I agree, but wonder how 22,000 people were stupid enough to vote for her. My home is not in her district and there were plenty of Sawant signs. This lady seems to have plenty of supporters.
There are A LOT of millenial transplants in Seattle. They are a mercurial bunch and they don't like to live in the same place for long. They also vote and are the likely source of support for the council.
There are a lot other people in Seattle outside that demographic who have probably never cast a ballot for a council position. It's hardly ever been that important.
Seattle is a liberal place. I'm not going to deny that. But across the board, not that liberal.
Of the 150k or so new residents over the past decade, about 80% were somewhere between 20 and 35 and 90% had college degrees, which means they've had the intellectually bankrupt Critical Race theory that cripples their minds shoved down their throats since high school.
I agree, but wonder how 22,000 people were stupid enough to vote for her. My home is not in her district and there were plenty of Sawant signs. This lady seems to have plenty of supporters.
I've told this story before, but I was living in Seattle when she was first elected. When she was campaigning, I was talking to a neighbor of mine. She was like, "It is just so exciting to think we could elect a woman of Indian descent to such a prominent position!" And I said, "yeah, but have you heard some of the things she's saying? Sometimes she sounds almost crazy."
Much to the chagrin of my conservative parents, growing up I was quiet the leftist...
The first thing that really caused me to examine my beliefs was Obama's election.
It was really eye opening when I heard my "non racist" friends saying similar racist stuff about Obama. About how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black. Or how great it was that he was articulate and black... That type of open and socially acceptable racism really weirded me out.
Over the next few years the same "libertarian" friends that ranted about Bush being a war mongering, nazi, blood for oil, spying, authoritarian, dictator became some of the most vocal white knights for Obama...
The acceptable obvious racism and then political hypocrisy was the beginning of my path towards moderatism.
Have to say, this doesn't jibe at all with my experience. I can't, with a straight face, take someone having a warm fuzzy feeling about the first black person elected to POTUS as " = racism". It feels like a right wing trope that, purposefully or not, provides cover and diversion for people who are blatantly racist. Sure, the "articulate" piece probably reveals some underlying racial bias. But I, too, thought the election of the first black POTUS was a good thing for America PRECISELY because he was black. That doesn't make me racist. It makes me aware of how far the country has come in my own lifetime, having been born just outside of the Jim Crow era.
The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic.
And I've never known anyone who pushes a libertarian point of view who ever cheered for Obama just because he's black. That is the last group of people to do that sort of thing. They are all about the opposite of that mind-set. I would profer that those people are not libertarian.
I agree, but wonder how 22,000 people were stupid enough to vote for her. My home is not in her district and there were plenty of Sawant signs. This lady seems to have plenty of supporters.
I've told this story before, but I was living in Seattle when she was first elected. When she was campaigning, I was talking to a neighbor of mine. She was like, "It is just so exciting to think we could elect a woman of Indian descent to such a prominent position!" And I said, "yeah, but have you heard some of the things she's saying? Sometimes she sounds almost crazy."
Much to the chagrin of my conservative parents, growing up I was quiet the leftist...
The first thing that really caused me to examine my beliefs was Obama's election.
It was really eye opening when I heard my "non racist" friends saying similar racist stuff about Obama. About how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black. Or how great it was that he was articulate and black... That type of open and socially acceptable racism really weirded me out.
Over the next few years the same "libertarian" friends that ranted about Bush being a war mongering, nazi, blood for oil, spying, authoritarian, dictator became some of the most vocal white knights for Obama...
The acceptable obvious racism and then political hypocrisy was the beginning of my path towards moderatism.
Have to say, this doesn't jibe at all with my experience. I can't, with a straight face, take someone having a warm fuzzy feeling about the first black person elected to POTUS as " = racism". It feels like a right wing trope that, purposefully or not, provides cover and diversion for people who are blatantly racist. Sure, the "articulate" piece probably reveals some underlying racial bias. But I, too, thought the election of the first black POTUS was a good thing for America PRECISELY because he was black. That doesn't make me racist. It makes me aware of how far the country has come in my own lifetime, having been born just outside of the Jim Crow era.
The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic.
And I've never known anyone who pushes a libertarian point of view who ever cheered for Obama just because he's black. That is the last group of people to do that sort of thing. They are all about the opposite of that mind-set. I would profer that those people are not libertarian.
Sawant, who married into money, and lives 2 blocks from friends of mine, in a 2MM+ house in Leschi, sure likes to talk a LOT about taking other peoples money away.
Fuck her.
Had this very argument with one of the kids the other day after defunding. I challenged them, for the intellectual exercise, to rationalize for me the views of a woman who thinks everyone should have the same amount of everything also lives in fucking Leschi, where even a small "fixer upper", if there's one left, will cost well into 7 figures. How da fuck she live there?
Of course, when you're in your early 20s and still on Daddy's payroll, you can't really internalize that it's still a big deal to live in a million $+ house. It just seems to happen by magic.
"The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic."
I get the supposed feel good vibe and I don't think that supporting a qualified person of color is racist. I do believe that voting for someone based on their skin color and ignoring the fact that barry is an ant-American POS while telling me that he will be the smartest president evah is racist. I prefer that a person be judged on the quality of their character rather than skin color. Meanwhile, the very same people then demand that blacks think like black people and vote like black people are also racists. That includes Biden.
"The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic."
I get the supposed feel good vibe and I don't think that supporting a qualified person of color is racist. I do believe that voting for someone based on their skin color and ignoring the fact that barry is an ant-American POS while telling me that he will be the smartest president evah is racist. I prefer that a person be judged on the quality of their character rather than skin color. Meanwhile, the very same people then demand that blacks think like black people and vote like black people are also racists. That includes Biden.
I agree with all that except the racist part. Ignoring those things you list makes them stupid, not necessarily racist.
I get it. There is a line somewhere in this point of view where you wonder if the bleeding heart liberal doesn't really harbor a view that "these other people" need our help because they are fundamentally incapable of progressing without it. I know some of these supposed liberal do-gooders who make me wonder if they don't think they are fundamentally superior and are morally obligated to lend a helping hand. Some of those people, as a side note, are some of the worst bullies I've ever known. Worked with quite a few, and you really had to watch your backside with them.
I may be naive, but I think they are not representative. I think the average bleeding heart liberal, especially the kids (I see this at home now), just really buy in to this "but but slavery" bit and think that the lingering effects of that is the real problem and we need to do more to fix it. Those people are incredibly misguided, but I wouldn't call them racist.
I, too, prefer the person to be judged on character and qualifications. That said, I still felt good about Americans electing a black POTUS. It was historically significant. Some of his shortcomings were disappointing, but it still represented, to me, that America is a great country that is always trying to make itself better.
A very real and intellectually interesting question sits out there now: can a black conservative get elected, and if not, why?
"The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic."
I get the supposed feel good vibe and I don't think that supporting a qualified person of color is racist. I do believe that voting for someone based on their skin color and ignoring the fact that barry is an ant-American POS while telling me that he will be the smartest president evah is racist. I prefer that a person be judged on the quality of their character rather than skin color. Meanwhile, the very same people then demand that blacks think like black people and vote like black people are also racists. That includes Biden.
I agree with all that except the racist part. Ignoring those things you list makes them stupid, not necessarily racist.
I get it. There is a line somewhere in this point of view where you wonder if the bleeding heart liberal doesn't really harbor a view that "these other people" need our help because they are fundamentally incapable of progressing without it. I know some of these supposed liberal do-gooders who make me wonder if they don't think they are fundamentally superior and are morally obligated to lend a helping hand. Some of those people, as a side note, are some of the worst bullies I've ever known. Worked with quite a few, and you really had to watch your backside with them.
I may be naive, but I think they are not representative. I think the average bleeding heart liberal, especially the kids (I see this at home now), just really buy in to this "but but slavery" bit and think that the lingering effects of that is the real problem and we need to do more to fix it. Those people are incredibly misguided, but I wouldn't call them racist.
I, too, prefer the person to be judged on character and qualifications. That said, I still felt good about Americans electing a black POTUS. It was historically significant. Some of his shortcomings were disappointing, but it still represented, to me, that America is a great country that is always trying to make itself better.
A very real and intellectually interesting question sits out there now: can a black conservative get elected, and if not, why?
Tim Scott got elected in South Carolina. South mother fucking Carolina. I'd prefer the GOP run a black person. They are usually smarter and have more balls than the shitbag whites they keep running like Mitt Romney and 81% of all the rest of them.
"The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic."
I get the supposed feel good vibe and I don't think that supporting a qualified person of color is racist. I do believe that voting for someone based on their skin color and ignoring the fact that barry is an ant-American POS while telling me that he will be the smartest president evah is racist. I prefer that a person be judged on the quality of their character rather than skin color. Meanwhile, the very same people then demand that blacks think like black people and vote like black people are also racists. That includes Biden.
I agree with all that except the racist part. Ignoring those things you list makes them stupid, not necessarily racist.
I get it. There is a line somewhere in this point of view where you wonder if the bleeding heart liberal doesn't really harbor a view that "these other people" need our help because they are fundamentally incapable of progressing without it. I know some of these supposed liberal do-gooders who make me wonder if they don't think they are fundamentally superior and are morally obligated to lend a helping hand. Some of those people, as a side note, are some of the worst bullies I've ever known. Worked with quite a few, and you really had to watch your backside with them.
I may be naive, but I think they are not representative. I think the average bleeding heart liberal, especially the kids (I see this at home now), just really buy in to this "but but slavery" bit and think that the lingering effects of that is the real problem and we need to do more to fix it. Those people are incredibly misguided, but I wouldn't call them racist.
I, too, prefer the person to be judged on character and qualifications. That said, I still felt good about Americans electing a black POTUS. It was historically significant. Some of his shortcomings were disappointing, but it still represented, to me, that America is a great country that is always trying to make itself better.
A very real and intellectually interesting question sits out there now: can a black conservative get elected, and if not, why?
Tim Scott got elected in South Carolina. South mother fucking Carolina. I'd prefer the GOP run a black person. They are usually smarter and have more balls than the shitbag whites they keep running like Mitt Romney and 81% of all the rest of them.
Time Scott is a pretty impressive dude.
If you want serious ballbuster, look no further. Col. West makes sled look like a Jesuit.
"The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic."
I get the supposed feel good vibe and I don't think that supporting a qualified person of color is racist. I do believe that voting for someone based on their skin color and ignoring the fact that barry is an ant-American POS while telling me that he will be the smartest president evah is racist. I prefer that a person be judged on the quality of their character rather than skin color. Meanwhile, the very same people then demand that blacks think like black people and vote like black people are also racists. That includes Biden.
I agree with all that except the racist part. Ignoring those things you list makes them stupid, not necessarily racist.
I get it. There is a line somewhere in this point of view where you wonder if the bleeding heart liberal doesn't really harbor a view that "these other people" need our help because they are fundamentally incapable of progressing without it. I know some of these supposed liberal do-gooders who make me wonder if they don't think they are fundamentally superior and are morally obligated to lend a helping hand. Some of those people, as a side note, are some of the worst bullies I've ever known. Worked with quite a few, and you really had to watch your backside with them.
I may be naive, but I think they are not representative. I think the average bleeding heart liberal, especially the kids (I see this at home now), just really buy in to this "but but slavery" bit and think that the lingering effects of that is the real problem and we need to do more to fix it. Those people are incredibly misguided, but I wouldn't call them racist.
I, too, prefer the person to be judged on character and qualifications. That said, I still felt good about Americans electing a black POTUS. It was historically significant. Some of his shortcomings were disappointing, but it still represented, to me, that America is a great country that is always trying to make itself better.
A very real and intellectually interesting question sits out there now: can a black conservative get elected, and if not, why?
Tim Scott got elected in South Carolina. South mother fucking Carolina. I'd prefer the GOP run a black person. They are usually smarter and have more balls than the shitbag whites they keep running like Mitt Romney and 81% of all the rest of them.
Time Scott is a pretty impressive dude.
If you want serious ballbuster, look no further. Col. West makes sled look like a Jesuit.
"The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic."
I get the supposed feel good vibe and I don't think that supporting a qualified person of color is racist. I do believe that voting for someone based on their skin color and ignoring the fact that barry is an ant-American POS while telling me that he will be the smartest president evah is racist. I prefer that a person be judged on the quality of their character rather than skin color. Meanwhile, the very same people then demand that blacks think like black people and vote like black people are also racists. That includes Biden.
I agree with all that except the racist part. Ignoring those things you list makes them stupid, not necessarily racist.
I get it. There is a line somewhere in this point of view where you wonder if the bleeding heart liberal doesn't really harbor a view that "these other people" need our help because they are fundamentally incapable of progressing without it. I know some of these supposed liberal do-gooders who make me wonder if they don't think they are fundamentally superior and are morally obligated to lend a helping hand. Some of those people, as a side note, are some of the worst bullies I've ever known. Worked with quite a few, and you really had to watch your backside with them.
I may be naive, but I think they are not representative. I think the average bleeding heart liberal, especially the kids (I see this at home now), just really buy in to this "but but slavery" bit and think that the lingering effects of that is the real problem and we need to do more to fix it. Those people are incredibly misguided, but I wouldn't call them racist.
I, too, prefer the person to be judged on character and qualifications. That said, I still felt good about Americans electing a black POTUS. It was historically significant. Some of his shortcomings were disappointing, but it still represented, to me, that America is a great country that is always trying to make itself better.
A very real and intellectually interesting question sits out there now: can a black conservative get elected, and if not, why?
Tim Scott got elected in South Carolina. South mother fucking Carolina. I'd prefer the GOP run a black person. They are usually smarter and have more balls than the shitbag whites they keep running like Mitt Romney and 81% of all the rest of them.
Time Scott is a pretty impressive dude.
If you want serious ballbuster, look no further. Col. West makes sled look like a Jesuit.
I agree, but wonder how 22,000 people were stupid enough to vote for her. My home is not in her district and there were plenty of Sawant signs. This lady seems to have plenty of supporters.
I've told this story before, but I was living in Seattle when she was first elected. When she was campaigning, I was talking to a neighbor of mine. She was like, "It is just so exciting to think we could elect a woman of Indian descent to such a prominent position!" And I said, "yeah, but have you heard some of the things she's saying? Sometimes she sounds almost crazy."
Much to the chagrin of my conservative parents, growing up I was quiet the leftist...
The first thing that really caused me to examine my beliefs was Obama's election.
It was really eye opening when I heard my "non racist" friends saying similar racist stuff about Obama. About how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black. Or how great it was that he was articulate and black... That type of open and socially acceptable racism really weirded me out.
Over the next few years the same "libertarian" friends that ranted about Bush being a war mongering, nazi, blood for oil, spying, authoritarian, dictator became some of the most vocal white knights for Obama...
The acceptable obvious racism and then political hypocrisy was the beginning of my path towards moderatism.
Have to say, this doesn't jibe at all with my experience. I can't, with a straight face, take someone having a warm fuzzy feeling about the first black person elected to POTUS as " = racism". It feels like a right wing trope that, purposefully or not, provides cover and diversion for people who are blatantly racist. Sure, the "articulate" piece probably reveals some underlying racial bias. But I, too, thought the election of the first black POTUS was a good thing for America PRECISELY because he was black. That doesn't make me racist. It makes me aware of how far the country has come in my own lifetime, having been born just outside of the Jim Crow era.
The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic.
And I've never known anyone who pushes a libertarian point of view who ever cheered for Obama just because he's black. That is the last group of people to do that sort of thing. They are all about the opposite of that mind-set. I would profer that those people are not libertarian.
You are quite a bit older than I. Its not surprising the political discussions I had with my peer group during Obama may not be the political experience you may have had.
I didnt say the sentiment was they were happy to have a well qualified president who happened to be black... I specifically said the sentiment was "how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black", regardless of merit or political agreement.
Voting for someone because of their race is racism.
Voting for someone because of their genitalia/gender is sexism.
I put libertarian in quotes, that should have been enough for you to understand I wasn't talking about REAL libertarians. Every teenager in my peer group at the time claimed libertarian because we had all been taught Bush was evil and democrats were just the other side of the same coin, we wanted to be able to have sex, say bad words, and smoke pot... It was easy to claim the non bipartisan position and the high ground by calling libertarian. Most people aren't actually libertarian... Especially teenagers with minimal real world knowledge claiming to be. Think of it as the "moderate" of the time.
It would go a long way if you didnt try to re-write what I said next time...
"The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic."
I get the supposed feel good vibe and I don't think that supporting a qualified person of color is racist. I do believe that voting for someone based on their skin color and ignoring the fact that barry is an ant-American POS while telling me that he will be the smartest president evah is racist. I prefer that a person be judged on the quality of their character rather than skin color. Meanwhile, the very same people then demand that blacks think like black people and vote like black people are also racists. That includes Biden.
I agree with all that except the racist part. Ignoring those things you list makes them stupid, not necessarily racist.
I get it. There is a line somewhere in this point of view where you wonder if the bleeding heart liberal doesn't really harbor a view that "these other people" need our help because they are fundamentally incapable of progressing without it. I know some of these supposed liberal do-gooders who make me wonder if they don't think they are fundamentally superior and are morally obligated to lend a helping hand. Some of those people, as a side note, are some of the worst bullies I've ever known. Worked with quite a few, and you really had to watch your backside with them.
I may be naive, but I think they are not representative. I think the average bleeding heart liberal, especially the kids (I see this at home now), just really buy in to this "but but slavery" bit and think that the lingering effects of that is the real problem and we need to do more to fix it. Those people are incredibly misguided, but I wouldn't call them racist.
I, too, prefer the person to be judged on character and qualifications. That said, I still felt good about Americans electing a black POTUS. It was historically significant. Some of his shortcomings were disappointing, but it still represented, to me, that America is a great country that is always trying to make itself better.
A very real and intellectually interesting question sits out there now: can a black conservative get elected, and if not, why?
Tim Scott got elected in South Carolina. South mother fucking Carolina. I'd prefer the GOP run a black person. They are usually smarter and have more balls than the shitbag whites they keep running like Mitt Romney and 81% of all the rest of them.
Time Scott is a pretty impressive dude.
If you want serious ballbuster, look no further. Col. West makes sled look like a Jesuit.
I agree, but wonder how 22,000 people were stupid enough to vote for her. My home is not in her district and there were plenty of Sawant signs. This lady seems to have plenty of supporters.
I've told this story before, but I was living in Seattle when she was first elected. When she was campaigning, I was talking to a neighbor of mine. She was like, "It is just so exciting to think we could elect a woman of Indian descent to such a prominent position!" And I said, "yeah, but have you heard some of the things she's saying? Sometimes she sounds almost crazy."
Much to the chagrin of my conservative parents, growing up I was quiet the leftist...
The first thing that really caused me to examine my beliefs was Obama's election.
It was really eye opening when I heard my "non racist" friends saying similar racist stuff about Obama. About how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black. Or how great it was that he was articulate and black... That type of open and socially acceptable racism really weirded me out.
Over the next few years the same "libertarian" friends that ranted about Bush being a war mongering, nazi, blood for oil, spying, authoritarian, dictator became some of the most vocal white knights for Obama...
The acceptable obvious racism and then political hypocrisy was the beginning of my path towards moderatism.
Have to say, this doesn't jibe at all with my experience. I can't, with a straight face, take someone having a warm fuzzy feeling about the first black person elected to POTUS as " = racism". It feels like a right wing trope that, purposefully or not, provides cover and diversion for people who are blatantly racist. Sure, the "articulate" piece probably reveals some underlying racial bias. But I, too, thought the election of the first black POTUS was a good thing for America PRECISELY because he was black. That doesn't make me racist. It makes me aware of how far the country has come in my own lifetime, having been born just outside of the Jim Crow era.
The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic.
And I've never known anyone who pushes a libertarian point of view who ever cheered for Obama just because he's black. That is the last group of people to do that sort of thing. They are all about the opposite of that mind-set. I would profer that those people are not libertarian.
You are quite a bit older than I. Its not surprising the political discussions I had with my peer group during Obama may not be the political experience you may have had.
I didnt say the sentiment was they were happy to have a well qualified president who happened to be black... I specifically said the sentiment was "how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black", regardless of merit or political agreement.
Voting for someone because of their race is racism.
Voting for someone because of their genitalia/gender is sexism.
I put libertarian in quotes, that should have been enough for you to understand I wasn't talking about REAL libertarians. Every teenager in my peer group at the time claimed libertarian because we had all been taught Bush was evil and democrats were just the other side of the same coin, we wanted to be able to have sex, say bad words, and smoke pot... It was easy to claim the non bipartisan position and the high ground by calling libertarian. Most people aren't actually libertarian... Especially teenagers with minimal real world knowledge claiming to be. Think of it as the "moderate" of the time.
It would go a long way if you didnt try to re-write what I said next time...
Nor did I say that's what you said of the sentiment. It would also go a long way for you to not re-write my response next time...
My response, in fact, was entirely responsive to the point you did make. I pretty clearly stated that I thought electing a black POTUS was a good thing precisely because he was black, and that I'm not a racist. There's a little historical context involved on this point. Ignore it if you must.
90% of my post was in disagreement with this idea that you've now proffered twice. So I rewrote and misunderstood nothing. It's a bullshit and disingenuous idea. I know probably 100 people who, for example, firmly support affirmative action in an attempt at social engineering. None of them have a racist bone in their body. Black people who support affirmative action aren't racist against themselves. Nor are well-meaning, though misguided, white people who support it. And affirmative action is based 100% on race and nothing else.
I'll be sure to keep in mind your guidance on quotes.
I agree, but wonder how 22,000 people were stupid enough to vote for her. My home is not in her district and there were plenty of Sawant signs. This lady seems to have plenty of supporters.
I've told this story before, but I was living in Seattle when she was first elected. When she was campaigning, I was talking to a neighbor of mine. She was like, "It is just so exciting to think we could elect a woman of Indian descent to such a prominent position!" And I said, "yeah, but have you heard some of the things she's saying? Sometimes she sounds almost crazy."
Much to the chagrin of my conservative parents, growing up I was quiet the leftist...
The first thing that really caused me to examine my beliefs was Obama's election.
It was really eye opening when I heard my "non racist" friends saying similar racist stuff about Obama. About how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black. Or how great it was that he was articulate and black... That type of open and socially acceptable racism really weirded me out.
Over the next few years the same "libertarian" friends that ranted about Bush being a war mongering, nazi, blood for oil, spying, authoritarian, dictator became some of the most vocal white knights for Obama...
The acceptable obvious racism and then political hypocrisy was the beginning of my path towards moderatism.
Have to say, this doesn't jibe at all with my experience. I can't, with a straight face, take someone having a warm fuzzy feeling about the first black person elected to POTUS as " = racism". It feels like a right wing trope that, purposefully or not, provides cover and diversion for people who are blatantly racist. Sure, the "articulate" piece probably reveals some underlying racial bias. But I, too, thought the election of the first black POTUS was a good thing for America PRECISELY because he was black. That doesn't make me racist. It makes me aware of how far the country has come in my own lifetime, having been born just outside of the Jim Crow era.
The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic.
And I've never known anyone who pushes a libertarian point of view who ever cheered for Obama just because he's black. That is the last group of people to do that sort of thing. They are all about the opposite of that mind-set. I would profer that those people are not libertarian.
You are quite a bit older than I. Its not surprising the political discussions I had with my peer group during Obama may not be the political experience you may have had.
I didnt say the sentiment was they were happy to have a well qualified president who happened to be black... I specifically said the sentiment was "how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black", regardless of merit or political agreement.
Voting for someone because of their race is racism.
Voting for someone because of their genitalia/gender is sexism.
I put libertarian in quotes, that should have been enough for you to understand I wasn't talking about REAL libertarians. Every teenager in my peer group at the time claimed libertarian because we had all been taught Bush was evil and democrats were just the other side of the same coin, we wanted to be able to have sex, say bad words, and smoke pot... It was easy to claim the non bipartisan position and the high ground by calling libertarian. Most people aren't actually libertarian... Especially teenagers with minimal real world knowledge claiming to be. Think of it as the "moderate" of the time.
It would go a long way if you didnt try to re-write what I said next time...
Nor did I say that's what you said of the sentiment. It would also go a long way for you to not re-write my response next time...
My response, in fact, was entirely responsive to the point you did make. I pretty clearly stated that I thought electing a black POTUS was a good thing precisely because he was black, and that I'm not a racist. There's a little historical context involved on this point. Ignore it if you must.
90% of my post was in disagreement with this idea that you've now proffered twice. So I rewrote and misunderstood nothing. It's a bullshit and disingenuous idea. I know probably 100 people who, for example, firmly support affirmative action in an attempt at social engineering. None of them have a racist bone in their body. Black people who support affirmative action aren't racist against themselves. Nor are well-meaning, though misguided, white people who support it. And affirmative action is based 100% on race and nothing else.
I'll be sure to keep in mind your guidance on quotes.
Just because you believe you are balancing the scales by being racist doesnt mean you aren't being racist.
Voting for someone on the basis of their skin color, not their political merit, is racist.
There are probably a few white supremacists out there talking about social engineering, balancing the scales, and voting based on skin color justifying their beliefs in the same way too.
You want to claim you aren't racist despite a few racist beliefs here or there... whatever...
I agree, but wonder how 22,000 people were stupid enough to vote for her. My home is not in her district and there were plenty of Sawant signs. This lady seems to have plenty of supporters.
I've told this story before, but I was living in Seattle when she was first elected. When she was campaigning, I was talking to a neighbor of mine. She was like, "It is just so exciting to think we could elect a woman of Indian descent to such a prominent position!" And I said, "yeah, but have you heard some of the things she's saying? Sometimes she sounds almost crazy."
Much to the chagrin of my conservative parents, growing up I was quiet the leftist...
The first thing that really caused me to examine my beliefs was Obama's election.
It was really eye opening when I heard my "non racist" friends saying similar racist stuff about Obama. About how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black. Or how great it was that he was articulate and black... That type of open and socially acceptable racism really weirded me out.
Over the next few years the same "libertarian" friends that ranted about Bush being a war mongering, nazi, blood for oil, spying, authoritarian, dictator became some of the most vocal white knights for Obama...
The acceptable obvious racism and then political hypocrisy was the beginning of my path towards moderatism.
Have to say, this doesn't jibe at all with my experience. I can't, with a straight face, take someone having a warm fuzzy feeling about the first black person elected to POTUS as " = racism". It feels like a right wing trope that, purposefully or not, provides cover and diversion for people who are blatantly racist. Sure, the "articulate" piece probably reveals some underlying racial bias. But I, too, thought the election of the first black POTUS was a good thing for America PRECISELY because he was black. That doesn't make me racist. It makes me aware of how far the country has come in my own lifetime, having been born just outside of the Jim Crow era.
The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic.
And I've never known anyone who pushes a libertarian point of view who ever cheered for Obama just because he's black. That is the last group of people to do that sort of thing. They are all about the opposite of that mind-set. I would profer that those people are not libertarian.
You are quite a bit older than I. Its not surprising the political discussions I had with my peer group during Obama may not be the political experience you may have had.
I didnt say the sentiment was they were happy to have a well qualified president who happened to be black... I specifically said the sentiment was "how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black", regardless of merit or political agreement.
Voting for someone because of their race is racism.
Voting for someone because of their genitalia/gender is sexism.
I put libertarian in quotes, that should have been enough for you to understand I wasn't talking about REAL libertarians. Every teenager in my peer group at the time claimed libertarian because we had all been taught Bush was evil and democrats were just the other side of the same coin, we wanted to be able to have sex, say bad words, and smoke pot... It was easy to claim the non bipartisan position and the high ground by calling libertarian. Most people aren't actually libertarian... Especially teenagers with minimal real world knowledge claiming to be. Think of it as the "moderate" of the time.
It would go a long way if you didnt try to re-write what I said next time...
Nor did I say that's what you said of the sentiment. It would also go a long way for you to not re-write my response next time...
My response, in fact, was entirely responsive to the point you did make. I pretty clearly stated that I thought electing a black POTUS was a good thing precisely because he was black, and that I'm not a racist. There's a little historical context involved on this point. Ignore it if you must.
90% of my post was in disagreement with this idea that you've now proffered twice. So I rewrote and misunderstood nothing. It's a bullshit and disingenuous idea. I know probably 100 people who, for example, firmly support affirmative action in an attempt at social engineering. None of them have a racist bone in their body. Black people who support affirmative action aren't racist against themselves. Nor are well-meaning, though misguided, white people who support it. And affirmative action is based 100% on race and nothing else.
I'll be sure to keep in mind your guidance on quotes.
Just because you believe you are balancing the scales by being racist doesnt mean you aren't being racist.
Voting for someone on the basis of their skin color, not their political merit, is racist.
There are probably a few white supremacists out there talking about social engineering, balancing the scales, and voting based on skin color justifying their beliefs in the same way too.
You want to claim you aren't racist despite a few racist beliefs here or there... whatever...
At least this time you didn't re-write my argument, other than I said nothing about actually having voted for Obama.
With that said, I disagree with the entire premise of your response. You have a rather cute and liberal definition of racism. That is, if the fact of race is considered in any point of view, at all, regardless of context, it's racism.
As for me and my house, we'll go with Webster's, the traditional authority on the meaning of words:
Definition of racism:
1: a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race
2 a: a doctrine or political program based on the assumption of racism and designed to execute its principles b: a political or social system founded on racism
Comments
The Tug makes a living off of focusing on this other behavior and saying that's the real racism. I don't buy it, and this is where I get tagged with being a liberal. I've turned my view on classic "Uncle Tom" rhetoric; but this idea that people who are progressive and spend their time and energy pushing for more blacks and other minorities in this or that segment of society as being racist feels more like a poltical tactic.
And I've never known anyone who pushes a libertarian point of view who ever cheered for Obama just because he's black. That is the last group of people to do that sort of thing. They are all about the opposite of that mind-set. I would profer that those people are not libertarian.
Of course, when you're in your early 20s and still on Daddy's payroll, you can't really internalize that it's still a big deal to live in a million $+ house. It just seems to happen by magic.
I get the supposed feel good vibe and I don't think that supporting a qualified person of color is racist. I do believe that voting for someone based on their skin color and ignoring the fact that barry is an ant-American POS while telling me that he will be the smartest president evah is racist. I prefer that a person be judged on the quality of their character rather than skin color. Meanwhile, the very same people then demand that blacks think like black people and vote like black people are also racists. That includes Biden.
I get it. There is a line somewhere in this point of view where you wonder if the bleeding heart liberal doesn't really harbor a view that "these other people" need our help because they are fundamentally incapable of progressing without it. I know some of these supposed liberal do-gooders who make me wonder if they don't think they are fundamentally superior and are morally obligated to lend a helping hand. Some of those people, as a side note, are some of the worst bullies I've ever known. Worked with quite a few, and you really had to watch your backside with them.
I may be naive, but I think they are not representative. I think the average bleeding heart liberal, especially the kids (I see this at home now), just really buy in to this "but but slavery" bit and think that the lingering effects of that is the real problem and we need to do more to fix it. Those people are incredibly misguided, but I wouldn't call them racist.
I, too, prefer the person to be judged on character and qualifications. That said, I still felt good about Americans electing a black POTUS. It was historically significant. Some of his shortcomings were disappointing, but it still represented, to me, that America is a great country that is always trying to make itself better.
A very real and intellectually interesting question sits out there now: can a black conservative get elected, and if not, why?
If you want serious ballbuster, look no further. Col. West makes sled look like a Jesuit.
I didnt say the sentiment was they were happy to have a well qualified president who happened to be black... I specifically said the sentiment was "how exciting it was to vote for someone because they were black", regardless of merit or political agreement.
Voting for someone because of their race is racism.
Voting for someone because of their genitalia/gender is sexism.
I put libertarian in quotes, that should have been enough for you to understand I wasn't talking about REAL libertarians. Every teenager in my peer group at the time claimed libertarian because we had all been taught Bush was evil and democrats were just the other side of the same coin, we wanted to be able to have sex, say bad words, and smoke pot... It was easy to claim the non bipartisan position and the high ground by calling libertarian. Most people aren't actually libertarian... Especially teenagers with minimal real world knowledge claiming to be. Think of it as the "moderate" of the time.
It would go a long way if you didnt try to re-write what I said next time...
My response, in fact, was entirely responsive to the point you did make. I pretty clearly stated that I thought electing a black POTUS was a good thing precisely because he was black, and that I'm not a racist. There's a little historical context involved on this point. Ignore it if you must.
90% of my post was in disagreement with this idea that you've now proffered twice. So I rewrote and misunderstood nothing. It's a bullshit and disingenuous idea. I know probably 100 people who, for example, firmly support affirmative action in an attempt at social engineering. None of them have a racist bone in their body. Black people who support affirmative action aren't racist against themselves. Nor are well-meaning, though misguided, white people who support it. And affirmative action is based 100% on race and nothing else.
I'll be sure to keep in mind your guidance on quotes.
Voting for someone on the basis of their skin color, not their political merit, is racist.
There are probably a few white supremacists out there talking about social engineering, balancing the scales, and voting based on skin color justifying their beliefs in the same way too.
You want to claim you aren't racist despite a few racist beliefs here or there... whatever...
With that said, I disagree with the entire premise of your response. You have a rather cute and liberal definition of racism. That is, if the fact of race is considered in any point of view, at all, regardless of context, it's racism.
As for me and my house, we'll go with Webster's, the traditional authority on the meaning of words:
Definition of racism:
1: a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race
2
a: a doctrine or political program based on the assumption of racism and designed to execute its principles
b: a political or social system founded on racism
3: racial prejudice or discrimination