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It's by far the hardest sport to scout. Every now and then I look at the first round draft picks. Very few turn out to be anything special. It's a game of failure in every way.Fishpo31 said:I will also say this, Chuck...with my background, I am hyper-critical and super conservative on evals of guys. Scouts, in general are the O.G.'s of the "they all suck until they don't" mindset...
I do think there is some cliche in baseball scouting. A 1B has to hit 30 HR's and stuff along those lines. This has nothing to do with Haggerty, but someone that hits .300 with 10-15 HR is valuable, regardless of position. Obviously, a .300 hitter at catcher is more rare (and valuable) than a LF. -
Haggerty should play everyday on nearly everyday (like he's been doing) until proven otherwise.
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^^^^THIS^^^^. And they will…
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I saw the auto correct or typing disasters in my post and all I could think was how much I appreciated anyone willing to read it. Jesus.Fishpo31 said:I will also say this, Chuck...with my background, I am hyper-critical and super conservative on evals of guys. Scouts, in general are the O.G.'s of the "they all suck until they don't" mindset...
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I think that a lot (if not all) of the profile stuff has gone by the wayside, for the most-part. It used to be power on the corners (INF and OF), speed and defense in the middle. Now, everybody swings out of their ass, and if you can roll the pole, nogaf if you can't run, short-game, or defend.RoadDawg55 said:
It's by far the hardest sport to scout. Every now and then I look at the first round draft picks. Very few turn out to be anything special. It's a game of failure in every way.Fishpo31 said:I will also say this, Chuck...with my background, I am hyper-critical and super conservative on evals of guys. Scouts, in general are the O.G.'s of the "they all suck until they don't" mindset...
I do think there is some cliche in baseball scouting. A 1B has to hit 30 HR's and stuff along those lines. This has nothing to do with Haggerty, but someone that hits .300 with 10-15 HR is valuable, regardless of position. Obviously, a .300 hitter at catcher is more rare (and valuable) than a LF.
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RoadDawg55 said:
It's by far the hardest sport to scout. Every now and then I look at the first round draft picks. Very few turn out to be anything special. It's a game of failure in every way.Fishpo31 said:I will also say this, Chuck...with my background, I am hyper-critical and super conservative on evals of guys. Scouts, in general are the O.G.'s of the "they all suck until they don't" mindset...
I do think there is some cliche in baseball scouting. A 1B has to hit 30 HR's and stuff along those lines. This has nothing to do with Haggerty, but someone that hits .300 with 10-15 HR is valuable, regardless of position. Obviously, a .300 hitter at catcher is more rare (and valuable) than a LF.
Johnny Bench is the gold standard...there are guys as good defensively, but couldn't hit; there are guys as good offensively, that couldn't catch. Piazza was a horrible catcher, but a HOF hitter...Pudge could have been a great catcher if he worked at it, but HOF bat. I know it's nit-picky, but Piazza was a three-hole hitter looking for a position, and Pudge showed greatness with the hand cannon, but he was lazy, wouldn't block and was a shit game caller (Not my opinion, I heard it from multiple sources directly). Receiving and running the game is where they earn their keep.
In the past, they were taking catchers that could hit and moving them to protect the bat. Dale Murphy, Craig Biggio, Joe Mauer, off the top of my head. Now, they are taking middle/corner infielders and teaching them to catch (Will Smith, Austin Barnes, Posey, Realmuto, Nola...).
Good stuff, I love talking about this shit...
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@Fishpo31, speaking of all-time greats, tell us your best Bob Kearney story. Aka "Sarge".Fishpo31 said:RoadDawg55 said:
It's by far the hardest sport to scout. Every now and then I look at the first round draft picks. Very few turn out to be anything special. It's a game of failure in every way.Fishpo31 said:I will also say this, Chuck...with my background, I am hyper-critical and super conservative on evals of guys. Scouts, in general are the O.G.'s of the "they all suck until they don't" mindset...
I do think there is some cliche in baseball scouting. A 1B has to hit 30 HR's and stuff along those lines. This has nothing to do with Haggerty, but someone that hits .300 with 10-15 HR is valuable, regardless of position. Obviously, a .300 hitter at catcher is more rare (and valuable) than a LF.
Johnny Bench is the gold standard...there are guys as good defensively, but couldn't hit; there are guys as good offensively, that couldn't catch. Piazza was a horrible catcher, but a HOF hitter...Pudge could have been a great catcher if he worked at it, but HOF bat. I know it's nit-picky, but Piazza was a three-hole hitter looking for a position, and Pudge showed greatness with the hand cannon, but he was lazy, wouldn't block and was a shit game caller (Not my opinion, I heard it from multiple sources directly). Receiving and running the game is where they earn their keep.
In the past, they were taking catchers that could hit and moving them to protect the bat. Dale Murphy, Craig Biggio, Joe Mauer, off the top of my head. Now, they are taking middle/corner infielders and teaching them to catch (Will Smith, Austin Barnes, Posey, Realmuto, Nola...).
Good stuff, I love talking about this shit... -
Sarge does not make my list of "all-time greats", LOL...from memory: no hit, shit game caller / receiver, plus-plus arm. The classic example of the statement that "The fastest way to the big leagues is behind the plate"...met him once or twice, seemed like a good guy. One of my scout buddies played with him in Seattle and Oakland, and told me "He's a great guy to have a beer with, but nobody wanted to throw to him". Today, with that skill set, they would probably turn him into a pitcher.DerekJohnson said:
@Fishpo31, speaking of all-time greats, tell us your best Bob Kearney story. Aka "Sarge".Fishpo31 said:RoadDawg55 said:
It's by far the hardest sport to scout. Every now and then I look at the first round draft picks. Very few turn out to be anything special. It's a game of failure in every way.Fishpo31 said:I will also say this, Chuck...with my background, I am hyper-critical and super conservative on evals of guys. Scouts, in general are the O.G.'s of the "they all suck until they don't" mindset...
I do think there is some cliche in baseball scouting. A 1B has to hit 30 HR's and stuff along those lines. This has nothing to do with Haggerty, but someone that hits .300 with 10-15 HR is valuable, regardless of position. Obviously, a .300 hitter at catcher is more rare (and valuable) than a LF.
Johnny Bench is the gold standard...there are guys as good defensively, but couldn't hit; there are guys as good offensively, that couldn't catch. Piazza was a horrible catcher, but a HOF hitter...Pudge could have been a great catcher if he worked at it, but HOF bat. I know it's nit-picky, but Piazza was a three-hole hitter looking for a position, and Pudge showed greatness with the hand cannon, but he was lazy, wouldn't block and was a shit game caller (Not my opinion, I heard it from multiple sources directly). Receiving and running the game is where they earn their keep.
In the past, they were taking catchers that could hit and moving them to protect the bat. Dale Murphy, Craig Biggio, Joe Mauer, off the top of my head. Now, they are taking middle/corner infielders and teaching them to catch (Will Smith, Austin Barnes, Posey, Realmuto, Nola...).
Good stuff, I love talking about this shit... -
Fishpo, do the yips really exist or is every guy that has had those type of incidents a mentally weak pussy?
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They are real, and they are NOT spectacular...they come out of nowhere, and either eventually leave, or not. There are two methods to deal with them, neither of which work...talk about it, or don't talk about it. Try to "work" on it, or be silent...If I had a cure, I'd be responding to this from a palatial estate or private island...RoadDawg55 said:Fishpo, do the yips really exist or is every guy that has had those type of incidents a mentally weak pussy?
The worst one I've been a part of was about 15 years ago...I had a JUCO catcher that had a plus-plus arm, very good bat, receiver, everything you look for. Certainly D1, and a probable draft pick. He could not throw the ball back to the pitcher...Throw to the bases, he was great. We tried everything we knew, and it didn't work. I would show up at 7AM, and he'd have hopped the fence with a bucket, put a screen with target up on the mound, and spent a lot of time in CF recovering balls.
Mike Ivey (google him) was the first pick in the draft IIRC, in the late 60's, for the Padres. I was told that in extended spring training, after signing, he was catching a coach who was throwing live BP, behind an L-Screen. A couple of his throwbacks hit the screen, and the coach went off on him, in front of everyone, and it was over. Never recovered, played some 1B / DH in the big leagues, and never caught again.
IDK if mentally weak is correct, but it could be just not trusting yourself, which some may classify as being mentally weak...
