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Make Palestine Great Again
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Did they expressly do that for philosophical reasons? Or was their interventionism just a more authoritarian expression of what we? did during WWII, which was tell industry to get their asses in gear and feed the war effort?UW_Doog_Bot said:
Well, I would add, a rejection of capitalism as well. They attempted to plow a "middle road" similar to Nehru in India which, like many examples in history, meant an ever increasing scope of self-justifying interventionism that lead to a full blown state planned economy.creepycoug said:
I think what we've decided here is that it's inaccurate to say that the Nazis "had nothing to do with socialism", but that it wasn't their driving philosophy, at least insofar as Hitler was concerned; and when it comes to the Third Reich, I'm not really all that interested in what anybody other than Hitler thought, because they all lined up directly behind him. By the time they were full on into their thing, he and all his henchmen were much more preoccupied with racial politics and nationalist goals than they were in debating economic theory. I think @UW_Doog_Bot has right: there was likely no real developed economic platform (other than the rejection of Bolshevism). Rather, they did whatever was convenient at the time to keep the machine running. Damone's article points out that, Hitler at least, was a little all over the place on economic decisions.Bendintheriver said:Hey would one of you democrats on here be a real pal and spend some time telling us how Hitler and the Nazi's had nothing to do with socialism? I really would appreciate it and to be honest I find it really, really funny reading all of your historical revisions and attempts to avoid the truth. Thanks again. I will sit back and read your responses now without interruption.
To me, it's just that, another failed example of the center left and "moderate restraint of the free market".
Because those passages I cited of Hitler's commentary make him sound like a capitalist, at least from a philosophical standpoint. The comment about "by what right do they [the workers] have to that property [of the factory owner]?" seems supportive of the notion of private property, which I'm sure you'd agree is a first principle for a free market economy. And we know he hated the Bolsheviks, which is just a block further down the road from socialism.
I think the thing that fucks up the analysis is that the Nazis rose to power out of austerity and quickly jumped into wartim economis. Anyway, we've beaten this to death, and the overarching point, I think, is that it is of limited utility to compare current political movements, be they left or right, to the Nazis, who were their own brand of crazy. -
Sure. We just need mor tim to get "real" capitalism in place. We're still not there IMHO.UW_Doog_Bot said:
I know, it was moar for the idiots in the back of the crowd who might be thinking "aha! capitalism bad!".YellowSnow said:
We've already discussed at great length the subject and I never disagreed with you, so don't twist. A better form of free-market capitalism, with sound monetary policy and good safety nets (unemployment insurance) would likely avoided the Great Depression. But still...UW_Doog_Bot said:
You call it the failure of capitalism but I've got plenty of government regulations and market interference to point to in that era. Don't make me start citing economic historians before pointing fingers at my free markets.YellowSnow said:
Interestingly enough, if it wasn't for the failure of American capitalism (far less regulated than it is nowadays mind you) in the period circa 1929- 32, the NSDAP would have never won enough seats in the Reichstag for Hitler to be named Chancellor.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Well, I would add, a rejection of capitalism as well. They attempted to plow a "middle road" similar to Nehru in India which, like many examples in history, meant an ever increasing scope of self-justifying interventionism that lead to a full blown state planned economy.creepycoug said:
I think what we've decided here is that it's inaccurate to say that the Nazis "had nothing to do with socialism", but that it wasn't their driving philosophy, at least insofar as Hitler was concerned; and when it comes to the Third Reich, I'm not really all that interested in what anybody other than Hitler thought, because they all lined up directly behind him. By the time they were full on into their thing, he and all his henchmen were much more preoccupied with racial politics and nationalist goals than they were in debating economic theory. I think @UW_Doog_Bot has right: there was likely no real developed economic platform (other than the rejection of Bolshevism). Rather, they did whatever was convenient at the time to keep the machine running. Damone's article points out that, Hitler at least, was a little all over the place on economic decisions.Bendintheriver said:Hey would one of you democrats on here be a real pal and spend some time telling us how Hitler and the Nazi's had nothing to do with socialism? I really would appreciate it and to be honest I find it really, really funny reading all of your historical revisions and attempts to avoid the truth. Thanks again. I will sit back and read your responses now without interruption.
To me, it's just that, another failed example of the center left and "moderate restraint of the free market".
Sometimes though you gotta judge an economis system by how it has fared in practice, as opposed to how it could really work terrifically in theory. Obviously, our model, however flawed, has generated the highest standard of living in the world for a large, diverse country (Switzerland, Luxembourg, Norway, etc, are not relevant models).
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We've run (one of) the free-ist economies in the world and are the richest for it. Might be tim to think about mor freedom.YellowSnow said:
Sure. We just need mor tim to get "real" capitalism in place. We're still not there IMHO.UW_Doog_Bot said:
I know, it was moar for the idiots in the back of the crowd who might be thinking "aha! capitalism bad!".YellowSnow said:
We've already discussed at great length the subject and I never disagreed with you, so don't twist. A better form of free-market capitalism, with sound monetary policy and good safety nets (unemployment insurance) would likely avoided the Great Depression. But still...UW_Doog_Bot said:
You call it the failure of capitalism but I've got plenty of government regulations and market interference to point to in that era. Don't make me start citing economic historians before pointing fingers at my free markets.YellowSnow said:
Interestingly enough, if it wasn't for the failure of American capitalism (far less regulated than it is nowadays mind you) in the period circa 1929- 32, the NSDAP would have never won enough seats in the Reichstag for Hitler to be named Chancellor.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Well, I would add, a rejection of capitalism as well. They attempted to plow a "middle road" similar to Nehru in India which, like many examples in history, meant an ever increasing scope of self-justifying interventionism that lead to a full blown state planned economy.creepycoug said:
I think what we've decided here is that it's inaccurate to say that the Nazis "had nothing to do with socialism", but that it wasn't their driving philosophy, at least insofar as Hitler was concerned; and when it comes to the Third Reich, I'm not really all that interested in what anybody other than Hitler thought, because they all lined up directly behind him. By the time they were full on into their thing, he and all his henchmen were much more preoccupied with racial politics and nationalist goals than they were in debating economic theory. I think @UW_Doog_Bot has right: there was likely no real developed economic platform (other than the rejection of Bolshevism). Rather, they did whatever was convenient at the time to keep the machine running. Damone's article points out that, Hitler at least, was a little all over the place on economic decisions.Bendintheriver said:Hey would one of you democrats on here be a real pal and spend some time telling us how Hitler and the Nazi's had nothing to do with socialism? I really would appreciate it and to be honest I find it really, really funny reading all of your historical revisions and attempts to avoid the truth. Thanks again. I will sit back and read your responses now without interruption.
To me, it's just that, another failed example of the center left and "moderate restraint of the free market".
Sometimes though you gotta judge an economis system by how it has fared in practice, as opposed to how it could really work terrifically in theory. Obviously, our model, however flawed, has generated the highest standard of living in the world for a large, diverse country (Switzerland, Luxembourg, Norway, etc, are not relevant models). -
Yes, we need to eliminate counter-productive distortions to the market place, and send all the rent-seeking professions (hi @creepycoug ) to the gulag!!UW_Doog_Bot said:
We've run (one of) the free-ist economies in the world and are the richest for it. Might be tim to think about mor freedom.YellowSnow said:
Sure. We just need mor tim to get "real" capitalism in place. We're still not there IMHO.UW_Doog_Bot said:
I know, it was moar for the idiots in the back of the crowd who might be thinking "aha! capitalism bad!".YellowSnow said:
We've already discussed at great length the subject and I never disagreed with you, so don't twist. A better form of free-market capitalism, with sound monetary policy and good safety nets (unemployment insurance) would likely avoided the Great Depression. But still...UW_Doog_Bot said:
You call it the failure of capitalism but I've got plenty of government regulations and market interference to point to in that era. Don't make me start citing economic historians before pointing fingers at my free markets.YellowSnow said:
Interestingly enough, if it wasn't for the failure of American capitalism (far less regulated than it is nowadays mind you) in the period circa 1929- 32, the NSDAP would have never won enough seats in the Reichstag for Hitler to be named Chancellor.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Well, I would add, a rejection of capitalism as well. They attempted to plow a "middle road" similar to Nehru in India which, like many examples in history, meant an ever increasing scope of self-justifying interventionism that lead to a full blown state planned economy.creepycoug said:
I think what we've decided here is that it's inaccurate to say that the Nazis "had nothing to do with socialism", but that it wasn't their driving philosophy, at least insofar as Hitler was concerned; and when it comes to the Third Reich, I'm not really all that interested in what anybody other than Hitler thought, because they all lined up directly behind him. By the time they were full on into their thing, he and all his henchmen were much more preoccupied with racial politics and nationalist goals than they were in debating economic theory. I think @UW_Doog_Bot has right: there was likely no real developed economic platform (other than the rejection of Bolshevism). Rather, they did whatever was convenient at the time to keep the machine running. Damone's article points out that, Hitler at least, was a little all over the place on economic decisions.Bendintheriver said:Hey would one of you democrats on here be a real pal and spend some time telling us how Hitler and the Nazi's had nothing to do with socialism? I really would appreciate it and to be honest I find it really, really funny reading all of your historical revisions and attempts to avoid the truth. Thanks again. I will sit back and read your responses now without interruption.
To me, it's just that, another failed example of the center left and "moderate restraint of the free market".
Sometimes though you gotta judge an economis system by how it has fared in practice, as opposed to how it could really work terrifically in theory. Obviously, our model, however flawed, has generated the highest standard of living in the world for a large, diverse country (Switzerland, Luxembourg, Norway, etc, are not relevant models). -
I like it when you talk free-market economis to me. PM me bro.YellowSnow said:
Yes, we need to eliminate counter-productive distortions to the market place, and send all the rent-seeking professions (hi @creepycoug ) to the gulag!!UW_Doog_Bot said:
We've run (one of) the free-ist economies in the world and are the richest for it. Might be tim to think about mor freedom.YellowSnow said:
Sure. We just need mor tim to get "real" capitalism in place. We're still not there IMHO.UW_Doog_Bot said:
I know, it was moar for the idiots in the back of the crowd who might be thinking "aha! capitalism bad!".YellowSnow said:
We've already discussed at great length the subject and I never disagreed with you, so don't twist. A better form of free-market capitalism, with sound monetary policy and good safety nets (unemployment insurance) would likely avoided the Great Depression. But still...UW_Doog_Bot said:
You call it the failure of capitalism but I've got plenty of government regulations and market interference to point to in that era. Don't make me start citing economic historians before pointing fingers at my free markets.YellowSnow said:
Interestingly enough, if it wasn't for the failure of American capitalism (far less regulated than it is nowadays mind you) in the period circa 1929- 32, the NSDAP would have never won enough seats in the Reichstag for Hitler to be named Chancellor.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Well, I would add, a rejection of capitalism as well. They attempted to plow a "middle road" similar to Nehru in India which, like many examples in history, meant an ever increasing scope of self-justifying interventionism that lead to a full blown state planned economy.creepycoug said:
I think what we've decided here is that it's inaccurate to say that the Nazis "had nothing to do with socialism", but that it wasn't their driving philosophy, at least insofar as Hitler was concerned; and when it comes to the Third Reich, I'm not really all that interested in what anybody other than Hitler thought, because they all lined up directly behind him. By the time they were full on into their thing, he and all his henchmen were much more preoccupied with racial politics and nationalist goals than they were in debating economic theory. I think @UW_Doog_Bot has right: there was likely no real developed economic platform (other than the rejection of Bolshevism). Rather, they did whatever was convenient at the time to keep the machine running. Damone's article points out that, Hitler at least, was a little all over the place on economic decisions.Bendintheriver said:Hey would one of you democrats on here be a real pal and spend some time telling us how Hitler and the Nazi's had nothing to do with socialism? I really would appreciate it and to be honest I find it really, really funny reading all of your historical revisions and attempts to avoid the truth. Thanks again. I will sit back and read your responses now without interruption.
To me, it's just that, another failed example of the center left and "moderate restraint of the free market".
Sometimes though you gotta judge an economis system by how it has fared in practice, as opposed to how it could really work terrifically in theory. Obviously, our model, however flawed, has generated the highest standard of living in the world for a large, diverse country (Switzerland, Luxembourg, Norway, etc, are not relevant models). -
Get a room you two fancy boys.UW_Doog_Bot said:
I like it when you talk free-market economis to me. PM me bro.YellowSnow said:
Yes, we need to eliminate counter-productive distortions to the market place, and send all the rent-seeking professions (hi @creepycoug ) to the gulag!!UW_Doog_Bot said:
We've run (one of) the free-ist economies in the world and are the richest for it. Might be tim to think about mor freedom.YellowSnow said:
Sure. We just need mor tim to get "real" capitalism in place. We're still not there IMHO.UW_Doog_Bot said:
I know, it was moar for the idiots in the back of the crowd who might be thinking "aha! capitalism bad!".YellowSnow said:
We've already discussed at great length the subject and I never disagreed with you, so don't twist. A better form of free-market capitalism, with sound monetary policy and good safety nets (unemployment insurance) would likely avoided the Great Depression. But still...UW_Doog_Bot said:
You call it the failure of capitalism but I've got plenty of government regulations and market interference to point to in that era. Don't make me start citing economic historians before pointing fingers at my free markets.YellowSnow said:
Interestingly enough, if it wasn't for the failure of American capitalism (far less regulated than it is nowadays mind you) in the period circa 1929- 32, the NSDAP would have never won enough seats in the Reichstag for Hitler to be named Chancellor.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Well, I would add, a rejection of capitalism as well. They attempted to plow a "middle road" similar to Nehru in India which, like many examples in history, meant an ever increasing scope of self-justifying interventionism that lead to a full blown state planned economy.creepycoug said:
I think what we've decided here is that it's inaccurate to say that the Nazis "had nothing to do with socialism", but that it wasn't their driving philosophy, at least insofar as Hitler was concerned; and when it comes to the Third Reich, I'm not really all that interested in what anybody other than Hitler thought, because they all lined up directly behind him. By the time they were full on into their thing, he and all his henchmen were much more preoccupied with racial politics and nationalist goals than they were in debating economic theory. I think @UW_Doog_Bot has right: there was likely no real developed economic platform (other than the rejection of Bolshevism). Rather, they did whatever was convenient at the time to keep the machine running. Damone's article points out that, Hitler at least, was a little all over the place on economic decisions.Bendintheriver said:Hey would one of you democrats on here be a real pal and spend some time telling us how Hitler and the Nazi's had nothing to do with socialism? I really would appreciate it and to be honest I find it really, really funny reading all of your historical revisions and attempts to avoid the truth. Thanks again. I will sit back and read your responses now without interruption.
To me, it's just that, another failed example of the center left and "moderate restraint of the free market".
Sometimes though you gotta judge an economis system by how it has fared in practice, as opposed to how it could really work terrifically in theory. Obviously, our model, however flawed, has generated the highest standard of living in the world for a large, diverse country (Switzerland, Luxembourg, Norway, etc, are not relevant models). -
We already tried. I'm too slow strategy.creepycoug said:
Get a room you two fancy boys.UW_Doog_Bot said:
I like it when you talk free-market economis to me. PM me bro.YellowSnow said:
Yes, we need to eliminate counter-productive distortions to the market place, and send all the rent-seeking professions (hi @creepycoug ) to the gulag!!UW_Doog_Bot said:
We've run (one of) the free-ist economies in the world and are the richest for it. Might be tim to think about mor freedom.YellowSnow said:
Sure. We just need mor tim to get "real" capitalism in place. We're still not there IMHO.UW_Doog_Bot said:
I know, it was moar for the idiots in the back of the crowd who might be thinking "aha! capitalism bad!".YellowSnow said:
We've already discussed at great length the subject and I never disagreed with you, so don't twist. A better form of free-market capitalism, with sound monetary policy and good safety nets (unemployment insurance) would likely avoided the Great Depression. But still...UW_Doog_Bot said:
You call it the failure of capitalism but I've got plenty of government regulations and market interference to point to in that era. Don't make me start citing economic historians before pointing fingers at my free markets.YellowSnow said:
Interestingly enough, if it wasn't for the failure of American capitalism (far less regulated than it is nowadays mind you) in the period circa 1929- 32, the NSDAP would have never won enough seats in the Reichstag for Hitler to be named Chancellor.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Well, I would add, a rejection of capitalism as well. They attempted to plow a "middle road" similar to Nehru in India which, like many examples in history, meant an ever increasing scope of self-justifying interventionism that lead to a full blown state planned economy.creepycoug said:
I think what we've decided here is that it's inaccurate to say that the Nazis "had nothing to do with socialism", but that it wasn't their driving philosophy, at least insofar as Hitler was concerned; and when it comes to the Third Reich, I'm not really all that interested in what anybody other than Hitler thought, because they all lined up directly behind him. By the time they were full on into their thing, he and all his henchmen were much more preoccupied with racial politics and nationalist goals than they were in debating economic theory. I think @UW_Doog_Bot has right: there was likely no real developed economic platform (other than the rejection of Bolshevism). Rather, they did whatever was convenient at the time to keep the machine running. Damone's article points out that, Hitler at least, was a little all over the place on economic decisions.Bendintheriver said:Hey would one of you democrats on here be a real pal and spend some time telling us how Hitler and the Nazi's had nothing to do with socialism? I really would appreciate it and to be honest I find it really, really funny reading all of your historical revisions and attempts to avoid the truth. Thanks again. I will sit back and read your responses now without interruption.
To me, it's just that, another failed example of the center left and "moderate restraint of the free market".
Sometimes though you gotta judge an economis system by how it has fared in practice, as opposed to how it could really work terrifically in theory. Obviously, our model, however flawed, has generated the highest standard of living in the world for a large, diverse country (Switzerland, Luxembourg, Norway, etc, are not relevant models). -
menagie troi-market capitalism #metooUW_Doog_Bot said:
I like it when you talk free-market economis to me. PM me bro.YellowSnow said:
Yes, we need to eliminate counter-productive distortions to the market place, and send all the rent-seeking professions (hi @creepycoug ) to the gulag!!UW_Doog_Bot said:
We've run (one of) the free-ist economies in the world and are the richest for it. Might be tim to think about mor freedom.YellowSnow said:
Sure. We just need mor tim to get "real" capitalism in place. We're still not there IMHO.UW_Doog_Bot said:
I know, it was moar for the idiots in the back of the crowd who might be thinking "aha! capitalism bad!".YellowSnow said:
We've already discussed at great length the subject and I never disagreed with you, so don't twist. A better form of free-market capitalism, with sound monetary policy and good safety nets (unemployment insurance) would likely avoided the Great Depression. But still...UW_Doog_Bot said:
You call it the failure of capitalism but I've got plenty of government regulations and market interference to point to in that era. Don't make me start citing economic historians before pointing fingers at my free markets.YellowSnow said:
Interestingly enough, if it wasn't for the failure of American capitalism (far less regulated than it is nowadays mind you) in the period circa 1929- 32, the NSDAP would have never won enough seats in the Reichstag for Hitler to be named Chancellor.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Well, I would add, a rejection of capitalism as well. They attempted to plow a "middle road" similar to Nehru in India which, like many examples in history, meant an ever increasing scope of self-justifying interventionism that lead to a full blown state planned economy.creepycoug said:
I think what we've decided here is that it's inaccurate to say that the Nazis "had nothing to do with socialism", but that it wasn't their driving philosophy, at least insofar as Hitler was concerned; and when it comes to the Third Reich, I'm not really all that interested in what anybody other than Hitler thought, because they all lined up directly behind him. By the time they were full on into their thing, he and all his henchmen were much more preoccupied with racial politics and nationalist goals than they were in debating economic theory. I think @UW_Doog_Bot has right: there was likely no real developed economic platform (other than the rejection of Bolshevism). Rather, they did whatever was convenient at the time to keep the machine running. Damone's article points out that, Hitler at least, was a little all over the place on economic decisions.Bendintheriver said:Hey would one of you democrats on here be a real pal and spend some time telling us how Hitler and the Nazi's had nothing to do with socialism? I really would appreciate it and to be honest I find it really, really funny reading all of your historical revisions and attempts to avoid the truth. Thanks again. I will sit back and read your responses now without interruption.
To me, it's just that, another failed example of the center left and "moderate restraint of the free market".
Sometimes though you gotta judge an economis system by how it has fared in practice, as opposed to how it could really work terrifically in theory. Obviously, our model, however flawed, has generated the highest standard of living in the world for a large, diverse country (Switzerland, Luxembourg, Norway, etc, are not relevant models).
