Socialism's abject failure

Sledog

Even criminals can't get by!

https://www.insightcrime.org/news/brief/venezuela-crime-literally-doesnt-pay/

greenblood

Though I agree that socialism is unsustainable and a terrible economic strategy, Venezuela isn’t a great example. Norway, Finland, Denmark, etc are better comparisons.

UW_Doog_Bot

greenblood said:

Though I agree that socialism is unsustainable and a terrible economic strategy, Venezuela isn’t a great example. Norway, Finland, Denmark, etc should be monitored more closely.

Not actually socialist countries despite the American Left's insistence that they are.

Sure, generous welfare systems BUT all of them have little resistance to free trade, no minimum wage, and universal school choice/voucher systems. All policies the American Left would consider DOA.

Norway particularly, resembles a Middle East Petro-state more than a "socialist model".

YellowSnow

I beseech ye all on the bowels of Christ, can we please come to an agreement in the Tug as to what we are calling REAL socialism vs high tax/generous welfare states with market economies?

UW_Doog_Bot

YellowSnow said:

I beseech ye all on the bowels of Christ, can we please come to an agreement in the Tug as to what we are calling REAL socialism vs high tax/generous welfare states with market economies?

HHusky

UW_Doog_Bot said:

greenblood said:

Though I agree that socialism is unsustainable and a terrible economic strategy, Venezuela isn’t a great example. Norway, Finland, Denmark, etc should be monitored more closely.

Not actually socialist countries despite the American Left's insistence that they are.

Sure, generous welfare systems BUT all of them have little resistance to free trade, no minimum wage, and universal school choice/voucher systems. All policies the American Left would consider DOA.

Norway particularly, resembles a Middle East Petro-state more than a "socialist model".

The Sultan of Norway and I laffed.

HardlyClothed

HHusky said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

greenblood said:

Though I agree that socialism is unsustainable and a terrible economic strategy, Venezuela isn’t a great example. Norway, Finland, Denmark, etc should be monitored more closely.

Not actually socialist countries despite the American Left's insistence that they are.

Sure, generous welfare systems BUT all of them have little resistance to free trade, no minimum wage, and universal school choice/voucher systems. All policies the American Left would consider DOA.

Norway particularly, resembles a Middle East Petro-state more than a "socialist model".

The Sultan of Norway and I laffed.

When you ask these right-wingers whether we can have these “capitalist” Nordic economies here, including a sovereign wealth fund, over 50% union membership, and generous welfare benefits, the answer is always no.

SFGbob

Boy do liberal Kunts love Welfare.

UW_Doog_Bot

HardlyClothed said:

HHusky said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

greenblood said:

Though I agree that socialism is unsustainable and a terrible economic strategy, Venezuela isn’t a great example. Norway, Finland, Denmark, etc should be monitored more closely.

Not actually socialist countries despite the American Left's insistence that they are.

Sure, generous welfare systems BUT all of them have little resistance to free trade, no minimum wage, and universal school choice/voucher systems. All policies the American Left would consider DOA.

Norway particularly, resembles a Middle East Petro-state more than a "socialist model".

The Sultan of Norway and I laffed.

When you ask these right-wingers whether we can have these “capitalist” Nordic economies here, including a sovereign wealth fund, over 50% union membership, and generous welfare benefits, the answer is always no.

Yes(though it's uneccessary with the current Dollar reserve status which you don't understand one bit)

Yes, free markets allow for free association, just don't make laws forbidding non-union workers from working...

Depends, do state sponsored vouchers get to be used as the recipient sees fit(school choice) or does the state get to tell them what they get and they'll like it?

Thanks for proving my point that leftists are by and large ignorant of any of the details.

UW_Doog_Bot

HHusky said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

greenblood said:

Though I agree that socialism is unsustainable and a terrible economic strategy, Venezuela isn’t a great example. Norway, Finland, Denmark, etc should be monitored more closely.

Not actually socialist countries despite the American Left's insistence that they are.

Sure, generous welfare systems BUT all of them have little resistance to free trade, no minimum wage, and universal school choice/voucher systems. All policies the American Left would consider DOA.

Norway particularly, resembles a Middle East Petro-state more than a "socialist model".

The Sultan of Norway and I laffed.

The Government Pension Fund Global, also known as the Oil Fund, was established in 1990 to invest the surplus revenues of the Norwegian petroleum sector. It has over US$1 trillion in assets, including 1.3% of global stocks and shares, making it the world’s largest sovereign wealth fund.[1] In May 2018 it was worth about $195,000 per Norwegian citizen.[2]

Gwad

SFGbob has got life figured out. Thats why he is choosing to be here angry.

allpurpleallgold

RaceBannon

RaceBannon

RaceBannon

UW_Doog_Bot

allpurpleallgold said:

Except I just said I'll happily do things like,

create an educational voucher system,

eliminate minimum wage,

sign more free trade agreements and reduce regulatory burden,

Why don't you want to do those things? They work in Scandinavian countries.

allpurpleallgold

UW_Doog_Bot said:

allpurpleallgold said:

Except I just said I'll happily do things like,

create an educational voucher system,

eliminate minimum wage,

sign more free trade agreements and reduce regulatory burden,

Why don't you want to do those things? They work in Scandinavian countries.

I mean most jobs do have a minimum wage, it’s just not federal. If you want to give unions the same amount of power here that they have there, then eliminate that shit.

UW_Doog_Bot

allpurpleallgold said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

allpurpleallgold said:

Except I just said I'll happily do things like,

create an educational voucher system,

eliminate minimum wage,

sign more free trade agreements and reduce regulatory burden,

Why don't you want to do those things? They work in Scandinavian countries.

I mean most jobs do have a minimum wage, it’s just not federal. If you want to give unions the same amount of power here that they have there, then eliminate that shit.

How do you propose to "give" unions that power.

I'm fine if people mobilize themselves into unions. I actually think it can be a very good thing when unions align themselves to balance workers stakes vs. staying competitive and in business.

Just keep the state out of all of it, including creating closed shop laws, and we are in agreement.

allpurpleallgold

UW_Doog_Bot said:

allpurpleallgold said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

allpurpleallgold said:

Except I just said I'll happily do things like,

create an educational voucher system,

eliminate minimum wage,

sign more free trade agreements and reduce regulatory burden,

Why don't you want to do those things? They work in Scandinavian countries.

I mean most jobs do have a minimum wage, it’s just not federal. If you want to give unions the same amount of power here that they have there, then eliminate that shit.

How do you propose to "give" unions that power.

I'm fine if people mobilize themselves into unions. I actually think it can be a very good thing when unions align themselves to balance workers stakes vs. staying competitive and in business.

Just keep the state out of all of it, including creating closed shop laws, and we are in agreement.

You’re the one that wants to eliminate minimum wage, you figure out. No federal minimum wage works in those countries because of unions, get the US to match their union participation rate and it’s all yours.

UW_Doog_Bot

allpurpleallgold said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

allpurpleallgold said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

allpurpleallgold said:

Except I just said I'll happily do things like,

create an educational voucher system,

eliminate minimum wage,

sign more free trade agreements and reduce regulatory burden,

Why don't you want to do those things? They work in Scandinavian countries.

I mean most jobs do have a minimum wage, it’s just not federal. If you want to give unions the same amount of power here that they have there, then eliminate that shit.

How do you propose to "give" unions that power.

I'm fine if people mobilize themselves into unions. I actually think it can be a very good thing when unions align themselves to balance workers stakes vs. staying competitive and in business.

Just keep the state out of all of it, including creating closed shop laws, and we are in agreement.

You’re the one that wants to eliminate minimum wage, you figure out. No federal minimum wage works in those countries because of unions, get the US to match their union participation rate and it’s all yours.

It's almost like in the absence of state central planning, market organization will occur because of market demands...

I digress, sure doesn't sound like socialismo. What exactly is it that you want to copy from Scandinavian countries?

Swaye

UW_Doog_Bot said:

allpurpleallgold said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

allpurpleallgold said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

allpurpleallgold said:

Except I just said I'll happily do things like,

create an educational voucher system,

eliminate minimum wage,

sign more free trade agreements and reduce regulatory burden,

Why don't you want to do those things? They work in Scandinavian countries.

I mean most jobs do have a minimum wage, it’s just not federal. If you want to give unions the same amount of power here that they have there, then eliminate that shit.

How do you propose to "give" unions that power.

I'm fine if people mobilize themselves into unions. I actually think it can be a very good thing when unions align themselves to balance workers stakes vs. staying competitive and in business.

Just keep the state out of all of it, including creating closed shop laws, and we are in agreement.

You’re the one that wants to eliminate minimum wage, you figure out. No federal minimum wage works in those countries because of unions, get the US to match their union participation rate and it’s all yours.

It's almost like in the absence of state central planning, market organization will occur because of market demands...

I digress, sure doesn't sound like socialismo. What exactly is it that you want to copy from Scandinavian countries?

Welp, I'd start here: