledog said:Charter school here in CDA has top numbers and does it with less money. Sounds like a win.
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Here's the system Kobe wants to maintain:
Here is what the Oakland Tribune had to say in 2003 around the performance of students in OUSD, during the early charter years, compared to the most recent data found in the current OUSD LCAP.
Thousands of Oakland high school students and parents celebrated graduation this month. But 75 percent of the ninth-graders on the books in 1998 had nothing to celebrate on graduation day four years later, according to new school district records released to The Oakland Tribune…
The district’s new records show Oakland almost totally failed to graduate students with the credits they need to get into state universities or University of California schools. Only 7 percent of the freshmen who started school in 1998 graduated four years later with the classes they need on their transcripts to get into state or UC schools. For African-American students, that percentage shrinks to less than 3 percent… That means fewer than three out of every 100 black freshmen graduated on time from city schools with enough credits to get into college. The numbers are even lower for black male students.
The Good Old Days-1.7% UC/CSU eligibility for Black males, .5% eligibility for Latino males, a 1% reclassification rate -
Kobe thinks that the growth in Charter schools is because white racists don't want to pay for public schools, when the reality is that Charter schools were a response to just how fucking worthless and awful the public schools really are.TurdBomber said:
I'd pay up to 150% of what I'm currently paying in taxes, just to have schools that worked and had accountability. Apparently, so would most people.Sledog said:Charter school here in CDA has top numbers and does it with less money. Sounds like a win.
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I lived most of my adult live in an area with good public schools so charter was never an issue, and I now live in an area with some great and some 'just ok' pubic schools that my kids don't attend. It's not my battle anymore, and I don't mind paying property taxes to help public education.TheKobeStopper said:
These things don’t exist in a vacuum, a million kids have had charter schools they’re attending fail.creepycoug said:
The point is choice. If there is a good public school - and there are good public schools just to take that off the table - nearby, then that school's funding is probably not going to suffer and that charter school probably will choose to site somewhere else.TheKobeStopper said:So you guys are cool with schools closing? I got a different impression as you were using kids to score political points during the pandemic.
I view is as alternative of offering help where it's needed. If it's not needed, then it's not needed. But where they are, they're subscribed, and for a reason.
I see no reason to spare any type of school that is mailing it in, be it public or private. If a good charter school sucks funding from a shit-performing public, that's the market at work and a good result. Let the public school get its shit together and compete.
We're not talking about creating mini Exeters or Choates here with public subsidy. We're talking about incompetency to competency. Just offering a shot at a decent education. Not an elite one.
If the charter school fails, then it fails.
This isn’t about creating a choice, it’s a jerk off session for privatization. And the kids, who’s parents get tricked into the scam, are the victims. That’s why the big crocodile tears for the current school closures is, in fact, the point.
But hey, maybe your property taxes will go down and it’ll all be worth it.
But in many parts of the country, what would qualify as a shit-tier public HS (say, Foss or Rainier Beach) would be viewed as a great alternative to the prevailing shit-hole options. I can't for the life of me understand why you would not want there to be an option ... an "out" ... for people who can't afford full-pay private tuition. I view it as the functional equivalent of creating more Catholic parochial schools. People often confuse those as being elite; most are not. They are less expensive than independent college prep schools, they admit a wider range of kids and the church subsidizes the cost. It's usually better than shit-tier public, and often inferior to top quality public. Charter schools seem like they operate at that level in the market.
If they are all failures, please cite me the study. I'm not pretending to be an expert on how they have played out. But the push for them continues, and there's a good reason why ... no viable public school option. -
That is an abortion. 75%. JFC. And just down the road from what is universally acknowledged as the greatest public university on the planet.SFGbob said:Here's the system Kobe wants to maintain:
Here is what the Oakland Tribune had to say in 2003 around the performance of students in OUSD, during the early charter years, compared to the most recent data found in the current OUSD LCAP.
Thousands of Oakland high school students and parents celebrated graduation this month. But 75 percent of the ninth-graders on the books in 1998 had nothing to celebrate on graduation day four years later, according to new school district records released to The Oakland Tribune…
The district’s new records show Oakland almost totally failed to graduate students with the credits they need to get into state universities or University of California schools. Only 7 percent of the freshmen who started school in 1998 graduated four years later with the classes they need on their transcripts to get into state or UC schools. For African-American students, that percentage shrinks to less than 3 percent… That means fewer than three out of every 100 black freshmen graduated on time from city schools with enough credits to get into college. The numbers are even lower for black male students.
The Good Old Days-1.7% UC/CSU eligibility for Black males, .5% eligibility for Latino males, a 1% reclassification rate -
Yup -TurdBomber said:
I'd pay up to 150% of what I'm currently paying in taxes, just to have schools that worked and had accountability. Apparently, so would most people.Sledog said:Charter school here in CDA has top numbers and does it with less money. Sounds like a win.
Almost need to take this to @creepycoug's high brow finance board. ROI, who knew?!?!
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There's an old Stanford CREDO study that showed, at that time, that about 1/3 of charter kids did better, 1/3 did about the same, and about 1/3 did even worse in charters. Things have changed a lot since then, and the last study I saw showed that closer to 1/2 were doing better in charters. But, like public schools, charters do play games and cook the books at times. And they get slammed a lot for not having the full slate of options for special ed, busing, etc.
But the key takeaway is that closer to 50% are doing better.
Kobe should be whining the usual song of "if we can save one kid, it's worth it," but when his puppet master pulls his string, he responds with the party line.
I suspect the charters in Seattle will have long waitlists, as will the Catholics, given the adoption of CRT in SPS. 20 years of improving schools is going down the drain on account of race-baiting bullshit. Truthfully, it's been going on for awhile, but only recently became officially anti-whitey. -
If charter schools are a privatization jerk off, then what exactly does a free alternative to public schooling look like on a large scale?TheKobeStopper said:
These things don’t exist in a vacuum, a million kids have had charter schools they’re attending fail.creepycoug said:
The point is choice. If there is a good public school - and there are good public schools just to take that off the table - nearby, then that school's funding is probably not going to suffer and that charter school probably will choose to site somewhere else.TheKobeStopper said:So you guys are cool with schools closing? I got a different impression as you were using kids to score political points during the pandemic.
I view is as alternative of offering help where it's needed. If it's not needed, then it's not needed. But where they are, they're subscribed, and for a reason.
I see no reason to spare any type of school that is mailing it in, be it public or private. If a good charter school sucks funding from a shit-performing public, that's the market at work and a good result. Let the public school get its shit together and compete.
We're not talking about creating mini Exeters or Choates here with public subsidy. We're talking about incompetency to competency. Just offering a shot at a decent education. Not an elite one.
If the charter school fails, then it fails.
This isn’t about creating a choice, it’s a jerk off session for privatization. And the kids, who’s parents get tricked into the scam, are the victims. That’s why the big crocodile tears for the current school closures is, in fact, the point.
But hey, maybe your property taxes will go down and it’ll all be worth it.
Public schools are failing and the teachers union isn't going anywhere. I'll support anyone who brings solutions to the table. Charter schools are at the table. -
Hiding in plain sight. Oldest Liberal trick in the world.creepycoug said:
That is an abortion. 75%. JFC. And just down the road from what is universally acknowledged as the greatest public university on the planet.SFGbob said:Here's the system Kobe wants to maintain:
Here is what the Oakland Tribune had to say in 2003 around the performance of students in OUSD, during the early charter years, compared to the most recent data found in the current OUSD LCAP.
Thousands of Oakland high school students and parents celebrated graduation this month. But 75 percent of the ninth-graders on the books in 1998 had nothing to celebrate on graduation day four years later, according to new school district records released to The Oakland Tribune…
The district’s new records show Oakland almost totally failed to graduate students with the credits they need to get into state universities or University of California schools. Only 7 percent of the freshmen who started school in 1998 graduated four years later with the classes they need on their transcripts to get into state or UC schools. For African-American students, that percentage shrinks to less than 3 percent… That means fewer than three out of every 100 black freshmen graduated on time from city schools with enough credits to get into college. The numbers are even lower for black male students.
The Good Old Days-1.7% UC/CSU eligibility for Black males, .5% eligibility for Latino males, a 1% reclassification rate
Who'd ever suspect a HS right near a world famous university would suck?
Answer: Nobody. Liberals figured that out long ago.
And, therefore, so it goes. -
So the paper in my county in Kali would print grade point averages and test scores every year for all the schools along with the percentage of kids enrolled in the free lunch program. All you had to do was look at the the lunch program percentage. Higher the number the lower the grades. The lower the number the higher the grades.Fire_Marshall_Bill said:
They closed several here between 2009 and 2013. They also opened a new one circa 2010 and reopened one this year. It's all about the budget. Urban skool districts intentionally gravitate toward TITle 1 funds (40% free or reduced cost lunch IIRC). They'll never admit this of course, and the media is too dumb or corrupt to cover it.GrundleStiltzkin said:
Makes one wonder how many public schools would close, if permitted.TheKobeStopper said:
Half of charter schools close. So I don’t know how you’re getting to more than half outproducing public schools. I’d love to see a link though.TurdBomber said:The truth is that slightly over half the charters in the U.S. outperform their public counterparts. But the real story is the demographics of the students who comprise the student body of charters, who, on the whole, are doing way better in charters than their public school peers. Some bad charters hold the numbers down, just like Newport pulls the public numbers up. You gotta look at the demo to really judge apples to apples. When you do, you'll find it hard to argue that charters aren't doing way, way better than publics for black & hispanic kids.
Strange.
