How much do you pay each year on the Federal level to help the pours?
I determined that about 26% of our family's Federal tax bill went to wealth transfer payments. Or looking at it another way, about 3.9% of our taxable income went towards helping the pours on a Federal level.
Following are the programs I considered to be means-tested, transfer payments.
Health
*Medicaid
*Children's Health Insurance Program
Unemployment and Labor
* Earned Income Tax Credit
* Temporary Assistance for Needy Families
* Low Income Home Energy Assistance Program
Veterans Benefits
* Income Support
Food and Agriculture
*SNAP (food stamps)
*School Lunch & other food programs
Education
*Federal Student Aid
Housing and Community
*Affordable Housing Programs
I left off Medicare although undoubtedly there is some wealth transfer going on here- i.e., old people collectively receiving more in benefits from the program than they paid into the system in payroll taxes.
Comments
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too much.YellowSnow said:Chinteresting site here where you can enter how much you paid in Federal Income Tax in 2017 and get an itemized breakdown of where each dollar went: https://www.nationalpriorities.org/interactive-data/taxday/
I determined that about 26% of our family's Federal tax bill went to wealth transfer payments. Or looking at it another way, about 3.9% of our taxable income went towards helping the pours on a Federal level.
Following are the programs I considered to be means-tested, transfer payments.
Health
*Medicaid
*Children's Health Insurance Program
Unemployment and Labor
* Earned Income Tax Credit
* Temporary Assistance for Needy Families
* Low Income Home Energy Assistance Program
Veterans Benefits
* Income Support
Food and Agriculture
*SNAP (food stamps)
*School Lunch & other food programs
Education
*Federal Student Aid
Housing and Community
*Affordable Housing Programs
I left off Medicare although undoubtedly there is some wealth transfer going on here- i.e., old people collectively receiving more in benefits from the program than they paid into the system in payroll taxes.
tell the pour to get to work! this is american, not sweden. -
Does anyone here make enough to pay federal income tax?
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Yes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!2001400ex said:Does anyone here make enough to pay federal income tax?
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People forget that you don't actually have to have the federal government take your money by force in order for you to help the poor
I don't do my giving on the street corner to get rewarded by man. I give in secret so my Father in heaven can reward me -
That's true for you. But there's not reward in heaven for me, so I'm stuck having to do my good works through the tax code.RaceBannon said:People forget that you don't actually have to have the federal government take your money by force in order for you to help the poor
I don't do my giving on the street corner to get rewarded by man. I give in secret so my Father in heaven can reward me
Here's a honest question @RaceBannon , as a someone who voted for Obama in 2008, were you concerned at the time about him raising your taxes and what not? I mean, what was the calculus here? -
I was not concerned about him raising my taxes because I knew he was lying when he said he wanted to get rid of the Bush tax cut and I was right.
Unlike the idiots here other than you and me I understand that there is a sweet spot on taxation both individual and corporate that stokes the economy and I vote accordingly
We will never tax ourselves to a balanced budget so it isn't even a concern. Neither party will cut spending to get us balanced so that is a pipe dream as well.
The only positive is that I have been hearing about the dangers of the debt for 50 years and yet here we are. As long as we run the world our debt doesn't matter. When we fall the debt will be the least of our concerns anyway
I don't get my economic advice from HBO comedians or burger flippers either
Trump has done a very good job on the economy so far and that only adds to the derangement which is nice.
Some polls have him closing in in 30% approval among Blacks which is pretty much the apocalypse for the democrats
Its my money that I earn with my hard work is my calculus.
Be a good neighbor and give of your income to help others. What you send to DC is flushed down the crapper -
YellowSnow said:
That's true for you. But there's not reward in heaven for me, so I'm stuck having to do my good works through the tax code.RaceBannon said:People forget that you don't actually have to have the federal government take your money by force in order for you to help the poor
I don't do my giving on the street corner to get rewarded by man. I give in secret so my Father in heaven can reward me
Here's a honest question @RaceBannon , as a someone who voted for Obama in 2008, were you concerned at the time about him raising your taxes and what not? I mean, what was the calculus here?
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It's always smart to cover your bases. Just in case ....RaceBannon said:People forget that you don't actually have to have the federal government take your money by force in order for you to help the poor
I don't do my giving on the street corner to get rewarded by man. I give in secret so my Father in heaven can reward me -
I thank you all for your generosity
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When I was broke, tens of thousands of dollars in debt and facing eviction everything broke my way. I got myself into the mess and Dad got me outcreepycoug said:
It's always smart to cover your bases. Just in case ....RaceBannon said:People forget that you don't actually have to have the federal government take your money by force in order for you to help the poor
I don't do my giving on the street corner to get rewarded by man. I give in secret so my Father in heaven can reward me -
That was a good pod- i.e., the rise and fall and rise of Bannon in the Inland Empire.RaceBannon said:
When I was broke, tens of thousands of dollars in debt and facing eviction everything broke my way. I got myself into the mess and Dad got me outcreepycoug said:
It's always smart to cover your bases. Just in case ....RaceBannon said:People forget that you don't actually have to have the federal government take your money by force in order for you to help the poor
I don't do my giving on the street corner to get rewarded by man. I give in secret so my Father in heaven can reward me -
There's some good points here.RaceBannon said:I was not concerned about him raising my taxes because I knew he was lying when he said he wanted to get rid of the Bush tax cut and I was right.
Unlike the idiots here other than you and me I understand that there is a sweet spot on taxation both individual and corporate that stokes the economy and I vote accordingly
We will never tax ourselves to a balanced budget so it isn't even a concern. Neither party will cut spending to get us balanced so that is a pipe dream as well.
The only positive is that I have been hearing about the dangers of the debt for 50 years and yet here we are. As long as we run the world our debt doesn't matter. When we fall the debt will be the least of our concerns anyway
I don't get my economic advice from HBO comedians or burger flippers either
Trump has done a very good job on the economy so far and that only adds to the derangement which is nice.
Some polls have him closing in in 30% approval among Blacks which is pretty much the apocalypse for the democrats
Its my money that I earn with my hard work is my calculus.
Be a good neighbor and give of your income to help others. What you send to DC is flushed down the crapper
I think the risk from Clinton / Obama type dems to raise taxes on the upper income brackets has always been overstated. Yes, they were going to raise them some, but there's a limit to how much the college educated, upper income, donor class dems are willing to pony up to help the pours. Bernie and the DSA are a different story, of course.
Re: the debt, it's obviously true that in the past 50 years, Deficits have not mattered and we have the benefit from borrowing and paying interest in the debt in our own currency (this is YUGE). But I think it's wrong to think that they (deficits) will NEVER matter. At some point the markets will intervene. But at that point we'd be taking the rest of the world down with us.
I'm skeptical that charitable giving alone either to secular or religious organizations alone could ever be enough to help the needy based on our society at present. It did, of course, from 1789 to 1933 but that's a by gone era. The biggest flaw in our current welfare state is that we do a really shitty job of sorting out who truly needs assistance and who is a lazy bum. The disincentives towards work are a major problem.
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The delivery system for aid to the poor is the problem. Its an industry in itself at the government level and in private giving you have to read the fine print to see how much of each dollar gets to someone who needs it. If a charity has 80 cents on the dollar going to administration they are fucking you
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YellowSnow said:
There's some good points here.RaceBannon said:I was not concerned about him raising my taxes because I knew he was lying when he said he wanted to get rid of the Bush tax cut and I was right.
Unlike the idiots here other than you and me I understand that there is a sweet spot on taxation both individual and corporate that stokes the economy and I vote accordingly
We will never tax ourselves to a balanced budget so it isn't even a concern. Neither party will cut spending to get us balanced so that is a pipe dream as well.
The only positive is that I have been hearing about the dangers of the debt for 50 years and yet here we are. As long as we run the world our debt doesn't matter. When we fall the debt will be the least of our concerns anyway
I don't get my economic advice from HBO comedians or burger flippers either
Trump has done a very good job on the economy so far and that only adds to the derangement which is nice.
Some polls have him closing in in 30% approval among Blacks which is pretty much the apocalypse for the democrats
Its my money that I earn with my hard work is my calculus.
Be a good neighbor and give of your income to help others. What you send to DC is flushed down the crapper
I think the risk from Clinton / Obama type dems to raise taxes on the upper income brackets has always been overstated. Yes, they were going to raise them some, but there's a limit to how much the college educated, upper income, donor class dems are willing to pony up to help the pours. Bernie and the DSA are a different story, of course.
Re: the debt, it's obviously true that in the past 50 years, Deficits have not mattered and we have the benefit from borrowing and paying interest in the debt in our own currency (this is YUGE). But I think it's wrong to think that they (deficits) will NEVER matter. At some point the markets will intervene. But at that point we'd be taking the rest of the world down with us.
I'm skeptical that charitable giving alone either to secular or religious organizations alone could ever be enough to help the needy based on our society at present. It did, of course, from 1789 to 1933 but that's a by gone era. The biggest flaw in our current welfare state is that we do a really shitty job of sorting out who truly needs assistance and who is a lazy bum. The disincentives towards work are a major problem.
You mean like the Oregon State income tax Game? -
True, but we forget sometimes all them lazy guvmint jerbs are in effect a way to keep a lot of medium skilled people employed.RaceBannon said:The delivery system for aid to the poor is the problem. Its an industry in itself at the government level and in private giving you have to read the fine print to see how much of each dollar gets to someone who needs it. If a charity has 80 cents on the dollar going to administration they are fucking you
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Huh???pawz said:YellowSnow said:
There's some good points here.RaceBannon said:I was not concerned about him raising my taxes because I knew he was lying when he said he wanted to get rid of the Bush tax cut and I was right.
Unlike the idiots here other than you and me I understand that there is a sweet spot on taxation both individual and corporate that stokes the economy and I vote accordingly
We will never tax ourselves to a balanced budget so it isn't even a concern. Neither party will cut spending to get us balanced so that is a pipe dream as well.
The only positive is that I have been hearing about the dangers of the debt for 50 years and yet here we are. As long as we run the world our debt doesn't matter. When we fall the debt will be the least of our concerns anyway
I don't get my economic advice from HBO comedians or burger flippers either
Trump has done a very good job on the economy so far and that only adds to the derangement which is nice.
Some polls have him closing in in 30% approval among Blacks which is pretty much the apocalypse for the democrats
Its my money that I earn with my hard work is my calculus.
Be a good neighbor and give of your income to help others. What you send to DC is flushed down the crapper
I think the risk from Clinton / Obama type dems to raise taxes on the upper income brackets has always been overstated. Yes, they were going to raise them some, but there's a limit to how much the college educated, upper income, donor class dems are willing to pony up to help the pours. Bernie and the DSA are a different story, of course.
Re: the debt, it's obviously true that in the past 50 years, Deficits have not mattered and we have the benefit from borrowing and paying interest in the debt in our own currency (this is YUGE). But I think it's wrong to think that they (deficits) will NEVER matter. At some point the markets will intervene. But at that point we'd be taking the rest of the world down with us.
I'm skeptical that charitable giving alone either to secular or religious organizations alone could ever be enough to help the needy based on our society at present. It did, of course, from 1789 to 1933 but that's a by gone era. The biggest flaw in our current welfare state is that we do a really shitty job of sorting out who truly needs assistance and who is a lazy bum. The disincentives towards work are a major problem.
You mean like the Oregon State income tax Game? -
Melding a HCH meme with a disincentive to work.salemcoog said:
Huh???pawz said:YellowSnow said:
There's some good points here.RaceBannon said:I was not concerned about him raising my taxes because I knew he was lying when he said he wanted to get rid of the Bush tax cut and I was right.
Unlike the idiots here other than you and me I understand that there is a sweet spot on taxation both individual and corporate that stokes the economy and I vote accordingly
We will never tax ourselves to a balanced budget so it isn't even a concern. Neither party will cut spending to get us balanced so that is a pipe dream as well.
The only positive is that I have been hearing about the dangers of the debt for 50 years and yet here we are. As long as we run the world our debt doesn't matter. When we fall the debt will be the least of our concerns anyway
I don't get my economic advice from HBO comedians or burger flippers either
Trump has done a very good job on the economy so far and that only adds to the derangement which is nice.
Some polls have him closing in in 30% approval among Blacks which is pretty much the apocalypse for the democrats
Its my money that I earn with my hard work is my calculus.
Be a good neighbor and give of your income to help others. What you send to DC is flushed down the crapper
I think the risk from Clinton / Obama type dems to raise taxes on the upper income brackets has always been overstated. Yes, they were going to raise them some, but there's a limit to how much the college educated, upper income, donor class dems are willing to pony up to help the pours. Bernie and the DSA are a different story, of course.
Re: the debt, it's obviously true that in the past 50 years, Deficits have not mattered and we have the benefit from borrowing and paying interest in the debt in our own currency (this is YUGE). But I think it's wrong to think that they (deficits) will NEVER matter. At some point the markets will intervene. But at that point we'd be taking the rest of the world down with us.
I'm skeptical that charitable giving alone either to secular or religious organizations alone could ever be enough to help the needy based on our society at present. It did, of course, from 1789 to 1933 but that's a by gone era. The biggest flaw in our current welfare state is that we do a really shitty job of sorting out who truly needs assistance and who is a lazy bum. The disincentives towards work are a major problem.
You mean like the Oregon State income tax Game?
Clearly that didn't work. -
medium?YellowSnow said:True, but we forget sometimes all them lazy guvmint jerbs are in effect a way to keep a lot of medium skilled people employed.
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ISAFNRCLesGrossman said:
medium?YellowSnow said:True, but we forget sometimes all them lazy guvmint jerbs are in effect a way to keep a lot of medium skilled people employed.
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You sounded really really pour!RaceBannon said:
When I was broke, tens of thousands of dollars in debt and facing eviction everything broke my way. I got myself into the mess and Dad got me outcreepycoug said:
It's always smart to cover your bases. Just in case ....RaceBannon said:People forget that you don't actually have to have the federal government take your money by force in order for you to help the poor
I don't do my giving on the street corner to get rewarded by man. I give in secret so my Father in heaven can reward me -
beet me too it!LesGrossman said:
medium?YellowSnow said:True, but we forget sometimes all them lazy guvmint jerbs are in effect a way to keep a lot of medium skilled people employed.
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It's boom, then bust, then boom, for them construction bidness types.creepycoug said:
You sounded really really pour!RaceBannon said:
When I was broke, tens of thousands of dollars in debt and facing eviction everything broke my way. I got myself into the mess and Dad got me outcreepycoug said:
It's always smart to cover your bases. Just in case ....RaceBannon said:People forget that you don't actually have to have the federal government take your money by force in order for you to help the poor
I don't do my giving on the street corner to get rewarded by man. I give in secret so my Father in heaven can reward me -
But happycreepycoug said:
You sounded really really pour!RaceBannon said:
When I was broke, tens of thousands of dollars in debt and facing eviction everything broke my way. I got myself into the mess and Dad got me outcreepycoug said:
It's always smart to cover your bases. Just in case ....RaceBannon said:People forget that you don't actually have to have the federal government take your money by force in order for you to help the poor
I don't do my giving on the street corner to get rewarded by man. I give in secret so my Father in heaven can reward me -
One if the critiques that the left makes when the right wants to slash federal, state and local guvmint payrolls, is that such moves are inherently raysiss since the public sector employees a disproportionate number of minorities.LesGrossman said:
medium?YellowSnow said:True, but we forget sometimes all them lazy guvmint jerbs are in effect a way to keep a lot of medium skilled people employed.
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How does that square with America being an institutionally racist country?YellowSnow said:
One if the critiques that the left makes when the right wants to slash federal, state and local guvmint payrolls, is that such moves are inherently raysiss since the public sector employees a disproportionate number of minorities.LesGrossman said:
medium?YellowSnow said:True, but we forget sometimes all them lazy guvmint jerbs are in effect a way to keep a lot of medium skilled people employed.
Wouldn't the jobs go to the whites if that was the case?
Maybe we should talk about private sector racism instead
Fact is since the 60's, our institutions are the place where the government can fight racism and does. Employment and housing matter
I rented a condo for my family in 84 or so and when I showed up with the wife and kids the guy tried the old no vacancy dodge. Did not end well for him
Taught our kids to fight for the important stuff because the law is on their side
If some cracker calls you a name, fuck them, they are just worthless shit anyway so who cares what they think -
Truman desegregating the military was one of the most important things the country has ever done to make progress on race relations.RaceBannon said:
How does that square with America being an institutionally racist country?YellowSnow said:
One if the critiques that the left makes when the right wants to slash federal, state and local guvmint payrolls, is that such moves are inherently raysiss since the public sector employees a disproportionate number of minorities.LesGrossman said:
medium?YellowSnow said:True, but we forget sometimes all them lazy guvmint jerbs are in effect a way to keep a lot of medium skilled people employed.
Wouldn't the jobs go to the whites if that was the case?
Maybe we should talk about private sector racism instead
Fact is since the 60's, our institutions are the place where the government can fight racism and does. Employment and housing matter
I rented a condo for my family in 84 or so and when I showed up with the wife and kids the guy tried the old no vacancy dodge. Did not end well for him
Taught our kids to fight for the important stuff because the law is on their side
If some cracker calls you a name, fuck them, they are just worthless shit anyway so who cares what they think -
Believe it or not sports might be second both for the locker room and the fansYellowSnow said:
Truman desegregating the military was one of the most important things the country has ever done to make progress on race relations.RaceBannon said:
How does that square with America being an institutionally racist country?YellowSnow said:
One if the critiques that the left makes when the right wants to slash federal, state and local guvmint payrolls, is that such moves are inherently raysiss since the public sector employees a disproportionate number of minorities.LesGrossman said:
medium?YellowSnow said:True, but we forget sometimes all them lazy guvmint jerbs are in effect a way to keep a lot of medium skilled people employed.
Wouldn't the jobs go to the whites if that was the case?
Maybe we should talk about private sector racism instead
Fact is since the 60's, our institutions are the place where the government can fight racism and does. Employment and housing matter
I rented a condo for my family in 84 or so and when I showed up with the wife and kids the guy tried the old no vacancy dodge. Did not end well for him
Taught our kids to fight for the important stuff because the law is on their side
If some cracker calls you a name, fuck them, they are just worthless shit anyway so who cares what they think
White kids grew up idolizing Black athletes -
Social Security disability benefits (SSI, specifically) are another big means-tested benefits program.
A lot of white men and women in rural areas are on disability. In fact, a greater percentage of people in rural areas than urban areas---almost twice as many, 9.1% of the population compared with 4.9%---are on disability. The problem is worse in the Trump country--the American South and Appalachia. (Here and here and here are some links.)
My political theory? They feel like they're losers and hate themselves for it. So they project their negative self-image on immigrants, black people, and @creepycoug's people. They bash cities as being hives of welfare queens and drug addicts who hate to work. They love how Donald Trump makes them feel like winners.
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Is this obk's Bio?Squirt said:Social Security disability benefits (SSI, specifically) are another big means-tested benefits program.
A lot of white men and women in rural areas are on disability. In fact, a greater percentage of people in rural areas than urban areas---almost twice as many, 9.1% of the population compared with 4.9%---are on disability. The problem is worse in the Trump country--the American South and Appalachia. (Here and here and here are some links.)
My political theory? They feel like they're losers and hate themselves for it. So they project their negative self-image on immigrants, black people, and @creepycoug's people. They bash cities as being hives of welfare queens and drug addicts who hate to work. They love how Donald Trump makes them feel like winners. -
My income was negative last year
Take that cunts
