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FS Great Compromise of 1787 - Looking at the numbers

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  • AZDuck
    AZDuck Member Posts: 15,468
    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.

    Fuck off. Electoral college is there for a reason, to prevent NY and CA from deciding every election. You lost you fucking crybaby. Fair and square. The rules are the rules. Did your mommy change them every time your spoilt ass started crying and threw a tantrum?
    you're too dumb to argue with, so imma let Thomas Jefferson do it
    On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, and what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, and consequently may govern them as they please. But persons and property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, and no longer. Every constitution then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, and not of right.--It may be said that the succeeding generation exercising in fact the power of repeal, this leaves them as free as if the constitution or law has been expressly limited to 19 years only. In the first place, this objection admits the right, in proposing an equivalent. But the power of repeal is not an equivalent. It might be indeed if every form of government were so perfectly contrived that the will of the majority could always be obtained fairly and without impediment. But this is true of no form. The people cannot assemble themselves. Their representation is unequal and vicious. Various checks are opposed to every legislative proposition. Factions get possession of the public councils. Bribery corrupts them. Personal interests lead them astray from the general interests of their constituents: and other impediments arise so as to prove to every practical man that a law of limited duration is much more manageable than one which needs a repeal.
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  • oregonblitzkrieg
    oregonblitzkrieg Member Posts: 15,288
    AZDuck said:

    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.

    Fuck off. Electoral college is there for a reason, to prevent NY and CA from deciding every election. You lost you fucking crybaby. Fair and square. The rules are the rules. Did your mommy change them every time your spoilt ass started crying and threw a tantrum?
    you're too dumb to argue with, so imma let Thomas Jefferson do it
    On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, and what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, and consequently may govern them as they please. But persons and property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, and no longer. Every constitution then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, and not of right.--It may be said that the succeeding generation exercising in fact the power of repeal, this leaves them as free as if the constitution or law has been expressly limited to 19 years only. In the first place, this objection admits the right, in proposing an equivalent. But the power of repeal is not an equivalent. It might be indeed if every form of government were so perfectly contrived that the will of the majority could always be obtained fairly and without impediment. But this is true of no form. The people cannot assemble themselves. Their representation is unequal and vicious. Various checks are opposed to every legislative proposition. Factions get possession of the public councils. Bribery corrupts them. Personal interests lead them astray from the general interests of their constituents: and other impediments arise so as to prove to every practical man that a law of limited duration is much more manageable than one which needs a repeal.


    TJ's personal writings are irrelevant. If its not in the Constitution it doesnt matter. If you think the founders intended for one or two states to have a perpetual monopoly on presidential elections, you are more retarded than I thought.
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  • AZDuck
    AZDuck Member Posts: 15,468
    edited November 2017
    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.

    Fuck off. Electoral college is there for a reason, to prevent NY and CA from deciding every election. You lost you fucking crybaby. Fair and square. The rules are the rules. Did your mommy change them every time your spoilt ass started crying and threw a tantrum?
    you're too dumb to argue with, so imma let Thomas Jefferson do it
    On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, and what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, and consequently may govern them as they please. But persons and property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, and no longer. Every constitution then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, and not of right.--It may be said that the succeeding generation exercising in fact the power of repeal, this leaves them as free as if the constitution or law has been expressly limited to 19 years only. In the first place, this objection admits the right, in proposing an equivalent. But the power of repeal is not an equivalent. It might be indeed if every form of government were so perfectly contrived that the will of the majority could always be obtained fairly and without impediment. But this is true of no form. The people cannot assemble themselves. Their representation is unequal and vicious. Various checks are opposed to every legislative proposition. Factions get possession of the public councils. Bribery corrupts them. Personal interests lead them astray from the general interests of their constituents: and other impediments arise so as to prove to every practical man that a law of limited duration is much more manageable than one which needs a repeal.


    TJ's personal writings are irrelevant. If its not in the Constitution it doesnt matter. If you think the founders intended for one or two states to have a perpetual monopoly on presidential elections, you are more retarded than I thought.
    do you think that my call for proportional representation is about Presidential elections?
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  • PurpleThrobber
    PurpleThrobber Member Posts: 48,782 Standard Supporter
    AZDuck said:

    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.

    Fuck off. Electoral college is there for a reason, to prevent NY and CA from deciding every election. You lost you fucking crybaby. Fair and square. The rules are the rules. Did your mommy change them every time your spoilt ass started crying and threw a tantrum?
    you're too dumb to argue with, so imma let Thomas Jefferson do it
    On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, and what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, and consequently may govern them as they please. But persons and property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, and no longer. Every constitution then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, and not of right.--It may be said that the succeeding generation exercising in fact the power of repeal, this leaves them as free as if the constitution or law has been expressly limited to 19 years only. In the first place, this objection admits the right, in proposing an equivalent. But the power of repeal is not an equivalent. It might be indeed if every form of government were so perfectly contrived that the will of the majority could always be obtained fairly and without impediment. But this is true of no form. The people cannot assemble themselves. Their representation is unequal and vicious. Various checks are opposed to every legislative proposition. Factions get possession of the public councils. Bribery corrupts them. Personal interests lead them astray from the general interests of their constituents: and other impediments arise so as to prove to every practical man that a law of limited duration is much more manageable than one which needs a repeal.


    You don't like the rules? Change them.

    It takes 3/4 of the states to agree.

    Good luck.

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  • AZDuck
    AZDuck Member Posts: 15,468
    edited November 2017
    PurpleThrobber said:

    AZDuck said:

    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.

    Fuck off. Electoral college is there for a reason, to prevent NY and CA from deciding every election. You lost you fucking crybaby. Fair and square. The rules are the rules. Did your mommy change them every time your spoilt ass started crying and threw a tantrum?
    you're too dumb to argue with, so imma let Thomas Jefferson do it
    On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, and what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, and consequently may govern them as they please. But persons and property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, and no longer. Every constitution then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, and not of right.--It may be said that the succeeding generation exercising in fact the power of repeal, this leaves them as free as if the constitution or law has been expressly limited to 19 years only. In the first place, this objection admits the right, in proposing an equivalent. But the power of repeal is not an equivalent. It might be indeed if every form of government were so perfectly contrived that the will of the majority could always be obtained fairly and without impediment. But this is true of no form. The people cannot assemble themselves. Their representation is unequal and vicious. Various checks are opposed to every legislative proposition. Factions get possession of the public councils. Bribery corrupts them. Personal interests lead them astray from the general interests of their constituents: and other impediments arise so as to prove to every practical man that a law of limited duration is much more manageable than one which needs a repeal.


    You don't like the rules? Change them.

    It takes 3/4 of the states to agree.

    Good luck.

    Yeah, that was kinda TJ's poont.
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  • PurpleThrobber
    PurpleThrobber Member Posts: 48,782 Standard Supporter
    AZDuck said:

    PurpleThrobber said:

    AZDuck said:

    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.

    Fuck off. Electoral college is there for a reason, to prevent NY and CA from deciding every election. You lost you fucking crybaby. Fair and square. The rules are the rules. Did your mommy change them every time your spoilt ass started crying and threw a tantrum?
    you're too dumb to argue with, so imma let Thomas Jefferson do it
    On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, and what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, and consequently may govern them as they please. But persons and property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, and no longer. Every constitution then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, and not of right.--It may be said that the succeeding generation exercising in fact the power of repeal, this leaves them as free as if the constitution or law has been expressly limited to 19 years only. In the first place, this objection admits the right, in proposing an equivalent. But the power of repeal is not an equivalent. It might be indeed if every form of government were so perfectly contrived that the will of the majority could always be obtained fairly and without impediment. But this is true of no form. The people cannot assemble themselves. Their representation is unequal and vicious. Various checks are opposed to every legislative proposition. Factions get possession of the public councils. Bribery corrupts them. Personal interests lead them astray from the general interests of their constituents: and other impediments arise so as to prove to every practical man that a law of limited duration is much more manageable than one which needs a repeal.


    You don't like the rules? Change them.

    It takes 3/4 of the states to agree.

    Good luck.

    Yeah, that was kinda TJ's poont.
    So TJ was for the Constitution before he was against?

    If he liked his Constitution, could he keep it?

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  • AZDuck
    AZDuck Member Posts: 15,468
    PurpleThrobber said:

    AZDuck said:

    PurpleThrobber said:

    AZDuck said:

    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.

    Fuck off. Electoral college is there for a reason, to prevent NY and CA from deciding every election. You lost you fucking crybaby. Fair and square. The rules are the rules. Did your mommy change them every time your spoilt ass started crying and threw a tantrum?
    you're too dumb to argue with, so imma let Thomas Jefferson do it
    On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, and what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, and consequently may govern them as they please. But persons and property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, and no longer. Every constitution then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, and not of right.--It may be said that the succeeding generation exercising in fact the power of repeal, this leaves them as free as if the constitution or law has been expressly limited to 19 years only. In the first place, this objection admits the right, in proposing an equivalent. But the power of repeal is not an equivalent. It might be indeed if every form of government were so perfectly contrived that the will of the majority could always be obtained fairly and without impediment. But this is true of no form. The people cannot assemble themselves. Their representation is unequal and vicious. Various checks are opposed to every legislative proposition. Factions get possession of the public councils. Bribery corrupts them. Personal interests lead them astray from the general interests of their constituents: and other impediments arise so as to prove to every practical man that a law of limited duration is much more manageable than one which needs a repeal.


    You don't like the rules? Change them.

    It takes 3/4 of the states to agree.

    Good luck.

    Yeah, that was kinda TJ's poont.
    So TJ was for the Constitution before he was against?

    If he liked his Constitution, could he keep it?

    He liked his constitutions like he liked his women. No more than 19 years old.
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  • YellowSnow
    YellowSnow Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 37,850 Founders Club
    AZDuck said:

    PurpleThrobber said:

    AZDuck said:

    PurpleThrobber said:

    AZDuck said:

    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.

    Fuck off. Electoral college is there for a reason, to prevent NY and CA from deciding every election. You lost you fucking crybaby. Fair and square. The rules are the rules. Did your mommy change them every time your spoilt ass started crying and threw a tantrum?
    you're too dumb to argue with, so imma let Thomas Jefferson do it
    On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, and what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, and consequently may govern them as they please. But persons and property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished then in their natural course with those who gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, and no longer. Every constitution then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of 19 years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force, and not of right.--It may be said that the succeeding generation exercising in fact the power of repeal, this leaves them as free as if the constitution or law has been expressly limited to 19 years only. In the first place, this objection admits the right, in proposing an equivalent. But the power of repeal is not an equivalent. It might be indeed if every form of government were so perfectly contrived that the will of the majority could always be obtained fairly and without impediment. But this is true of no form. The people cannot assemble themselves. Their representation is unequal and vicious. Various checks are opposed to every legislative proposition. Factions get possession of the public councils. Bribery corrupts them. Personal interests lead them astray from the general interests of their constituents: and other impediments arise so as to prove to every practical man that a law of limited duration is much more manageable than one which needs a repeal.


    You don't like the rules? Change them.

    It takes 3/4 of the states to agree.

    Good luck.

    Yeah, that was kinda TJ's poont.
    So TJ was for the Constitution before he was against?

    If he liked his Constitution, could he keep it?

    He liked his constitutions like he liked his women. No more than 19 years old.
    YKW

    image
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  • AZDuck
    AZDuck Member Posts: 15,468
    sorry I didn't have a daguerrotype handy
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  • TierbsHsotBoobs
    TierbsHsotBoobs Member Posts: 39,680
    oregonblitzkrieg said:

    AZDuck said:

    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.
    PROPORTIONAL REPRESENTATION NOW.

    Fuck off. Electoral college is there for a reason, to prevent NY and CA from deciding every election. You lost you fucking crybaby. Fair and square. The rules are the rules. Did your mommy change them every time your spoilt ass started crying and threw a tantrum?
    Today I learned California was a thing when the electoral college was invented.
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