Good stuff with all of these. That said, you have Yankoff and Sirmon’s rankings mixed up.
Sirmon’s ceiling is much higher than Yankoff’s ... hate to break that to you
This is dumb. Yankoff has a higher floor and they both have equally massive ceilings. Sirmon might have a slightly higher NFL ceiling but their college ceilings are both Heisman Trophy high if they put it all together. No one has a higher college ceiling than Yankoff.
You are David Shaw FS with this ...
I don’t give 2 shits whether you hate Sirmon because DJ decides that performance on a high school field means jack shit or because you think it will be cool some day to say that you Yankoff for Yankoff.
If you can't see that Sirmon has an insane amount of arm talent and particularly that he has way more arm talent than Yankoff then you should have your TBS talking ability taken away from you. Yankoff may be talented and whatnot but Sirmon has the kind of arm talent that is elite at the national level. The fucking film shows that. The throws he makes if you put that on college film you are fucking jazzing in your shorts ... to get that out of a HS kid ... FUCK OFF.
The Sirmon hate is insanely fucking stupid. He's an elite kid. If Yankoff beats him out ... then good on him. But if you tell me right now that Browning is hurt and we need a QB to play come Game #1 of next year versus Auburn and I have to choose between Yankoff and Sirmon, it's Sirmon by a mile. Anybody that disagrees is a fucking idiot.
I just said Sirmon has a Heisman Trophy ceiling. I'm well aware he has amazing arm talent. The problem here is you underrate Yankoff's ceiling because you overrate arm talent of which Yankoff has more than enough to star in college. If you're not chinterested in reading than you're not worth debating.
Haener is dead man walking. I agree with Teq that Sirmon’s arm is elite. And anyone who hates on him needs to Doog harder. That said, I’m hoping we’ve got Hobert/Brunell 2.0 on the horizon.
Haener is the 2nd QB on the depth chart now... Unfortunately he's not going anywhere.
Haener is dead man walking. I agree with Teq that Sirmon’s arm is elite. And anyone who hates on him needs to Doog harder. That said, I’m hoping we’ve got Hobert/Brunell 2.0 on the horizon.
Haener is the 2nd QB on the depth chart now... Unfortunately he's not going anywhere.
He better enjoy his time as a backup because as soon as Sirmon and Yanker show up he’s going to fall way back on the depth chart.
Haener is dead man walking. I agree with Teq that Sirmon’s arm is elite. And anyone who hates on him needs to Doog harder. That said, I’m hoping we’ve got Hobert/Brunell 2.0 on the horizon.
Haener is the 2nd QB on the depth chart now... Unfortunately he's not going anywhere.
He better enjoy his time as a backup because as soon as Sirmon and Yanker show up he’s going to fall way back on the depth chart.
Yeah, but he's not getting Jimmy Hoffa'd. He'll just be the scout team QB.
Haener is dead man walking. I agree with Teq that Sirmon’s arm is elite. And anyone who hates on him needs to Doog harder. That said, I’m hoping we’ve got Hobert/Brunell 2.0 on the horizon.
Haener is the 2nd QB on the depth chart now... Unfortunately he's not going anywhere.
He better enjoy his time as a backup because as soon as Sirmon and Yanker show up he’s going to fall way back on the depth chart.
Yeah, but he's not getting Jimmy Hoffa'd. He'll just be the scout team QB.
Haener is dead man walking. I agree with Teq that Sirmon’s arm is elite. And anyone who hates on him needs to Doog harder. That said, I’m hoping we’ve got Hobert/Brunell 2.0 on the horizon.
Haener is the 2nd QB on the depth chart now... Unfortunately he's not going anywhere.
Feel sort of bad for the kid. Plus I "know" his Mom, which makes me related to him in some biblical sense I'm sure.
Haener is dead man walking. I agree with Teq that Sirmon’s arm is elite. And anyone who hates on him needs to Doog harder. That said, I’m hoping we’ve got Hobert/Brunell 2.0 on the horizon.
Haener is the 2nd QB on the depth chart now... Unfortunately he's not going anywhere.
He better enjoy his time as a backup because as soon as Sirmon and Yanker show up he’s going to fall way back on the depth chart.
Yeah, but he's not getting Jimmy Hoffa'd. He'll just be the scout team QB.
It would be hilarious if he ends starting
Here's the thing... if Jake Haener beats out Skinny Eason, Jacob Sirmon and Colson Yankoff - THEN FINE!!!
IDGAF. It's entirely possible that he will. It's not likely, but it is possible.
I don't care if it happens, I just don't want him beating out DBG and other guys that should be at N.Arizona.
This is the essence of why I care about recruiting... I don't mind that we took Dick Newton. Well - I do. I hate that fucker.
However, I don't mind that we took ZTF even though I don't think he's a particularly great prospect. What I do mind is that if ZTF beats out only guys who themselves were not highly recruited, then you have a cycle of suck.
Haener is dead man walking. I agree with Teq that Sirmon’s arm is elite. And anyone who hates on him needs to Doog harder. That said, I’m hoping we’ve got Hobert/Brunell 2.0 on the horizon.
Good stuff with all of these. That said, you have Yankoff and Sirmon’s rankings mixed up.
Sirmon’s ceiling is much higher than Yankoff’s ... hate to break that to you
This is dumb. Yankoff has a higher floor and they both have equally massive ceilings. Sirmon might have a slightly higher NFL ceiling but their college ceilings are both Heisman Trophy high if they put it all together. No one has a higher college ceiling than Yankoff.
You are David Shaw FS with this ...
I don’t give 2 shits whether you hate Sirmon because DJ decides that performance on a high school field means jack shit or because you think it will be cool some day to say that you Yankoff for Yankoff.
If you can't see that Sirmon has an insane amount of arm talent and particularly that he has way more arm talent than Yankoff then you should have your TBS talking ability taken away from you. Yankoff may be talented and whatnot but Sirmon has the kind of arm talent that is elite at the national level. The fucking film shows that. The throws he makes if you put that on college film you are fucking jazzing in your shorts ... to get that out of a HS kid ... FUCK OFF.
The Sirmon hate is insanely fucking stupid. He's an elite kid. If Yankoff beats him out ... then good on him. But if you tell me right now that Browning is hurt and we need a QB to play come Game #1 of next year versus Auburn and I have to choose between Yankoff and Sirmon, it's Sirmon by a mile. Anybody that disagrees is a fucking idiot.
I just said Sirmon has a Heisman Trophy ceiling. I'm well aware he has amazing arm talent. The problem here is you underrate Yankoff's ceiling because you overrate arm talent of which Yankoff has more than enough to star in college. If you're not chinterested in reading than you're not worth debating.
Don’t make me take off the gloves ...
Sirmon has all the arm talent in the world ... he needs to clean up his fundamentals as he gets lazy at times with his footwork
Yankoff to me is more of a gamer as a QB that while he has a good arm needs to develop his throws more as he’s doesn’t have the variety in his throws needed to be elite
If we needed one of them to start next year as a freshman, it’d likely be Sirmon with the greater upside.
I like both but I expect that Sirmon will win the battle
Good stuff with all of these. That said, you have Yankoff and Sirmon’s rankings mixed up.
Sirmon’s ceiling is much higher than Yankoff’s ... hate to break that to you
This is dumb. Yankoff has a higher floor and they both have equally massive ceilings. Sirmon might have a slightly higher NFL ceiling but their college ceilings are both Heisman Trophy high if they put it all together. No one has a higher college ceiling than Yankoff.
You are David Shaw FS with this ...
I don’t give 2 shits whether you hate Sirmon because DJ decides that performance on a high school field means jack shit or because you think it will be cool some day to say that you Yankoff for Yankoff.
If you can't see that Sirmon has an insane amount of arm talent and particularly that he has way more arm talent than Yankoff then you should have your TBS talking ability taken away from you. Yankoff may be talented and whatnot but Sirmon has the kind of arm talent that is elite at the national level. The fucking film shows that. The throws he makes if you put that on college film you are fucking jazzing in your shorts ... to get that out of a HS kid ... FUCK OFF.
The Sirmon hate is insanely fucking stupid. He's an elite kid. If Yankoff beats him out ... then good on him. But if you tell me right now that Browning is hurt and we need a QB to play come Game #1 of next year versus Auburn and I have to choose between Yankoff and Sirmon, it's Sirmon by a mile. Anybody that disagrees is a fucking idiot.
I just said Sirmon has a Heisman Trophy ceiling. I'm well aware he has amazing arm talent. The problem here is you underrate Yankoff's ceiling because you overrate arm talent of which Yankoff has more than enough to star in college. If you're not chinterested in reading than you're not worth debating.
Don’t make me take off the gloves ...
Sirmon has all the arm talent in the world ... he needs to clean up his fundamentals as he gets lazy at times with his footwork
Yankoff to me is more of a gamer as a QB that while he has a good arm needs to develop his throws more as he’s doesn’t have the variety in his throws needed to be elite
If we needed one of them to start next year as a freshman, it’d likely be Sirmon with the greater upside.
I like both but I expect that Sirmon will win the battle
Well I'm not gonna sleep tonight. You have thoroughly spooked me.
But @dnc you're simplifying like crazy by saying we like Sirmon for his arm talent. First of all, arm talent is more than just how far you can throw it. It's how much zip you can put on different throws, how much touch you can throw it with, how accurate you are to different parts of the field, how well you can throw on the move or generally without setting your feet... All kinds of shit.
You say it like it's one skill when it's really a group of skills where Sirmon outshines Yankoff in every one of them, despite the fact that Yankoff is adequate to good in all of them. Sirmon just has that good of an arm. Sirmon does all these things really well. I don't think we're overrating his arm talent at all. How the fuck can you overrate a QB's ability to throw the ball in all kinds of different situations?
Decision-making matters a lot too, but I don't see any reason to think Yankoff is better than Sirmon here. He makes a lot of wide open throws. Which is all well and good, you should throw to the open guy, but Sirmon has shown that he can make plays with his arm that Yankoff hasn't so far. He can throw into tight windows when he has to, he can make bucket throws, and he can throw it in spots where only his guy can get it.
Why do you think Sirmon has a higher ceiling? Because he's more athletic? He's really fast in a straight line, but he's not a runner like Mariota, Watson, or Hurts. He could be, but he's not right now. He doesn't give us a better chance to win just because he can run the read-option better. Sirmon moves plenty good enough to be excellent on bootlegs, and he's shown an ability to slide around the pocket, and to scramble out of it and win time to pass.
When a play breaks down I'd rather have the guy who can make a play with his arm while being chased down, rather than a guy who goes past his first read then takes off. Sirmon is quick enough to be a dual-threat in the red zone. I think right now Yankoff is more of just a running threat there.
Good stuff with all of these. That said, you have Yankoff and Sirmon’s rankings mixed up.
Sirmon’s ceiling is much higher than Yankoff’s ... hate to break that to you
This is dumb. Yankoff has a higher floor and they both have equally massive ceilings. Sirmon might have a slightly higher NFL ceiling but their college ceilings are both Heisman Trophy high if they put it all together. No one has a higher college ceiling than Yankoff.
You are David Shaw FS with this ...
I don’t give 2 shits whether you hate Sirmon because DJ decides that performance on a high school field means jack shit or because you think it will be cool some day to say that you Yankoff for Yankoff.
If you can't see that Sirmon has an insane amount of arm talent and particularly that he has way more arm talent than Yankoff then you should have your TBS talking ability taken away from you. Yankoff may be talented and whatnot but Sirmon has the kind of arm talent that is elite at the national level. The fucking film shows that. The throws he makes if you put that on college film you are fucking jazzing in your shorts ... to get that out of a HS kid ... FUCK OFF.
The Sirmon hate is insanely fucking stupid. He's an elite kid. If Yankoff beats him out ... then good on him. But if you tell me right now that Browning is hurt and we need a QB to play come Game #1 of next year versus Auburn and I have to choose between Yankoff and Sirmon, it's Sirmon by a mile. Anybody that disagrees is a fucking idiot.
I just said Sirmon has a Heisman Trophy ceiling. I'm well aware he has amazing arm talent. The problem here is you underrate Yankoff's ceiling because you overrate arm talent of which Yankoff has more than enough to star in college. If you're not chinterested in reading than you're not worth debating.
Don’t make me take off the gloves ...
Sirmon has all the arm talent in the world ... he needs to clean up his fundamentals as he gets lazy at times with his footwork
Yankoff to me is more of a gamer as a QB that while he has a good arm needs to develop his throws more as he’s doesn’t have the variety in his throws needed to be elite
If we needed one of them to start next year as a freshman, it’d likely be Sirmon with the greater upside.
I like both but I expect that Sirmon will win the battle
Well I'm not gonna sleep tonight. You have thoroughly spooked me.
But @dnc you're simplifying like crazy by saying we like Sirmon for his arm talent. First of all, arm talent is more than just how far you can throw it. It's how much zip you can put on different throws, how much touch you can throw it with, how accurate you are to different parts of the field, how well you can throw on the move or generally without setting your feet... All kinds of shit.
You say it like it's one skill when it's really a group of skills where Sirmon outshines Yankoff in every one of them, despite the fact that Yankoff is adequate to good in all of them. Sirmon just has that good of an arm. Sirmon does all these things really well. I don't think we're overrating his arm talent at all. How the fuck can you overrate a QB's ability to throw the ball in all kinds of different situations?
Decision-making matters a lot too, but I don't see any reason to think Yankoff is better than Sirmon here. He makes a lot of wide open throws. Which is all well and good, you should throw to the open guy, but Sirmon has shown that he can make plays with his arm that Yankoff hasn't so far. He can throw into tight windows when he has to, he can make bucket throws, and he can throw it in spots where only his guy can get it.
Why do you think Sirmon has a higher ceiling? Because he's more athletic? He's really fast in a straight line, but he's not a runner like Mariota, Watson, or Hurts. He could be, but he's not right now. He doesn't give us a better chance to win just because he can run the read-option better. Sirmon moves plenty good enough to be excellent on bootlegs, and he's shown an ability to slide around the pocket, and to scramble out of it and win time to pass.
When a play breaks down I'd rather have the guy who can make a play with his arm while being chased down, rather than a guy who goes past his first read then takes off. Sirmon is quick enough to be a dual-threat in the red zone. I think right now Yankoff is more of just a running threat there.
Just think, a couple years ago we were debating cyler miles as the starting QB, and now we could potentially have 4 QB's on the roster that are clearly better than miles ever was.
All the cock swinging over who's better, who's going to be right is certainly warranted among white men, however let's keep in mind that these gentleman will have at least a year to prove who is better man, and just like Skinny found out at Georgia, you never know when one door closes another opens for a guy you didn't expect. Whomever wins the job may not have it in a year, or in 2 weeks. To be a quality top 5 program we need depth and competition. Not anointing players.
It's a good fucking debate and it's finally nice to argue over quality over who's the tallest midget to fuck
Just think, a couple years ago we were debating cyler miles as the starting QB, and now we could potentially have 4 QB's on the roster that are clearly better than miles ever was.
All the cock swinging over who's better, who's going to be right is certainly warranted among white men, however let's keep in mind that these gentleman will have at least a year to prove who is better man, and just like Skinny found out at Georgia, you never know when one door closes another opens for a guy you didn't expect. Whomever wins the job may not have it in a year, or in 2 weeks. To be a quality top 5 program we need depth and competition. Not anointing players.
It's a good fucking debate and it's finally nice to argue over quality over who's the tallest midget to fuck
Good stuff with all of these. That said, you have Yankoff and Sirmon’s rankings mixed up.
Sirmon’s ceiling is much higher than Yankoff’s ... hate to break that to you
This is dumb. Yankoff has a higher floor and they both have equally massive ceilings. Sirmon might have a slightly higher NFL ceiling but their college ceilings are both Heisman Trophy high if they put it all together. No one has a higher college ceiling than Yankoff.
You are David Shaw FS with this ...
I don’t give 2 shits whether you hate Sirmon because DJ decides that performance on a high school field means jack shit or because you think it will be cool some day to say that you Yankoff for Yankoff.
If you can't see that Sirmon has an insane amount of arm talent and particularly that he has way more arm talent than Yankoff then you should have your TBS talking ability taken away from you. Yankoff may be talented and whatnot but Sirmon has the kind of arm talent that is elite at the national level. The fucking film shows that. The throws he makes if you put that on college film you are fucking jazzing in your shorts ... to get that out of a HS kid ... FUCK OFF.
The Sirmon hate is insanely fucking stupid. He's an elite kid. If Yankoff beats him out ... then good on him. But if you tell me right now that Browning is hurt and we need a QB to play come Game #1 of next year versus Auburn and I have to choose between Yankoff and Sirmon, it's Sirmon by a mile. Anybody that disagrees is a fucking idiot.
I just said Sirmon has a Heisman Trophy ceiling. I'm well aware he has amazing arm talent. The problem here is you underrate Yankoff's ceiling because you overrate arm talent of which Yankoff has more than enough to star in college. If you're not chinterested in reading than you're not worth debating.
Don’t make me take off the gloves ...
Sirmon has all the arm talent in the world ... he needs to clean up his fundamentals as he gets lazy at times with his footwork
Yankoff to me is more of a gamer as a QB that while he has a good arm needs to develop his throws more as he’s doesn’t have the variety in his throws needed to be elite
If we needed one of them to start next year as a freshman, it’d likely be Sirmon with the greater upside.
I like both but I expect that Sirmon will win the battle
Well I'm not gonna sleep tonight. You have thoroughly spooked me.
But @dnc you're simplifying like crazy by saying we like Sirmon for his arm talent. First of all, arm talent is more than just how far you can throw it. It's how much zip you can put on different throws, how much touch you can throw it with, how accurate you are to different parts of the field, how well you can throw on the move or generally without setting your feet... All kinds of shit.
You say it like it's one skill when it's really a group of skills where Sirmon outshines Yankoff in every one of them, despite the fact that Yankoff is adequate to good in all of them. Sirmon just has that good of an arm. Sirmon does all these things really well. I don't think we're overrating his arm talent at all. How the fuck can you overrate a QB's ability to throw the ball in all kinds of different situations?
Decision-making matters a lot too, but I don't see any reason to think Yankoff is better than Sirmon here. He makes a lot of wide open throws. Which is all well and good, you should throw to the open guy, but Sirmon has shown that he can make plays with his arm that Yankoff hasn't so far. He can throw into tight windows when he has to, he can make bucket throws, and he can throw it in spots where only his guy can get it.
Why do you think Sirmon has a higher ceiling? Because he's more athletic? He's really fast in a straight line, but he's not a runner like Mariota, Watson, or Hurts. He could be, but he's not right now. He doesn't give us a better chance to win just because he can run the read-option better. Sirmon moves plenty good enough to be excellent on bootlegs, and he's shown an ability to slide around the pocket, and to scramble out of it and win time to pass.
When a play breaks down I'd rather have the guy who can make a play with his arm while being chased down, rather than a guy who goes past his first read then takes off. Sirmon is quick enough to be a dual-threat in the red zone. I think right now Yankoff is more of just a running threat there.
The two greatest QBs of all tim are Tom Brady and Joe Montana, and neither had were ever anointed as having "elite arm talent".
Really, of the top 10 QBs of all time you'd really only put three or four of them as elite arm guys (Elway, Marino and Rodgers...Favre if you include him in the top ten).
Arm talent matters. I'm not arguing it doesn't. But this bored is generally overrating it right now because we've spent the last three years watching Browning and before that Cyler Miles. There are plenty of elite arm talents who never became elite QBs and plenty of elite QBs who were never considered elite arm talents.
In my impressions Yankoff is more consistently accurate than Sirmon. That's by far the most important arm talent to me once you've past a certain threshold of adequate arm strength which Yankoff is past. He's also shown an ability to rise to the occasion in big moments against big opponents which Sirmon has yet to display.
Those are the two most characteristics of a QB for me, with arm talent coming in third or fourth depending on if you consider leadership separate from the second one above or part of the same package.
I like Sirmon a lot. I'm thrilled we have him. I don't really give a fuck that he can make all the throws though. Yankoff can make all the throws we'll need him to.
I'm with DDY, whichever one wins the competition will be a star. I just think it will be Yankoff. And I'm not buying any BS about Sirmon having a higher ceiling because he has a better arm when the best QBs of all time didn't have "great" arms.
And yeah I left out reading defenses which is probably more important than anything I listed we just have no idea whether Sirmon or Yankoff can do that better or worse than the other one yet.
And yeah I left out reading defenses which is probably more important than anything I listed we just have no idea whether Sirmon or Yankoff can do that better or worse than the other one yet.
The two are accuracy and decision making. If your QB has both of those he will be successful.
Football history is filled with morons that had cannon arms.
And yeah I left out reading defenses which is probably more important than anything I listed we just have no idea whether Sirmon or Yankoff can do that better or worse than the other one yet.
The two are accuracy and decision making. If your QB has both of those he will be successful.
Football history is filled with morons that had cannon arms.
Comments
IDGAF. It's entirely possible that he will. It's not likely, but it is possible.
I don't care if it happens, I just don't want him beating out DBG and other guys that should be at N.Arizona.
This is the essence of why I care about recruiting... I don't mind that we took Dick Newton. Well - I do. I hate that fucker.
However, I don't mind that we took ZTF even though I don't think he's a particularly great prospect. What I do mind is that if ZTF beats out only guys who themselves were not highly recruited, then you have a cycle of suck.
Sirmon has all the arm talent in the world ... he needs to clean up his fundamentals as he gets lazy at times with his footwork
Yankoff to me is more of a gamer as a QB that while he has a good arm needs to develop his throws more as he’s doesn’t have the variety in his throws needed to be elite
If we needed one of them to start next year as a freshman, it’d likely be Sirmon with the greater upside.
I like both but I expect that Sirmon will win the battle
But @dnc you're simplifying like crazy by saying we like Sirmon for his arm talent. First of all, arm talent is more than just how far you can throw it. It's how much zip you can put on different throws, how much touch you can throw it with, how accurate you are to different parts of the field, how well you can throw on the move or generally without setting your feet... All kinds of shit.
You say it like it's one skill when it's really a group of skills where Sirmon outshines Yankoff in every one of them, despite the fact that Yankoff is adequate to good in all of them. Sirmon just has that good of an arm. Sirmon does all these things really well. I don't think we're overrating his arm talent at all. How the fuck can you overrate a QB's ability to throw the ball in all kinds of different situations?
Decision-making matters a lot too, but I don't see any reason to think Yankoff is better than Sirmon here. He makes a lot of wide open throws. Which is all well and good, you should throw to the open guy, but Sirmon has shown that he can make plays with his arm that Yankoff hasn't so far. He can throw into tight windows when he has to, he can make bucket throws, and he can throw it in spots where only his guy can get it.
Why do you think Sirmon has a higher ceiling? Because he's more athletic? He's really fast in a straight line, but he's not a runner like Mariota, Watson, or Hurts. He could be, but he's not right now. He doesn't give us a better chance to win just because he can run the read-option better. Sirmon moves plenty good enough to be excellent on bootlegs, and he's shown an ability to slide around the pocket, and to scramble out of it and win time to pass.
When a play breaks down I'd rather have the guy who can make a play with his arm while being chased down, rather than a guy who goes past his first read then takes off. Sirmon is quick enough to be a dual-threat in the red zone. I think right now Yankoff is more of just a running threat there.
All the cock swinging over who's better, who's going to be right is certainly warranted among white men, however let's keep in mind that these gentleman will have at least a year to prove who is better man, and just like Skinny found out at Georgia, you never know when one door closes another opens for a guy you didn't expect. Whomever wins the job may not have it in a year, or in 2 weeks. To be a quality top 5 program we need depth and competition. Not anointing players.
It's a good fucking debate and it's finally nice to argue over quality over who's the tallest midget to fuck
We got them both and I think they are both high quality recruits. Let's do this shit.
Really, of the top 10 QBs of all time you'd really only put three or four of them as elite arm guys (Elway, Marino and Rodgers...Favre if you include him in the top ten).
Arm talent matters. I'm not arguing it doesn't. But this bored is generally overrating it right now because we've spent the last three years watching Browning and before that Cyler Miles. There are plenty of elite arm talents who never became elite QBs and plenty of elite QBs who were never considered elite arm talents.
In my impressions Yankoff is more consistently accurate than Sirmon. That's by far the most important arm talent to me once you've past a certain threshold of adequate arm strength which Yankoff is past. He's also shown an ability to rise to the occasion in big moments against big opponents which Sirmon has yet to display.
Those are the two most characteristics of a QB for me, with arm talent coming in third or fourth depending on if you consider leadership separate from the second one above or part of the same package.
I like Sirmon a lot. I'm thrilled we have him. I don't really give a fuck that he can make all the throws though. Yankoff can make all the throws we'll need him to.
I'm with DDY, whichever one wins the competition will be a star. I just think it will be Yankoff. And I'm not buying any BS about Sirmon having a higher ceiling because he has a better arm when the best QBs of all time didn't have "great" arms.
Just be great. "Arm talent" or not.
Football history is filled with morons that had cannon arms.
Kirby sucked. And looked weird. Is he still on our coaching staff?