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Should I Buy a Tesla?
Comments
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In 10 years new gas powered vehicles will be less than 60%. And won't be because SJW are buying inferior vehicles, they will simply be better
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I don't buy that battery technology will improve that much in 10 years. It'll probably be better, sure, but not a step change like from lead to lithium. Not in 10 years, at least. For at least 15 years, I've been reading "we're five years away from a battery breakthrough" articles--everything from rechargeable aluminum-air batteries to high density solid state to graphene--but none have been commercialized in the promised time frame. Solid state is coming--this is sure--and it's coming quickly, but it's not so much of a game changer without infrastructure to dump cubic amps of current into a battery at once, which currently barely exists, and I don't see the country completely converted in 10 years.MikeDamone said:In 10 years new gas powered vehicles will be less than 60%. And won't be because SJW are buying inferior vehicles, they will simply be better
ATBSJBS, it really doesn't matter. Outside of specialized use cases like towing, racing (farther than a couple laps), and cross-country riding, electrics are already better than their gas counterparts. What will change in 10 years is that marketing will change, acceptance will grow, and small-dick internet tough guys will be forced to finally admit it.
TL;DR: They're already better for at least 60% of people, what will take 10 years is acceptance and charging infrastructure so, for instance, they're viable for people in apartments or with street parking only.
That's the best advertisement for Tesla I've ever seen! Sign me the fuck up!USMChawk said:
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Looks like they have you pegged1to392831weretaken said:
I don't buy that battery technology will improve that much in 10 years. It'll probably be better, sure, but not a step change like from lead to lithium. Not in 10 years, at least. For at least 15 years, I've been reading "we're five years away from a battery breakthrough" articles--everything from rechargeable aluminum-air batteries to high density solid state to graphene--but none have been commercialized in the promised time frame. Solid state is coming--this is sure--and it's coming quickly, but it's not so much of a game changer without infrastructure to dump cubic amps of current into a battery at once, which currently barely exists, and I don't see the country completely converted in 10 years.MikeDamone said:In 10 years new gas powered vehicles will be less than 60%. And won't be because SJW are buying inferior vehicles, they will simply be better
ATBSJBS, it really doesn't matter. Outside of specialized use cases like towing, racing (farther than a couple laps), and cross-country riding, electrics are already better than their gas counterparts. What will change in 10 years is that marketing will change, acceptance will grow, and small-dick internet tough guys will be forced to finally admit it.
TL;DR: They're already better for at least 60% of people, what will take 10 years is acceptance and charging infrastructure so, for instance, they're viable for people in apartments or with street parking only.
That's the best advertisement for Tesla I've ever seen! Sign me the fuck up!USMChawk said: -
It's just like Tesla: I think a lot of you would change your minds once you've actually tried it!dnc said:
Looks like they have you pegged1to392831weretaken said:
I don't buy that battery technology will improve that much in 10 years. It'll probably be better, sure, but not a step change like from lead to lithium. Not in 10 years, at least. For at least 15 years, I've been reading "we're five years away from a battery breakthrough" articles--everything from rechargeable aluminum-air batteries to high density solid state to graphene--but none have been commercialized in the promised time frame. Solid state is coming--this is sure--and it's coming quickly, but it's not so much of a game changer without infrastructure to dump cubic amps of current into a battery at once, which currently barely exists, and I don't see the country completely converted in 10 years.MikeDamone said:In 10 years new gas powered vehicles will be less than 60%. And won't be because SJW are buying inferior vehicles, they will simply be better
ATBSJBS, it really doesn't matter. Outside of specialized use cases like towing, racing (farther than a couple laps), and cross-country riding, electrics are already better than their gas counterparts. What will change in 10 years is that marketing will change, acceptance will grow, and small-dick internet tough guys will be forced to finally admit it.
TL;DR: They're already better for at least 60% of people, what will take 10 years is acceptance and charging infrastructure so, for instance, they're viable for people in apartments or with street parking only.
That's the best advertisement for Tesla I've ever seen! Sign me the fuck up!USMChawk said: -
Costs for EV's are still much higher than ICE. Closing the gap, though.1to392831weretaken said:
I don't buy that battery technology will improve that much in 10 years. It'll probably be better, sure, but not a step change like from lead to lithium. Not in 10 years, at least. For at least 15 years, I've been reading "we're five years away from a battery breakthrough" articles--everything from rechargeable aluminum-air batteries to high density solid state to graphene--but none have been commercialized in the promised time frame. Solid state is coming--this is sure--and it's coming quickly, but it's not so much of a game changer without infrastructure to dump cubic amps of current into a battery at once, which currently barely exists, and I don't see the country completely converted in 10 years.MikeDamone said:In 10 years new gas powered vehicles will be less than 60%. And won't be because SJW are buying inferior vehicles, they will simply be better
ATBSJBS, it really doesn't matter. Outside of specialized use cases like towing, racing (farther than a couple laps), and cross-country riding, electrics are already better than their gas counterparts. What will change in 10 years is that marketing will change, acceptance will grow, and small-dick internet tough guys will be forced to finally admit it.
TL;DR: They're already better for at least 60% of people, what will take 10 years is acceptance and charging infrastructure so, for instance, they're viable for people in apartments or with street parking only.
That's the best advertisement for Tesla I've ever seen! Sign me the fuck up!USMChawk said:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesmorris/2020/07/11/teslas-shift-to-cobalt-free-batteries-is-its-most-important-move-yet/#7dfcd38246b4
It is estimated that using LFP batteries will allow a 15-20% reduction in manufacturing cost. Taking calculations regarding how much of a car’s cost is batteries into account, this could make EVs a mere 10% more expensive than ICE instead of 30%, which will be easy to regain in cheaper running costs over a year or two of ownership. -
Both of my electrics were purchased after a cold-eyes Excel spreadsheet exercise. I ride bikes for fun, so the number one criteria for my four-wheeled transport is cheeeeeeap. On paper, they were the cheapest to own (very different than cheapest to buy. I have a Volt (which ceased production a month after I purchased because GM sold out of their subsidies and would therefore become noncompetitive due to how stupid the subsidy structure was in the first place) and a Pacifica Hybrid. So both are merely plug-in hybrids, but we rarely put any gas in either, and would never put gas in either if they had Tesla-sized packs (I filled my 8-gallon tank three times last year, partly because my work blocked off the lot with the chargers for a week for restriping). I point this out, though, because these are no Teslas. They're cars that are already nearly on par pricewise with gas equivalents. Sure, Teslas are priced as luxury cars because they're superior or equivalent in many ways to the $60K+ cars they directly compete against, but there are other much more affordable options. This number is about to grow significantly as well, as VW is going all-in with electrification and a few other manufacturers are putting in better than half-assed efforts as well (Toyota bet billions on solid state batteries, BMW slightly fewer billions, and they're not just going to piss that investment away).BleachedAnusDawg said:
Costs for EV's are still much higher than ICE. Closing the gap, though.1to392831weretaken said:
I don't buy that battery technology will improve that much in 10 years. It'll probably be better, sure, but not a step change like from lead to lithium. Not in 10 years, at least. For at least 15 years, I've been reading "we're five years away from a battery breakthrough" articles--everything from rechargeable aluminum-air batteries to high density solid state to graphene--but none have been commercialized in the promised time frame. Solid state is coming--this is sure--and it's coming quickly, but it's not so much of a game changer without infrastructure to dump cubic amps of current into a battery at once, which currently barely exists, and I don't see the country completely converted in 10 years.MikeDamone said:In 10 years new gas powered vehicles will be less than 60%. And won't be because SJW are buying inferior vehicles, they will simply be better
ATBSJBS, it really doesn't matter. Outside of specialized use cases like towing, racing (farther than a couple laps), and cross-country riding, electrics are already better than their gas counterparts. What will change in 10 years is that marketing will change, acceptance will grow, and small-dick internet tough guys will be forced to finally admit it.
TL;DR: They're already better for at least 60% of people, what will take 10 years is acceptance and charging infrastructure so, for instance, they're viable for people in apartments or with street parking only.
That's the best advertisement for Tesla I've ever seen! Sign me the fuck up!USMChawk said:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jamesmorris/2020/07/11/teslas-shift-to-cobalt-free-batteries-is-its-most-important-move-yet/#7dfcd38246b4
It is estimated that using LFP batteries will allow a 15-20% reduction in manufacturing cost. Taking calculations regarding how much of a car’s cost is batteries into account, this could make EVs a mere 10% more expensive than ICE instead of 30%, which will be easy to regain in cheaper running costs over a year or two of ownership.
What automakers are just now starting to do with upcoming model releases is finally not intentionally making their electric offerings look like rolling suppositories, and this is going to help sales a lot.
There's an honest debate to be had about whether the subsidy is fair/ethical/liberal-hippy-Commie, but it does exist for the time being--for every automaker not named GM or Tesla--so this should be taken into account when calculating TCO. Factor in purchase price minus subsidy (which can be a lot higher depending on in what state you live) minus depreciated value after the number of years you plan to own the vehicle and start adding up fuel (fuckall), maintenance (almost zero), consumables (almost zero for brakes), etc., and you'd be surprised what pops out the other end. -
I have also driven a Tesla before. It was fun to drive. I’m not crazy about how they look, but they are really nice.1to392831weretaken said:
It's just like Tesla: I think a lot of you would change your minds once you've actually tried it!dnc said:
Looks like they have you pegged1to392831weretaken said:
I don't buy that battery technology will improve that much in 10 years. It'll probably be better, sure, but not a step change like from lead to lithium. Not in 10 years, at least. For at least 15 years, I've been reading "we're five years away from a battery breakthrough" articles--everything from rechargeable aluminum-air batteries to high density solid state to graphene--but none have been commercialized in the promised time frame. Solid state is coming--this is sure--and it's coming quickly, but it's not so much of a game changer without infrastructure to dump cubic amps of current into a battery at once, which currently barely exists, and I don't see the country completely converted in 10 years.MikeDamone said:In 10 years new gas powered vehicles will be less than 60%. And won't be because SJW are buying inferior vehicles, they will simply be better
ATBSJBS, it really doesn't matter. Outside of specialized use cases like towing, racing (farther than a couple laps), and cross-country riding, electrics are already better than their gas counterparts. What will change in 10 years is that marketing will change, acceptance will grow, and small-dick internet tough guys will be forced to finally admit it.
TL;DR: They're already better for at least 60% of people, what will take 10 years is acceptance and charging infrastructure so, for instance, they're viable for people in apartments or with street parking only.
That's the best advertisement for Tesla I've ever seen! Sign me the fuck up!USMChawk said: -
For anybody that likes driving long distances the technology isn't there yet ...
There are a few things that I feel like we need on the electric car side of things (some said above):
1) Range has to increase to at least be at a spot where you can drive minimum 8-10 hours before charging (think typical day drive before stopping at a hotel, etc)
2) Charging stations either need to be more prevalent/portable to be able to be used while traveling AND/OR the time to charge has to be sped up SIGNIFICANTLY
3) Costs have to drop to the point that they are largely indifferent between existing gas powered cars
As is right now, electric cars to me really only are realistic for families who use the electric car for in town driving. It's hard for me to view the company as anything more than selling a niche product to a niche customer base at least in the vehicle standpoint.
I'm intrigued at what Tesla has to offer outside of the cars as I think that's the really hidden power for them going forward as @Baseman has mentioned ... but at it's current price point it's massively overpriced.
