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#HandsOffVenezuela

GrundleStiltzkin
GrundleStiltzkin Member Posts: 61,516 Standard Supporter
"... might mean blood on your hands."
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKVakhcm5ko

She is annoying AF, but also right on this particular point.
«13

Comments

  • PurpleThrobber
    PurpleThrobber Member Posts: 48,121 Standard Supporter


    Invasion! NOW!
  • HillsboroDuck
    HillsboroDuck Member Posts: 9,186
    I watched it.

    Not sure what to say. She has a balanced, nuance take on a political issue.







    TF is this doing here?
  • pawz
    pawz Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 22,476 Founders Club
  • pawz
    pawz Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 22,476 Founders Club
  • GrundleStiltzkin
    GrundleStiltzkin Member Posts: 61,516 Standard Supporter
  • pawz
    pawz Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 22,476 Founders Club

    Yeah, TL;DW

    Yeah, well you should.

    Or listen to it during your commute/workout/brbjo ...
  • HillsboroDuck
    HillsboroDuck Member Posts: 9,186
    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
  • HardlyClothed
    HardlyClothed Member Posts: 937

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Ok but the solution for those who think the US has “responsibility” is regime change.

    The sanctions are making living conditions much worse and are intended to get people to rise up against Maduro. But we saw that there is no popular mandate for that as Guaido’s coup flopped.
  • HillsboroDuck
    HillsboroDuck Member Posts: 9,186

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Ok but the solution for those who think the US has “responsibility” is regime change.

    The sanctions are making living conditions much worse and are intended to get people to rise up against Maduro. But we saw that there is no popular mandate for that as Guaido’s coup flopped.
    So you disagree with the girl in the OP vid. And your recommendation is what?
  • HardlyClothed
    HardlyClothed Member Posts: 937

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Ok but the solution for those who think the US has “responsibility” is regime change.

    The sanctions are making living conditions much worse and are intended to get people to rise up against Maduro. But we saw that there is no popular mandate for that as Guaido’s coup flopped.
    So you disagree with the girl in the OP vid. And your recommendation is what?
    Not meddling in Venezuela.

    Remove sanctions because the intended goal isn’t feasible and it only exacerbates the suffering which all the interventionists claim to care so much about. Restore normal diplomatic relations. Stop pretending this Guaido guy is the real president.
  • GrundleStiltzkin
    GrundleStiltzkin Member Posts: 61,516 Standard Supporter

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Ok but the solution for those who think the US has “responsibility” is regime change.

    The sanctions are making living conditions much worse and are intended to get people to rise up against Maduro. But we saw that there is no popular mandate for that as Guaido’s coup flopped.
    So you disagree with the girl in the OP vid. And your recommendation is what?
    Not meddling in Venezuela.

    Remove sanctions because the intended goal isn’t feasible and it only exacerbates the suffering which all the interventionists claim to care so much about. Restore normal diplomatic relations. Stop pretending this Guaido guy is the real president.
    Any thoughts on the Russian military presence in Venezuela?
  • HillsboroDuck
    HillsboroDuck Member Posts: 9,186

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Ok but the solution for those who think the US has “responsibility” is regime change.

    The sanctions are making living conditions much worse and are intended to get people to rise up against Maduro. But we saw that there is no popular mandate for that as Guaido’s coup flopped.
    So you disagree with the girl in the OP vid. And your recommendation is what?
    Not meddling in Venezuela.

    Remove sanctions because the intended goal isn’t feasible and it only exacerbates the suffering which all the interventionists claim to care so much about. Restore normal diplomatic relations. Stop pretending this Guaido guy is the real president.
    Any thoughts on the Russian military presence in Venezuela?
    Humanitarians
  • GrundleStiltzkin
    GrundleStiltzkin Member Posts: 61,516 Standard Supporter

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Ok but the solution for those who think the US has “responsibility” is regime change.

    The sanctions are making living conditions much worse and are intended to get people to rise up against Maduro. But we saw that there is no popular mandate for that as Guaido’s coup flopped.
    So you disagree with the girl in the OP vid. And your recommendation is what?
    Not meddling in Venezuela.

    Remove sanctions because the intended goal isn’t feasible and it only exacerbates the suffering which all the interventionists claim to care so much about. Restore normal diplomatic relations. Stop pretending this Guaido guy is the real president.
    Any thoughts on the Russian military presence in Venezuela?
    Humanitarians
    Well-documented
  • pawz
    pawz Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 22,476 Founders Club

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Yes I have. Thank you for noticing. It's still material to this discussion.

    Overwhelmingly the poor folk in Venezuela support the policies of Chavez/Madurro. Rightly or wrongly Chavez brought large swaths of people out of poverty.

    The problems there today began with sanctions. Sanctions imposed by the western world. Billions have been stolen from Venezuela by the western world.

    Also of note, issues in that cuntry are freely debated without repercussion. The elections were watched and certified by 12 other independent cuntries. Their people chose to elect a Socialist. Should they not be free to elect whomever they want?


    Again, the problem I have is with the textbook interventionalist policies of the Western world designed to overthrow their government - for profit. It always comes disguised and feigned as Aid.

  • HillsboroDuck
    HillsboroDuck Member Posts: 9,186
    pawz said:

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Yes I have. Thank you for noticing. It's still material to this discussion.

    Overwhelmingly the poor folk in Venezuela support the policies of Chavez/Madurro. Rightly or wrongly Chavez brought large swaths of people out of poverty.

    The problems there today began with sanctions. Sanctions imposed by the western world. Billions have been stolen from Venezuela by the western world.

    Also of note, issues in that cuntry are freely debated without repercussion. The elections were watched and certified by 12 other independent cuntries. Their people chose to elect a Socialist. Should they not be free to elect whomever they want?


    Again, the problem I have is with the textbook interventionalist policies of the Western world designed to overthrow their government - for profit. It always comes disguised and feigned as Aid.

    You really believe this? I can buy that the sanctions have exacerbated the problem, but the source?

    Come on, you're smarter than that.
  • Pitchfork51
    Pitchfork51 Member Posts: 27,662
    Airvac the hot girls. Problem solved
  • UW_Doog_Bot
    UW_Doog_Bot Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 18,184 Founders Club

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Ok but the solution for those who think the US has “responsibility” is regime change.

    The sanctions are making living conditions much worse and are intended to get people to rise up against Maduro. But we saw that there is no popular mandate for that as Guaido’s coup flopped.
    pawz said:

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Yes I have. Thank you for noticing. It's still material to this discussion.

    Overwhelmingly the poor folk in Venezuela support the policies of Chavez/Madurro. Rightly or wrongly Chavez brought large swaths of people out of poverty.

    The problems there today began with sanctions. Sanctions imposed by the western world. Billions have been stolen from Venezuela by the western world.

    Also of note, issues in that cuntry are freely debated without repercussion. The elections were watched and certified by 12 other independent cuntries. Their people chose to elect a Socialist. Should they not be free to elect whomever they want?


    Again, the problem I have is with the textbook interventionalist policies of the Western world designed to overthrow their government - for profit. It always comes disguised and feigned as Aid.

    Hilarious left pundits mentioned in OP video show up and parrot the exact things the video addresses. You guys are doing a bang up job.
  • allpurpleallgold
    allpurpleallgold Member Posts: 8,771

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    I think if you put a but after the words “generally anti interventionism” you are not generally anti interventionism.

    There will always be a reason to use the but. But 9/11. But WMD’s. But chemical attacks. But it’s closer to home than those other buts.

    We make things worse and it costs American lives. The people who benefit the most are politicians, the military industrial complex and oil companies. And they will always have a but to sell you.
  • PurpleJ
    PurpleJ Member Posts: 37,643 Founders Club
    I'm anti interventionism but pro imperialism.
  • pawz
    pawz Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 22,476 Founders Club

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    I think if you put a but after the words “generally anti interventionism” you are not generally anti interventionism.

    There will always be a reason to use the but. But 9/11. But WMD’s. But chemical attacks. But it’s closer to home than those other buts.

    We make things worse and it costs American lives. The people who benefit the most are politicians, the military industrial complex and oil companies. And they will always have a but to sell you.

    This.

    #Tulsi2020 but the establishment ain't having none of that.
  • pawz
    pawz Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 22,476 Founders Club

    pawz said:

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Yes I have. Thank you for noticing. It's still material to this discussion.

    Overwhelmingly the poor folk in Venezuela support the policies of Chavez/Madurro. Rightly or wrongly Chavez brought large swaths of people out of poverty.

    The problems there today began with sanctions. Sanctions imposed by the western world. Billions have been stolen from Venezuela by the western world.

    Also of note, issues in that cuntry are freely debated without repercussion. The elections were watched and certified by 12 other independent cuntries. Their people chose to elect a Socialist. Should they not be free to elect whomever they want?


    Again, the problem I have is with the textbook interventionalist policies of the Western world designed to overthrow their government - for profit. It always comes disguised and feigned as Aid.

    You really believe this? I can buy that the sanctions have exacerbated the problem, but the source?

    Come on, you're smarter than that.
    Venezuela was one of the wealthiest cuntries in the world.

    They can no longer sell their oil to the west.

    US banks closed the majority of their accounts confiscating untold Billions.

    England confiscated $1.5B in bullion.



    How is that helping their people?

    Do they need freedom?
  • Pitchfork51
    Pitchfork51 Member Posts: 27,662
    pawz said:

    pawz said:

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    Yes I have. Thank you for noticing. It's still material to this discussion.

    Overwhelmingly the poor folk in Venezuela support the policies of Chavez/Madurro. Rightly or wrongly Chavez brought large swaths of people out of poverty.

    The problems there today began with sanctions. Sanctions imposed by the western world. Billions have been stolen from Venezuela by the western world.

    Also of note, issues in that cuntry are freely debated without repercussion. The elections were watched and certified by 12 other independent cuntries. Their people chose to elect a Socialist. Should they not be free to elect whomever they want?


    Again, the problem I have is with the textbook interventionalist policies of the Western world designed to overthrow their government - for profit. It always comes disguised and feigned as Aid.

    You really believe this? I can buy that the sanctions have exacerbated the problem, but the source?

    Come on, you're smarter than that.
    Venezuela was one of the wealthiest cuntries in the world.

    They can no longer sell their oil to the west.

    US banks closed the majority of their accounts confiscating untold Billions.

    England confiscated $1.5B in bullion.



    How is that helping their people?

    Do they need freedom?
    Non hot girls need not apply. Have you looked at how gross the average person is lately? Gotta up that percentage
  • HillsboroDuck
    HillsboroDuck Member Posts: 9,186

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    I think if you put a but after the words “generally anti interventionism” you are not generally anti interventionism.

    There will always be a reason to use the but. But 9/11. But WMD’s. But chemical attacks. But it’s closer to home than those other buts.

    We make things worse and it costs American lives. The people who benefit the most are politicians, the military industrial complex and oil companies. And they will always have a but to sell you.
    This is totally fair, but I'll just never be completely anti intervention. WWI and II were the right moves. More recently I think we had to stop ISIS, for example, and would have felt that way even if it wasn't Bush and Obama's fuckups that had created them in the first place.

    Figuring out where to draw the line is tricky and we'll probably never get it exactly right. But some crises are too big to ignore.
  • pawz
    pawz Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 22,476 Founders Club

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    I think if you put a but after the words “generally anti interventionism” you are not generally anti interventionism.

    There will always be a reason to use the but. But 9/11. But WMD’s. But chemical attacks. But it’s closer to home than those other buts.

    We make things worse and it costs American lives. The people who benefit the most are politicians, the military industrial complex and oil companies. And they will always have a but to sell you.
    This is totally fair, but I'll just never be completely anti intervention. WWI and II were the right moves. More recently I think we had to stop ISIS, for example, and would have felt that way even if it wasn't Bush and Obama's fuckups that had created them in the first place.

    Figuring out where to draw the line is tricky and we'll probably never get it exactly right. But some crises are too big to ignore.
    Hitler is one of them. Maduro is not.

    Not since WW2 has any country's people been better off after we removed the person in power.

    Not a single instance.
  • HillsboroDuck
    HillsboroDuck Member Posts: 9,186
    pawz said:

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    I think if you put a but after the words “generally anti interventionism” you are not generally anti interventionism.

    There will always be a reason to use the but. But 9/11. But WMD’s. But chemical attacks. But it’s closer to home than those other buts.

    We make things worse and it costs American lives. The people who benefit the most are politicians, the military industrial complex and oil companies. And they will always have a but to sell you.
    This is totally fair, but I'll just never be completely anti intervention. WWI and II were the right moves. More recently I think we had to stop ISIS, for example, and would have felt that way even if it wasn't Bush and Obama's fuckups that had created them in the first place.

    Figuring out where to draw the line is tricky and we'll probably never get it exactly right. But some crises are too big to ignore.
    Hitler is one of them. Maduro is not.

    Not since WW2 has any country's people been better off after we removed the person in power.

    Not a single instance.

    I haven't done the research but that sounds extremely unlikely to me. Noriega? Not pushing Hussein out of Kuwait? Gorbechev?

    I assume you mean exclusively violent overthrows of sitting governments rather than invaders. But even then that doesn't pass the smell test.
  • MariotaTheGawd
    MariotaTheGawd Member Posts: 1,441

    pawz said:

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    I think if you put a but after the words “generally anti interventionism” you are not generally anti interventionism.

    There will always be a reason to use the but. But 9/11. But WMD’s. But chemical attacks. But it’s closer to home than those other buts.

    We make things worse and it costs American lives. The people who benefit the most are politicians, the military industrial complex and oil companies. And they will always have a but to sell you.
    This is totally fair, but I'll just never be completely anti intervention. WWI and II were the right moves. More recently I think we had to stop ISIS, for example, and would have felt that way even if it wasn't Bush and Obama's fuckups that had created them in the first place.

    Figuring out where to draw the line is tricky and we'll probably never get it exactly right. But some crises are too big to ignore.
    Hitler is one of them. Maduro is not.

    Not since WW2 has any country's people been better off after we removed the person in power.

    Not a single instance.

    I haven't done the research but that sounds extremely unlikely to me. Noriega? Not pushing Hussein out of Kuwait? Gorbechev?

    I assume you mean exclusively violent overthrows of sitting governments rather than invaders. But even then that doesn't pass the smell test.
    I have a crazy idea: maybe you should do the research
  • pawz
    pawz Member, Moderator, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 22,476 Founders Club

    pawz said:

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    I think if you put a but after the words “generally anti interventionism” you are not generally anti interventionism.

    There will always be a reason to use the but. But 9/11. But WMD’s. But chemical attacks. But it’s closer to home than those other buts.

    We make things worse and it costs American lives. The people who benefit the most are politicians, the military industrial complex and oil companies. And they will always have a but to sell you.
    This is totally fair, but I'll just never be completely anti intervention. WWI and II were the right moves. More recently I think we had to stop ISIS, for example, and would have felt that way even if it wasn't Bush and Obama's fuckups that had created them in the first place.

    Figuring out where to draw the line is tricky and we'll probably never get it exactly right. But some crises are too big to ignore.
    Hitler is one of them. Maduro is not.

    Not since WW2 has any country's people been better off after we removed the person in power.

    Not a single instance.

    I haven't done the research but that sounds extremely unlikely to me. Noriega? Not pushing Hussein out of Kuwait? Gorbechev?

    I assume you mean exclusively violent overthrows of sitting governments rather than invaders. But even then that doesn't pass the smell test.
    Yes. Correct.
  • MariotaTheGawd
    MariotaTheGawd Member Posts: 1,441

    pawz said:

    pawz said:

    Counter-poont, Aaron Matè.



    https://youtu.be/vq7ngZgzU-k

    You've already posted this.

    The fact that there are some Venezuelans who support the Commies and don't want the US to intervene in no way means there aren't Venezuelans who feel the opposite, or that the US doesn't have some responsibility.

    I'm generally anti interventionism, but 3 million refugees in our own half of the world should be enough to get our attention.
    I think if you put a but after the words “generally anti interventionism” you are not generally anti interventionism.

    There will always be a reason to use the but. But 9/11. But WMD’s. But chemical attacks. But it’s closer to home than those other buts.

    We make things worse and it costs American lives. The people who benefit the most are politicians, the military industrial complex and oil companies. And they will always have a but to sell you.
    This is totally fair, but I'll just never be completely anti intervention. WWI and II were the right moves. More recently I think we had to stop ISIS, for example, and would have felt that way even if it wasn't Bush and Obama's fuckups that had created them in the first place.

    Figuring out where to draw the line is tricky and we'll probably never get it exactly right. But some crises are too big to ignore.
    Hitler is one of them. Maduro is not.

    Not since WW2 has any country's people been better off after we removed the person in power.

    Not a single instance.

    I haven't done the research but that sounds extremely unlikely to me. Noriega? Not pushing Hussein out of Kuwait? Gorbechev?

    I assume you mean exclusively violent overthrows of sitting governments rather than invaders. But even then that doesn't pass the smell test.
    I have a crazy idea: maybe you should do the research
    Maybe you should fuck off.
    Lol dont get all mad now
  • MariotaTheGawd
    MariotaTheGawd Member Posts: 1,441
    I dont know anything about this topic but I'm going to weigh in anyway and you'd better respect my opinion