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pawz
Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 22,433 
in Tug Tavern
And free markets.
Hondo, notsomuch.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-to-issue-executive-order-on-health-care-price-transparency-11561051500
Trump to Issue Executive Order on Health-Care Price Transparency
The president on Monday will call for insurers and doctors to disclose new details about the cost of care, a move that industry groups have resisted
By Stephanie Armour
Updated June 20, 2019 5:17 pm ET
President Trump plans to issue an executive order Monday to compel the disclosure of prices in health care, according to people familiar with the matter.
The order will direct federal agencies to initiate regulations and guidance that could require insurers, doctors, hospitals and others in the industry to provide information about the negotiated and often discounted cost of care, sources said.
Consumers and employers will benefit because pulling back the secrecy around the prices will allow them to shop for lower cost care and benefits, advocates say.
But industry groups including hospitals and insurers have balked at the idea, saying it could cause costs to climb if some businesses learn competitors are getting bigger discounts. They also say consumers really want to know their own out-of-pocket costs and won’t benefit from full disclosure of negotiated prices.
The executive order has the support of a number of doctors who on Thursday urged the administration to push ahead on disclosure of prices. “We, signing independently, are 3,969 physicians who make caring for patients our professional priority,” according to a letter Thursday from doctors and doctor practices to Mr. Trump and viewed by The Wall Street Journal. “We are distressed and disheartened by how America’s healthcare system is failing them.”
“I am all for it,” Maine’s independent Sen. Angus King said. “It’s an important step toward making health care a real market. I know of no other business where you have no idea what something’s going to cost, and you can’t find out even if you ask.”
The order comes as Mr. Trump, who announced his re-election campaign Tuesday, ramps up his messaging about health care in the run up to the 2020 presidential vote. In a recent ABC News interview, Mr. Trump reiterated a pledge he’d made in April to release a new health plan.
The White House believes it has authority to compel disclosure under a variety of tools, including the 21st Century Cures Act and the Affordable Care Act. Insurers could be compelled to disclose prices under the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act and Employee Retirement Income Security Act, according to people familiar with the matter.
It’s unclear how aggressive the order will be because of the pushback from industry, and some White House advisers who have urged a more measured approach, sources said.
Eighty-eight percent of voters said they favor a government initiative mandating that insurers, hospitals, doctors and other providers disclose the cost of their services and discounted or negotiated rates, according to a May survey by the Center for American Political Studies at Harvard and the Harris Poll.
The Department of Health and Human Services has also sought public comment on a proposed outpatient hospital rule regarding whether patients have a right to see the discounted prices in advance of obtaining care. That rule is expected by the end of July.
Hondo, notsomuch.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/trump-to-issue-executive-order-on-health-care-price-transparency-11561051500
Trump to Issue Executive Order on Health-Care Price Transparency
The president on Monday will call for insurers and doctors to disclose new details about the cost of care, a move that industry groups have resisted
By Stephanie Armour
Updated June 20, 2019 5:17 pm ET
President Trump plans to issue an executive order Monday to compel the disclosure of prices in health care, according to people familiar with the matter.
The order will direct federal agencies to initiate regulations and guidance that could require insurers, doctors, hospitals and others in the industry to provide information about the negotiated and often discounted cost of care, sources said.
Consumers and employers will benefit because pulling back the secrecy around the prices will allow them to shop for lower cost care and benefits, advocates say.
But industry groups including hospitals and insurers have balked at the idea, saying it could cause costs to climb if some businesses learn competitors are getting bigger discounts. They also say consumers really want to know their own out-of-pocket costs and won’t benefit from full disclosure of negotiated prices.
The executive order has the support of a number of doctors who on Thursday urged the administration to push ahead on disclosure of prices. “We, signing independently, are 3,969 physicians who make caring for patients our professional priority,” according to a letter Thursday from doctors and doctor practices to Mr. Trump and viewed by The Wall Street Journal. “We are distressed and disheartened by how America’s healthcare system is failing them.”
“I am all for it,” Maine’s independent Sen. Angus King said. “It’s an important step toward making health care a real market. I know of no other business where you have no idea what something’s going to cost, and you can’t find out even if you ask.”
The order comes as Mr. Trump, who announced his re-election campaign Tuesday, ramps up his messaging about health care in the run up to the 2020 presidential vote. In a recent ABC News interview, Mr. Trump reiterated a pledge he’d made in April to release a new health plan.
The White House believes it has authority to compel disclosure under a variety of tools, including the 21st Century Cures Act and the Affordable Care Act. Insurers could be compelled to disclose prices under the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act and Employee Retirement Income Security Act, according to people familiar with the matter.
It’s unclear how aggressive the order will be because of the pushback from industry, and some White House advisers who have urged a more measured approach, sources said.
Eighty-eight percent of voters said they favor a government initiative mandating that insurers, hospitals, doctors and other providers disclose the cost of their services and discounted or negotiated rates, according to a May survey by the Center for American Political Studies at Harvard and the Harris Poll.
The Department of Health and Human Services has also sought public comment on a proposed outpatient hospital rule regarding whether patients have a right to see the discounted prices in advance of obtaining care. That rule is expected by the end of July.
Comments
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I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
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So you're against Transparency and informed consumers?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
You Authoritarian Nanny State types crack me up. -
You’re arguing that the government should force businesses to do something, that they don’t want to do, in order to protect the customers while calling me an authoritarian nanny state type. You’re literally brain dead.TurdBomber said:
So you're against Transparency and informed consumers?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
You Authoritarian Nanny State types crack me up. -
JFC.allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
Where is APAG and what did you do with him?
Allow me to make this simple.
You're going to buy my car. I'll tell you what it costs after you take title and get home with it. Also, if you don't pay my quote, I'm going to ruin you.
On what fucking planet would that be ok?
Only HondoFS supports this arrangement.
The reason medicine is NOT a free market is because the consumer doesn't have the option to say "no, fuck you".
A free market is always dictated by the consumer, not the producer. Econ 101
This plan by the white house is literally giving power to the people. You should be FOR this.
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Medical industry is not remotely a free market. It's a quasi government run piece of shit.
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And?allpurpleallgold said:
You’re arguing that the government should force businesses to do something, that they don’t want to do, in order to protect the customers while calling me an authoritarian nanny state type. You’re literally brain dead.TurdBomber said:
So you're against Transparency and informed consumers?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
You Authoritarian Nanny State types crack me up.
How is this not the preferred option - like fucking always? -
I think we can safely blame obama and co for ruining healthcare for more than a decade
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So you are for transparency in pricing of medical costs. But against transparency in pricing for medical insurance. Go figure.
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I didn’t say I was for it or against it. I just think it’s funny that you think it’s a victory for your ideology.pawz said:
JFC.allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
Where is APAG and what did you do with him?
Allow me to make this simple.
You're going to buy my car. I'll tell you what it costs after you take title and get home with it. Also, if you don't pay my quote, I'm going to ruin you.
On what fucking planet would that be ok?
Only HondoFS supports this arrangement.
The reason medicine is NOT a free market is because the consumer doesn't have the option to say "no, fuck you".
This plan by the white house is literally giving power to the people. You should be FOR this. -
Then that's on you for not understanding the ideology.allpurpleallgold said:
I didn’t say I was for it or against it. I just think it’s funny that you think it’s a victory for your ideology.pawz said:
JFC.allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
Where is APAG and what did you do with him?
Allow me to make this simple.
You're going to buy my car. I'll tell you what it costs after you take title and get home with it. Also, if you don't pay my quote, I'm going to ruin you.
On what fucking planet would that be ok?
Only HondoFS supports this arrangement.
The reason medicine is NOT a free market is because the consumer doesn't have the option to say "no, fuck you".
This plan by the white house is literally giving power to the people. You should be FOR this. -
Fuck off.2001400ex said:So you are for transparency in pricing of medical costs. But against transparency in pricing for medical insurance. Go figure.
If you want to conflate bullshit start your own thread you disengenuous fuck. -
Pawz is pissed he's being called out as a political shill. Just admit that you hate whatever Obama did and support anything Trump will do. Regardless of your ideology.pawz said:
Fuck off.2001400ex said:So you are for transparency in pricing of medical costs. But against transparency in pricing for medical insurance. Go figure.
If you want to conflate bullshit start your own thread you disengenuous fuck. -
Since we know you're a pathological liar Hondo, can you please provide the quote where he said that he was opposed to transparency in the pricing of medical insurance?2001400ex said:
Pawz is pissed he's being called out as a political shill. Just admit that you hate whatever Obama did and support anything Trump will do. Regardless of your ideology.pawz said:
Fuck off.2001400ex said:So you are for transparency in pricing of medical costs. But against transparency in pricing for medical insurance. Go figure.
If you want to conflate bullshit start your own thread you disengenuous fuck. -
Pawz has railed on Obamacare from day 1. You are better than that Bob.SFGbob said:
Since we know you're a pathological liar Hondo, can you please provide the quote where he said that he was opposed to transparency in the pricing of medical insurance?2001400ex said:
Pawz is pissed he's being called out as a political shill. Just admit that you hate whatever Obama did and support anything Trump will do. Regardless of your ideology.pawz said:
Fuck off.2001400ex said:So you are for transparency in pricing of medical costs. But against transparency in pricing for medical insurance. Go figure.
If you want to conflate bullshit start your own thread you disengenuous fuck. -
Railing against Obamacare doesn't = opposing transparency in the pricing of Medical insurance2001400ex said:
Pawz has railed on Obamacare from day 1. You are better than that Bob.SFGbob said:
Since we know you're a pathological liar Hondo, can you please provide the quote where he said that he was opposed to transparency in the pricing of medical insurance?2001400ex said:
Pawz is pissed he's being called out as a political shill. Just admit that you hate whatever Obama did and support anything Trump will do. Regardless of your ideology.pawz said:
Fuck off.2001400ex said:So you are for transparency in pricing of medical costs. But against transparency in pricing for medical insurance. Go figure.
If you want to conflate bullshit start your own thread you disengenuous fuck.
Are you blind to what a hypocritical piece of shit you are Hondo or do you just not care? -
More conflation of bullshit from the pathological liar.2001400ex said:
Pawz is pissed he's being called out as a political shill. Just admit that you hate whatever Obama did and support anything Trump will do. Regardless of your ideology.pawz said:
Fuck off.2001400ex said:So you are for transparency in pricing of medical costs. But against transparency in pricing for medical insurance. Go figure.
If you want to conflate bullshit start your own thread you disengenuous fuck.
I'm not even going to call you a dumb motherfucker because you know exactly what you are doing.
You should be shot. -
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
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They do if you pay cash. Show may not be accurate. You have to ask and sometimes be a dick about it which I can be. Most people with insurance don't care which is a big part of the problemsalemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
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Same for medical insurance. Why do you support repealing Obamacare and getting rid of the exchanges?salemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
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Just go back to the fry vat.2001400ex said:
Same for medical insurance. Why do you support repealing Obamacare and getting rid of the exchanges?salemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
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The last tim I went into an urgency care I had insurance. They REFUSED to tell me what my out of pocket cost would be until after I saw the physician. We fought about it too.RaceBannon said:
They do if you pay cash. Show may not be accurate. You have to ask and sometimes be a dick about it which I can be. Most people with insurance don't care which is a big part of the problemsalemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
Fuck them. And fuck Hondo for excusing the behavior. -
Because it will be cheaper.2001400ex said:
Same for medical insurance. Why do you support repealing Obamacare and getting rid of the exchanges?salemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
But of course you know that since you're here #clockworkshilling for the big medical insurance companies.
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I think consumers are better at making informed decisions than bureaucrats. So I'm all about transparency, yes.allpurpleallgold said:
You’re arguing that the government should force businesses to do something, that they don’t want to do, in order to protect the customers while calling me an authoritarian nanny state type. You’re literally brain dead.TurdBomber said:
So you're against Transparency and informed consumers?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
You Authoritarian Nanny State types crack me up.
In your world, the government operates secretly, hand-in-hand with business, while hiding information from consumers. No, I don't like that. -
No it won't be cheaper. In any way.pawz said:
Because it will be cheaper.2001400ex said:
Same for medical insurance. Why do you support repealing Obamacare and getting rid of the exchanges?salemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
But of course you know that since you're here #clockworkshilling for the big medical insurance companies.
And fuck insurance companies. I wish they'd all just die. -
HRYK.2001400ex said:
No it won't be cheaper. In any way.pawz said:
Because it will be cheaper.2001400ex said:
Same for medical insurance. Why do you support repealing Obamacare and getting rid of the exchanges?salemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
But of course you know that since you're here #clockworkshilling for the big medical insurance companies.
And fuck insurance companies. I wish they'd all just die. -
The only thing that is clear is that neither of you understand how economics (s&d) and markets work.allpurpleallgold said:
HRYK.2001400ex said:
No it won't be cheaper. In any way.pawz said:
Because it will be cheaper.2001400ex said:
Same for medical insurance. Why do you support repealing Obamacare and getting rid of the exchanges?salemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
But of course you know that since you're here #clockworkshilling for the big medical insurance companies.
And fuck insurance companies. I wish they'd all just die.
Your more-government utopia is what is keeping markets monopolized (which only benefits the producer) and artificially high.
So if this is going to be your position and a hill you want to die on, both of you should gag on a cock. I expect that want from Hondo, not from you. -
Leftards keep trying to repeal gravity. Why does Lasik eye surgery and plastic surgery keep getting better and cheaper? It’s almost like capitalism works. Why do I see more Dr. Dahrm commercials than I do for Blue Cross? Hell, I hear more Leif auto repair commercials than all the medical insurers put together. Leftards keep thinking that the VA should be the model for my health care.
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Except health Care is not a free market. Eradicating cancer from a patient is not like buying a pickup. A large portion of medical procedures you don't have a choice in. Which changes the dynamics compared to a free market.pawz said:
The only thing that is clear is that neither of you understand how economics (s&d) and markets work.allpurpleallgold said:
HRYK.2001400ex said:
No it won't be cheaper. In any way.pawz said:
Because it will be cheaper.2001400ex said:
Same for medical insurance. Why do you support repealing Obamacare and getting rid of the exchanges?salemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
But of course you know that since you're here #clockworkshilling for the big medical insurance companies.
And fuck insurance companies. I wish they'd all just die.
Your more-government utopia is what is keeping markets monopolized (which only benefits the producer) and artificially high.
So if this is going to be your position and a hill you want to die on, both of you should gag on a cock. I expect that want from Hondo, not from you.
Wrap your mind around that concept and you'll see why the market is better with government intervention. -
Ah yes the "concept." You're right, healthcare in this country currently isn't a free market but not for the reasons your pea sized brain has come up with. Cancer treatment is definitely a service that can be provided and market forces can come into play. They don't currently because of the 3rd party payer system that we have in this country. Your phony comparison of pickup truck shopping and cancer shopping is just the standard Hondo strawman ass fuck because you're both stupid and dishonest.2001400ex said:
Except health Care is not a free market. Eradicating cancer from a patient is not like buying a pickup. A large portion of medical procedures you don't have a choice in. Which changes the dynamics compared to a free market.pawz said:
The only thing that is clear is that neither of you understand how economics (s&d) and markets work.allpurpleallgold said:
HRYK.2001400ex said:
No it won't be cheaper. In any way.pawz said:
Because it will be cheaper.2001400ex said:
Same for medical insurance. Why do you support repealing Obamacare and getting rid of the exchanges?salemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
But of course you know that since you're here #clockworkshilling for the big medical insurance companies.
And fuck insurance companies. I wish they'd all just die.
Your more-government utopia is what is keeping markets monopolized (which only benefits the producer) and artificially high.
So if this is going to be your position and a hill you want to die on, both of you should gag on a cock. I expect that want from Hondo, not from you.
Wrap your mind around that concept and you'll see why the market is better with government intervention.
Second of all I'd challenge your assertion that a "large portion" of medical procedures don't involve a choice. Got a link for that because I know it's a claim you pulled squarely out of your ignorant ass. But even if that were the case, how would not having a "choice" make healthcare not part of the free market?
Just because I have to have a medical procedure done doesn't mean there can't be a market that provides that procedure.
Your spinning pure crap as usual. -
What you're failing to describe is called Elasticity of Demand. We? would expect even a fake-CPA to know what that is called.2001400ex said:
Except health Care is not a free market. Eradicating cancer from a patient is not like buying a pickup. A large portion of medical procedures you don't have a choice in. Which changes the dynamics compared to a free market.pawz said:
The only thing that is clear is that neither of you understand how economics (s&d) and markets work.allpurpleallgold said:
HRYK.2001400ex said:
No it won't be cheaper. In any way.pawz said:
Because it will be cheaper.2001400ex said:
Same for medical insurance. Why do you support repealing Obamacare and getting rid of the exchanges?salemcoog said:
When you buy a car or a house or in your case, a dildo, you know what the price of it is. The whole price, out the door. Why shouldn't hospitals and health providers have to show what their prices are?allpurpleallgold said:I’m sorry, how is the government forcing businesses to do something, through regulations, a win for the free market?
But of course you know that since you're here #clockworkshilling for the big medical insurance companies.
And fuck insurance companies. I wish they'd all just die.
Your more-government utopia is what is keeping markets monopolized (which only benefits the producer) and artificially high.
So if this is going to be your position and a hill you want to die on, both of you should gag on a cock. I expect that want from Hondo, not from you.
Wrap your mind around that concept and you'll see why the market is better with government intervention.
There are other choices.
The Medical Mafia - who you've been shilling for since the beginning - does not want the people to have any other choices. This would cause demand to be more elastic and prices to come down.
The White House's plan to expose cost thus gives people real options. Which you are so clearly against.
Your continuance to #clockworkshill for the mafia makes you an enemy of the people.
