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another shooting in a gun free zone
Comments
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And your suggestion is that responsible gun owners whipping out their NIИ's are somehow going to create less carnage in a group full of people? That makes loads of sense.sarktastic said:I'm saying the dead victims were sitting ducks with no means to defend themselves and that any faith they may have held in Obama to keep them safe, was misplaced.
I could care less if you want to own a fucking gun, but the fact that anyone continues to argue political sides of this and not admit we're the only country who shoots each other in mass quantities are morons, or even worse closeted duck fans. Both sides run to their agenda as soon as these happen and nobody does a damn thing.
As freemont said, fuck you all for not actually just trying ANYTHING but status quo. Bravo. -
It is a simple fact that we are not the only country that kills each other in mass quantities. Ever heard of the middle east?
I have never owned a gun and I wouldn't argue that the only reason to have guns is to be armed in case of a mass shooting because nobody is making that argument. It's another straw man because the anti gun arguments are so weak.
I'm against illogical reasoning to take more freedoms away.
Don't blame Islam, blame guns.
If we have an issue with mental illness, and we do, we need to revisit putting people back in lock up for mental illness. We emptied the hospitals.
It's the person behind the gun. We have the religious nuts and the mentally ill. What do we do about them?
LETS DO SOMETHING is the cry of the totalitarian. Tell me specifically what you want to do and we can discuss.
Close all the phantom loopholes and then what?
The fact is we need to confiscate all the guns by force house to house to make it work. It's funny how liberals understand so completely that prohibiting booze or drugs or whores won;t stop the behavior let always want prohibition of guns.
That's why it is obviously nothing more than a stupid political wedge issue and I refuse to be stupid enough to fall for is and vote for lying pieces of shot failures just because they rail against the NRA
Good day -
My argument is much simpler than Race's. I have guns and I will shoot you in the dick if you try to take them away.
Good day! -
It is a political wedge issue which shouldn't be a political wedge which is where we agree. However the condescension in your post is precisely what's I was referring to.
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There was nothing condescending about my post.
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So do you attribute this to guns or mental illness?FreeChavez said:
And your suggestion is that responsible gun owners whipping out their NIИ's are somehow going to create less carnage in a group full of people? That makes loads of sense.sarktastic said:I'm saying the dead victims were sitting ducks with no means to defend themselves and that any faith they may have held in Obama to keep them safe, was misplaced.
I could care less if you want to own a fucking gun, but the fact that anyone continues to argue political sides of this and not admit we're the only country who shoots each other in mass quantities are morons, or even worse closeted duck fans. Both sides run to their agenda as soon as these happen and nobody does a damn thing.
As freemont said, fuck you all for not actually just trying ANYTHING but status quo. Bravo. -
And your suggestion is that responsible gun owners whipping out their NIИ's are somehow going to create less carnage in a group full of people? That makes loads of sense.
@FreeChavez:
If a trained gun owner is packing a side-arm, it at least remains a possibility. You cannot dismiss that. Armed resistance will slow down or stop these guys, like it ultimately did here. That's why they attack "soft targets," i.e., no protection or resistance.
I'm all for progress on both sides of the issue. NRA leadership is full of assholes, but there's nothing wrong with responsible people owning guns, and that happens to be their chief lobby against irrational anti-gun measures that don't work. I also read the 2nd Amendment as written, which begins with "A well-regulated militia..." so you bet your ass the government has a right to restrict gun ownership to sane individuals. I also favor background checks. Who the fuck wouldn't? The proverbial frightened woman the NRA loves to trot out, who needs a gun right fucking now? How about she instead goes to a shelter or friends house for 24 hours. Who needs a gun right-fucking-now, aside from someone about to do something stupid, irrational, or dangerous?
It's both guns and dangerous people. It's not one or the other. We can walk and chew gum on this one, but people are so fucking dug into their positions, they won't talk or listen to one another.
Okay, assholes, drill me a new one now. I'm sure I overlooked something critical in my rant. -
Yeah ever hear of the Middle East? We're better than
Tythem!
Speaking of a straw man, how many bills have been introduced to ban guns completely?
Oh we need more hospitals for the mentally ill. I suppose we'll pay for those with fairy dust and prayers. We sure as shit can't actually raise taxes for it.
I like to claim to not be stupid enough to fall for a political wedge issue while I'm currently falling for it. I like to do that.
Other than that, great post. -
http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials-perspective/120215-783412-obama-wrong-mass-shootings-happen-elsewhere-and-more-frequently.htm
Obama also overlooks Norway, where Anders Behring Breivik used a gun to kill 67 people and wound 110 others. Still others were killed by bombs that Breivik detonated. Of the four worst K-12 school shootings, three have occurred in Europe. Germany had two of these — one in 2002 at Erfut and another in 2009 at Winnenden, with a total death toll of 34.
Obama isn't correct even if he meant the frequency of fatalities or attacks. Many European countries actually have higher rates of death from public shootings that resulted in four or more murders. It's simply a matter of adjusting for America's much larger population.
Let's look at mass public shootings from 2009 to the middle of June this year. To compare fairly with American shootings, I excluded attacks that might be better classified as struggles over sovereignty. For instance, I did not count the 22 people killed in the Macedonian town of Kumanovo last month.
Norway had the highest annual death rate, with two mass public shooting fatalities per million people. Macedonia had a rate of 0.38, Serbia 0.28, Slovakia 0.20, Finland 0.14, Belgium 0.14 and the Czech Republic 0.13. The U.S. comes in eighth with 0.095 mass public shooting fatalities per million people. Austria and Switzerland are close behind.
In terms of the frequency of attacks, the U.S. ranks ninth, with 0.09 attacks per million people. Macedonia, Serbia, Switzerland, Norway, Slovakia, Finland, Belgium and the Czech Republic all had higher rates. -
Thanks DAWG!allpurpleallgold said:Yeah ever hear of the Middle East? We're better than
Tythem!
Speaking of a straw man, how many bills have been introduced to ban guns completely?
Oh we need more hospitals for the mentally ill. I suppose we'll pay for those with fairy dust and prayers. We sure as shit can't actually raise taxes for it.
I like to claim to not be stupid enough to fall for a political wedge issue while I'm currently falling for it. I like to do that.
Other than that, great post.
My point on a complete ban is that it is the only thing that would work even though we know that prohibition won't work. This incremental bull shit is an election year staple. You do know that the democrats had a lock down majority that brought us Obamacare. Certainly could have brought us closure of the legendary gun show loophole. It's easier to run against the NRA than it is to pass something that will fail and be held accountable for it.
I'm not voting for anyone on the gun issue either way. So it is in fact, not a wedge issue for me. I'm a logical person making a logical argument in the face of hysteria fomented by idiots.
We need to treat the mentally ill. I think we all do agree on that. Having them roam the streets or mom's basement before they explode is not a good strategy. The idea that the trillions of dollars we spend are some untouchable baseline of things that could never be eliminated to spend on shit we actually need is another election year special.
Hope this wasn't too condescending. Good luck the rest of the way!
