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Future of Minimum Wage

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  • 2001400ex2001400ex Member Posts: 29,457
    HuskyInAZ said:

    Montana's minimum wage may have jumped from 2007-2009, but please explain why it was $7.25/hour in 2009 and has gone "all the way up" to $8.05/hour in 2015. If that 2 year window you speak about was so successful and a non event to business owners, why were they not able continue the climb?

    I've worked in public accounting (not in mighty Montana), big business and now own my own company. If you think a theoretical spreadsheet with little skin in the game makes you an expert as a business owner, you are more FS than I've given you credit for.
    Montana is mostly run by conservative "poor folk don't need help" politicians that won't raise minimum wage.

    But yes, nice argument. "I used to do this so you are FS". micdrop.gif
  • greenbloodgreenblood Member Posts: 14,559
    edited February 2016
    2001400ex said:

    Yet you still don't get it. Not to mention your math is way fucking off. 2 clerks per shift isn't close to $180k. Remember how a fast food restaurant works. There's a peak time for lunch and dinner rush, other than that, they staff with 1 person at the register the rest of the day. A kiosk won't solve that unless you have a robot bringing people food now.

    Not to mention you don't get the economics at a fast food restaurant. They have a high marginal return on labor. In other words, as sales go up, their labor percentage goes down.

    I remember the same argument in Montana when minimum wage went from 5.15 to 7.25 in 2 years. What happened to fast food restaurants? They grew and more than covered the cost of the labor. Weird, right? Not really when you look at the percentage of fast food money that comes from minimum wage people.

    I am curious tho, what type of small business do you run?
    My argument is that they won't have somebody delivering food. How hard is it for a cook to intercom "#54 your order is ready" hell pizza parlors do it, why can't McDonald's?

    APAG how much do you think a hamburger patty costs the food chain? That's what I thought. just like apvie ticket kiosk, they wouldn't make it until you processed the order, but even then most of the food is pre-made anyways, especially during rush times.

    The problem with you APAG is that Honda isn't right, you're just as clueless as he is.

    Fast food doesn't have as high a return as you think. They have great output but let's also not forget, the average order is around $5.00 per person, and that's gross revenue.
  • SwayeSwaye Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 41,738 Founders Club
    Orkin just kicked me to 15 bucks an hour to head off my inevitable hunger strike.
  • greenbloodgreenblood Member Posts: 14,559
    edited February 2016
    I also love the argument that the loss of these minimum wage jobs will be replaced by IT jobs.

    You trade in 4-5 minimum wage jobs for 1 IT job, and even then, these minimum wage earners aren't skilled to take these IT jobs, so all you're doing is increasing the welfare pool.
  • HuskyJWHuskyJW Member Posts: 15,231
    None of these scenarios will happen.

    Life will stay the fucking the same....wages go up...prices will go up and it's going to be status quo. BFD.
  • 2001400ex2001400ex Member Posts: 29,457

    My argument is that they won't have somebody delivering food. How hard is it for a cook to intercom "#54 your order is ready" hell pizza parlors do it, why can't McDonald's?

    APAG how much do you think a hamburger patty costs the food chain? That's what I thought. just like apvie ticket kiosk, they wouldn't make it until you processed the order, but even then most of the food is pre-made anyways, especially during rush times.

    The problem with you APAG is that Honda isn't right, you're just as clueless as he is.

    Fast food doesn't have as high a return as you think. They have great output but let's also not forget, the average order is around $5.00 per person, and that's gross revenue.
    You didn't answer my question. You said you run a small business so you know about payroll taxes. What small business?

    Not to mention the rest of your post is FS.
  • GreenRiverGatorzGreenRiverGatorz Member Posts: 10,165
    It sounds like we should be expanding education so that we can retrain these minimum wage slaves who don't have a future in this new economy. Whether we make them obsolete in ten years or twenty is missing the point; sooner or later they are going to need to obtain new skills.

    Bernie may be perverting the capitalist incentives that make higher ed so successful in this country with his free college tuition handouts, but he has the right end goal in mind, and AFAIK is the only candidate who has made the issue an integral part of their platform. Unless we make a commitment to retraining these folks, we're only arguing about how long the band-aid is going to stay on.
  • greenbloodgreenblood Member Posts: 14,559
    edited February 2016
    2001400ex said:

    You didn't answer my question. You said you run a small business so you know about payroll taxes. What small business?

    Not to mention the rest of your post is FS.
    I own an Orkin Branch. Ask Swaye
  • SwayeSwaye Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 41,738 Founders Club

    I own an Orkin Branch. Ask Swaye
    It's true. He's my boss. He makes me do demeaning things while nude. I love this job.
  • Fire_Marshall_BillFire_Marshall_Bill Member Posts: 25,482
    Someone brought up the supermarket comparison. A few have the automated check-outs but most don't. Albertson's got rid of them, at least around here. No Safeways have them. Neither do Trader Joe, Whore Foods, I mean Whole Foods...sorry Stalin, Sprouts, hippy organic places or Food City. Fry's has some, but they also usually have at least two or three breather checkout folks, and 5-8 during peak business times. I remember people freaking out about automation in groceries around 2001 when these first started and 15 years later they really haven't replaced many jobs. A lot of people, even borderline misanthropes such as myself find this kind of thing impersonal and rarely use it.
  • greenbloodgreenblood Member Posts: 14,559
    edited February 2016

    Someone brought up the supermarket comparison. A few have the automated check-outs but most don't. Albertson's got rid of them, at least around here. No Safeways have them. Neither do Trader Joe, Whore Foods, I mean Whole Foods...sorry Stalin, Sprouts, hippy organic places or Food City. Fry's has some, but they also usually have at least two or three breather checkout folks, and 5-8 during peak business times. I remember people freaking out about automation in groceries around 2001 when these first started and 15 years later they really haven't replaced many jobs. A lot of people, even borderline misanthropes such as myself find this kind of thing impersonal and rarely use it.

    Walmart, Home Depot, Fred Meyer, and Haggen has them. Walmart, Fred Meyer, and Haggen have a 50/50 split right now between automated and personal checkout. Home Depot has more automated checkouts than personal checkouts. This is the breakdown for the Eugene area stores, I can't speak on a National level.
  • SwayeSwaye Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 41,738 Founders Club
    Lucky for me I only shop at titty bars. No robots seen yet, though I am hopeful.

    image
  • McRibMcRib Member Posts: 227

    I welcome our robot overlords

    this

  • 2001400ex2001400ex Member Posts: 29,457
    Swaye said:

    It's true. He's my boss. He makes me do demeaning things while nude. I love this job.
    https://youtu.be/PZtxBZ9D5sI
  • KaepskneeKaepsknee Member Posts: 14,913

    Obviously I didn't read all of this but I'm standing by the fast food thing being wrong. Fast food places will try it but it won't work. People will fuck up way more orders than a cashier would and they'll take longer. When you press Big Mac and then 10 seconds later switch to a quarter pounder you've cost McDonald's money.

    The only time it would be viable would be during slow hours but you still need people to hand out the food. You could save maybe two shifts a day and anything you'd be saving would be cut into by food waste from dumb fucks that don't know how to order (50% of the customers).
    Sounds like you may have some first hand knowledge of the process. But then again who didn't flip some sub quality meat in their HS daze.
  • allpurpleallgoldallpurpleallgold Member Posts: 8,771

    My argument is that they won't have somebody delivering food. How hard is it for a cook to intercom "#54 your order is ready" hell pizza parlors do it, why can't McDonald's?

    APAG how much do you think a hamburger patty costs the food chain? That's what I thought. just like apvie ticket kiosk, they wouldn't make it until you processed the order, but even then most of the food is pre-made anyways, especially during rush times.

    The problem with you APAG is that Honda isn't right, you're just as clueless as he is.

    Fast food doesn't have as high a return as you think. They have great output but let's also not forget, the average order is around $5.00 per person, and that's gross revenue.
    Pre-made lol. Ok you're just popping off to pop off.

    Why don't you go tell a manager at any fast food restaurant that you have a brilliant plan to save them money, all they have to do is increase food cost and customer wait times. See how they react.
  • greenbloodgreenblood Member Posts: 14,559
    edited February 2016

    Pre-made lol. Ok you're just popping off to pop off.

    Why don't you go tell a manager at any fast food restaurant that you have a brilliant plan to save them money, all they have to do is increase food cost and customer wait times. See how they react.
    So you've obviously haven't seen the dividers behind the cash clerk that's stacked 6 high with pre-made cheeseburgers and quarter pounders during peak times. Gotcha
  • RaceBannonRaceBannon Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 113,058 Founders Club
    Banks are incrementally getting rid of tellers. Bringing ATMs inside and placing them at the teller line. Bank of America already has some branches with no tellers at all.

    You'd be surprised at how many folks still want to wait in line to talk to a teller
  • BennyBeaverBennyBeaver Member Posts: 13,346

    No Safeways have them.

    False.
  • KaepskneeKaepsknee Member Posts: 14,913

    That's funny, because I run a small business. By paying payroll taxes every quarter, I think I have a better understanding than you on employee cost.
    Hondo understands how to cut and paste from Wikipedia and not much more.
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