East Germany was not a Soviet Republic. Nor was Poland and the rest of the Warsaw Pact. Satellites yes, but never part of the Soviet Union. Soviets lost the Cold War and rightly we absorbed those countries into NATA.
Ukraine was an independent country for like a year in 1918- 19, prior to 1992 and has been a part of Russia for many centuries. Nuke deal or not, Ukraine is part of the Russian sphere and not the West, and they are not a hill worth dying for.
I get this point about Ukraine, but the history of Ukraine has more shades of gray than what you're saying about it here. Ukraine was sliced and diced and ruled by that weird Polish-Lithuanian united kingdom and the Ottoman Empire's satellite, and then by the Austrian-Hungarian empire and the Russian Empire. So Mother Russia might have some claims based on history, but the history is a little more complicated.
Yes, sliced and diced a bit but the majority of present day Ukraine has been either in the Russian Empire or USSR for the last 300 years give or take. Half the people there are ethnic Russians.
Well, even if I give you the "speaks Russian so that makes them an ethnic Russian" that's only still really because of colonization and oppression from the last 100 or so years. Kind of justifies them getting back lots of other former Soviet States they might feel they are entitled to whose current civilian populations might object to.
Indeed. Putin routinely invokes protection of indigenous Russians in his threats to the Baltic states. Easy pickings for him and highly doubtful Neville chamberlain trump would challenge him. (See his nato bashing, Crimea and Ukraine). The balkans and Caucasus would surely be next.
Something the democrats told us for about 80 years of communism there
I just have to say I laugh out loud every time these twinks get all patriotic and shit.
It's like OBK rooting for WASHINGTON
In fairness to Trump, the foreign policy establishment has done a shitty jerb vis-a-vis Russia since the 90s. NATO should have never been expanded into any of the former Soviet Republics. Furthermore, we should have just let the Russians have their way with Ukraine. Ukraine has never really been a nation independent from Russia in the first place.
East Germany disagrees. Also, Ukraine gave up their nukes because of our guarantee of national sovereignty...
East Germany was not a Soviet Republic. Nor was Poland and the rest of the Warsaw Pact. Satellites yes, but never part of the Soviet Union. Soviets lost the Cold War and rightly we absorbed those countries into NATA.
Ukraine was an independent country for like a year in 1918- 19, prior to 1992 and has been a part of Russia for many centuries. Nuke deal or not, Ukraine is part of the Russian sphere and not the West, and they are not a hill worth dying for.
Not worth dying for? Perhaps. Still very sad indictment of western failure to push its frontier. Ukraine could be part of the EU over time, if given the protection, and not forsaken to the clutches of tyranny and despotism. Trump’s fecklessness yesterday signed Ukraine’s death warrant.
Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania are NATO Members. We go to war there, correct?
Yes, the Baltic countries are all NATO and we are treaty bound to defend them.
The West absorbed almost all of the Warsaw Pact into it's sphere. This was a pretty YUGE win. Why do we need to go all the way to the Russian border? That fight was never worth picking.
@YellowSnow 24 hours later and it has started. Trump reneging on nato with tucker Carlson. Putin encroached on Estonia airspace on the way to Helsinki.
Something the democrats told us for about 80 years of communism there
I just have to say I laugh out loud every time these twinks get all patriotic and shit.
It's like OBK rooting for WASHINGTON
In fairness to Trump, the foreign policy establishment has done a shitty jerb vis-a-vis Russia since the 90s. NATO should have never been expanded into any of the former Soviet Republics. Furthermore, we should have just let the Russians have their way with Ukraine. Ukraine has never really been a nation independent from Russia in the first place.
East Germany disagrees. Also, Ukraine gave up their nukes because of our guarantee of national sovereignty...
East Germany was not a Soviet Republic. Nor was Poland and the rest of the Warsaw Pact. Satellites yes, but never part of the Soviet Union. Soviets lost the Cold War and rightly we absorbed those countries into NATA.
Ukraine was an independent country for like a year in 1918- 19, prior to 1992 and has been a part of Russia for many centuries. Nuke deal or not, Ukraine is part of the Russian sphere and not the West, and they are not a hill worth dying for.
Not worth dying for? Perhaps. Still very sad indictment of western failure to push its frontier. Ukraine could be part of the EU over time, if given the protection, and not forsaken to the clutches of tyranny and despotism. Trump’s fecklessness yesterday signed Ukraine’s death warrant.
Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania are NATO Members. We go to war there, correct?
Yes, the Baltic countries are all NATO and we are treaty bound to defend them.
The West absorbed almost all of the Warsaw Pact into it's sphere. This was a pretty YUGE win. Why do we need to go all the way to the Russian border? That fight was never worth picking.
@YellowSnow 24 hours later and it has started. Trump reneging on nato with tucker Carlson. Putin encroached on Estonia airspace on the way to Helsinki.
Something the democrats told us for about 80 years of communism there
I just have to say I laugh out loud every time these twinks get all patriotic and shit.
It's like OBK rooting for WASHINGTON
In fairness to Trump, the foreign policy establishment has done a shitty jerb vis-a-vis Russia since the 90s. NATO should have never been expanded into any of the former Soviet Republics. Furthermore, we should have just let the Russians have their way with Ukraine. Ukraine has never really been a nation independent from Russia in the first place.
East Germany disagrees. Also, Ukraine gave up their nukes because of our guarantee of national sovereignty...
East Germany was not a Soviet Republic. Nor was Poland and the rest of the Warsaw Pact. Satellites yes, but never part of the Soviet Union. Soviets lost the Cold War and rightly we absorbed those countries into NATA.
Ukraine was an independent country for like a year in 1918- 19, prior to 1992 and has been a part of Russia for many centuries. Nuke deal or not, Ukraine is part of the Russian sphere and not the West, and they are not a hill worth dying for.
Not worth dying for? Perhaps. Still very sad indictment of western failure to push its frontier. Ukraine could be part of the EU over time, if given the protection, and not forsaken to the clutches of tyranny and despotism. Trump’s fecklessness yesterday signed Ukraine’s death warrant.
Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania are NATO Members. We go to war there, correct?
Yes, the Baltic countries are all NATO and we are treaty bound to defend them.
The West absorbed almost all of the Warsaw Pact into it's sphere. This was a pretty YUGE win. Why do we need to go all the way to the Russian border? That fight was never worth picking.
@YellowSnow 24 hours later and it has started. Trump reneging on nato with tucker Carlson. Putin encroached on Estonia airspace on the way to Helsinki.
Something the democrats told us for about 80 years of communism there
I just have to say I laugh out loud every time these twinks get all patriotic and shit.
It's like OBK rooting for WASHINGTON
In fairness to Trump, the foreign policy establishment has done a shitty jerb vis-a-vis Russia since the 90s. NATO should have never been expanded into any of the former Soviet Republics. Furthermore, we should have just let the Russians have their way with Ukraine. Ukraine has never really been a nation independent from Russia in the first place.
East Germany disagrees. Also, Ukraine gave up their nukes because of our guarantee of national sovereignty...
East Germany was not a Soviet Republic. Nor was Poland and the rest of the Warsaw Pact. Satellites yes, but never part of the Soviet Union. Soviets lost the Cold War and rightly we absorbed those countries into NATA.
Ukraine was an independent country for like a year in 1918- 19, prior to 1992 and has been a part of Russia for many centuries. Nuke deal or not, Ukraine is part of the Russian sphere and not the West, and they are not a hill worth dying for.
Not worth dying for? Perhaps. Still very sad indictment of western failure to push its frontier. Ukraine could be part of the EU over time, if given the protection, and not forsaken to the clutches of tyranny and despotism. Trump’s fecklessness yesterday signed Ukraine’s death warrant.
Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania are NATO Members. We go to war there, correct?
Yes, the Baltic countries are all NATO and we are treaty bound to defend them.
The West absorbed almost all of the Warsaw Pact into it's sphere. This was a pretty YUGE win. Why do we need to go all the way to the Russian border? That fight was never worth picking.
@YellowSnow 24 hours later and it has started. Trump reneging on nato with tucker Carlson. Putin encroached on Estonia airspace on the way to Helsinki.
Something the democrats told us for about 80 years of communism there
I just have to say I laugh out loud every time these twinks get all patriotic and shit.
It's like OBK rooting for WASHINGTON
In fairness to Trump, the foreign policy establishment has done a shitty jerb vis-a-vis Russia since the 90s. NATO should have never been expanded into any of the former Soviet Republics. Furthermore, we should have just let the Russians have their way with Ukraine. Ukraine has never really been a nation independent from Russia in the first place.
East Germany disagrees. Also, Ukraine gave up their nukes because of our guarantee of national sovereignty...
East Germany was not a Soviet Republic. Nor was Poland and the rest of the Warsaw Pact. Satellites yes, but never part of the Soviet Union. Soviets lost the Cold War and rightly we absorbed those countries into NATA.
Ukraine was an independent country for like a year in 1918- 19, prior to 1992 and has been a part of Russia for many centuries. Nuke deal or not, Ukraine is part of the Russian sphere and not the West, and they are not a hill worth dying for.
Not worth dying for? Perhaps. Still very sad indictment of western failure to push its frontier. Ukraine could be part of the EU over time, if given the protection, and not forsaken to the clutches of tyranny and despotism. Trump’s fecklessness yesterday signed Ukraine’s death warrant.
Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania are NATO Members. We go to war there, correct?
Yes, the Baltic countries are all NATO and we are treaty bound to defend them.
The West absorbed almost all of the Warsaw Pact into it's sphere. This was a pretty YUGE win. Why do we need to go all the way to the Russian border? That fight was never worth picking.
@YellowSnow 24 hours later and it has started. Trump reneging on nato with tucker Carlson. Putin encroached on Estonia airspace on the way to Helsinki.
East Germany was not a Soviet Republic. Nor was Poland and the rest of the Warsaw Pact. Satellites yes, but never part of the Soviet Union. Soviets lost the Cold War and rightly we absorbed those countries into NATA.
Ukraine was an independent country for like a year in 1918- 19, prior to 1992 and has been a part of Russia for many centuries. Nuke deal or not, Ukraine is part of the Russian sphere and not the West, and they are not a hill worth dying for.
I get this point about Ukraine, but the history of Ukraine has more shades of gray than what you're saying about it here. Ukraine was sliced and diced and ruled by that weird Polish-Lithuanian united kingdom and the Ottoman Empire's satellite, and then by the Austrian-Hungarian empire and the Russian Empire. So Mother Russia might have some claims based on history, but the history is a little more complicated.
Yes, sliced and diced a bit but the majority of present day Ukraine has been either in the Russian Empire or USSR for the last 300 years give or take. Half the people there are ethnic Russians.
Lets just give the Ukraine lots of weapons and sit around and watch!
East Germany was not a Soviet Republic. Nor was Poland and the rest of the Warsaw Pact. Satellites yes, but never part of the Soviet Union. Soviets lost the Cold War and rightly we absorbed those countries into NATA.
Ukraine was an independent country for like a year in 1918- 19, prior to 1992 and has been a part of Russia for many centuries. Nuke deal or not, Ukraine is part of the Russian sphere and not the West, and they are not a hill worth dying for.
I get this point about Ukraine, but the history of Ukraine has more shades of gray than what you're saying about it here. Ukraine was sliced and diced and ruled by that weird Polish-Lithuanian united kingdom and the Ottoman Empire's satellite, and then by the Austrian-Hungarian empire and the Russian Empire. So Mother Russia might have some claims based on history, but the history is a little more complicated.
Yes, sliced and diced a bit but the majority of present day Ukraine has been either in the Russian Empire or USSR for the last 300 years give or take. Half the people there are ethnic Russians.
Well, even if I give you the "speaks Russian so that makes them an ethnic Russian" that's only still really because of colonization and oppression from the last 100 or so years. Kind of justifies them getting back lots of other former Soviet States they might feel they are entitled to whose current civilian populations might object to.
Comments
That's what you're calling it now?
Trump is delivering peace in our time.
#Winning
Never met one before.
Ukraine is the test case. Trump capitulated.
Treaty bound? Trump?
Peace in our time..,