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New Podcast: Grubby Sweatpants Football Forum

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Comments

  • TurdBomberTurdBomber Member Posts: 19,971 Standard Supporter

    Hey man, UW may be a turd, but they're OUR TURD!

    'Scuse me. My Turd. Thank you.
  • TequillaTequilla Member Posts: 19,880
    I can't help but set some of the record straight on defense and the Big 12 ... you have to understand what is leading into this to understand that a lot of it starts way before the kids get onto a college campus.

    If you go to the HS level in Texas, EVERYBODY is running the spread offense and putting all of their best players on offense. HS offense in Texas is really simple ... spread everybody out, identify the defender that sucks, and attack that player over and over and over again. As a result, the balance of offensive to defensive recruits in Texas is a little skewed.

    Then, when you get to the games in the Big 12, the one thing that they do probably better than anybody else (and this is stemmed from the transition for many kids from HS to college) is play with tempo to the point that they keep defensive players on the field in positions where not only can they not sub, but lining up and getting defensive calls is a challenge. For example, prior to this week's debacle at Okie Lite, Charlie Strong was getting a ton of credit for how the Texas offense got changed over ... pretty much the credit is driven by the fact that they installed the offense of their freshman QB from HS so that he didn't have to learn anything new.

    Specifically as it pertains to TCU and Gary Patterson or even Oklahoma and Bob Stoops, this is a situation where I think with both of them you have situations where you have a convergence of the underlying HS feeder systems (including best players on offense) and needing to reconsider some of their schemes in relation to not only what other teams are running, but what they are able to recruit.

    As a bit of an aside to the above, the best way to stop spread teams is to be able to rush 3-4 guys, drop the rest into coverage to flood the passing lanes (forcing teams to go sideways), and being sure tacklers. If you really get down to it, go back the last 2-4 years in the Big 12 and find me elite DL's ... you won't find one and you won't find one that is anywhere close to what Washington has right now

    Anybody that understand the defense of Gary Patterson can tell you that it is simplistic in its scheme and is based on execution by its players. It's probably a defense at this point that would work better in the NFL than what he has had at TCU the last few years. Last year, literally every single projected defensive starter had an injury at some point during the year and many of those injuries were season ending injuries. If you go back and look at the defensive output it got better throughout the year. This year the secondary is flat out bad by TCU standards and as a result it gets compromised easily. And against spread teams, if you can't cover and shade your defense to protect against the pass whether it is setting your LBs a little deeper or playing your DBs with more cushion you're in a position where you're likely going to be outnumbered in the run game (anybody that watched the TCU-Oklahoma game could see that easily) and/or giving up easy throws in the passing game.

    Moreover, in calling out the 2014 game against Baylor where TCU lost 61-58, it's glossing over the balance of a 12-1 season where 1) the team averaged giving up 19 points per game defensively (which including giving up 61 in a game) and 2) destroyed a very good Ole Miss team in the Peach Bowl by giving up 3 points to them. Specifically in the Baylor game, looking at the numbers shines a bit of a light on how Big 12 offenses can really stretch defenses. In that game, Bryce Petty for Baylor completed only 28 of his 55 catches ... but those 28 completions went for 510 yards. Simply put, once Baylor realized that they couldn't complete their usual short passing game against the TCU defense, they more or less decided to just take shot after shot after shot for the rest of the game (which had also been a staple of many other recent TCU/Baylor games at the time). In doing so, it also softened TCU's run defense allowing Baylor to run 54 times for 272 yards. And while the yardage looked great, the results weren't there because with 11:38 to go in the game TCU was up by 21 points. However, when you run close to 100 plays in a game and are asked to defend that many plays, at some point you break and that's what happened to TCU's defense at that point.

    There's a lot that goes into the mess that is Big 12 defenses right now. But the balance of it starts with the allocation of players between offense/defense and how the offensive coaches are able to stretch every rule advantage in their favor as possible whether it be the hurry up to prevent substitutions or getting OL down the field on RPO's. What's going on in the Big 12 right now isn't that dissimilar to some of what went on in the PAC 10 in the 1990's where seemingly every single team had a QB that was really good and if that QB got hot in a game you were in trouble
  • MisterEmMisterEm Member Posts: 6,685
    Jesus.

    Big12 doesn't play defense. 'Nuff said on that.
  • RaceBannonRaceBannon Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 105,976 Founders Club
    MisterEm said:

    Jesus.

    Big12 doesn't play defense. 'Nuff said on that.

    I read this one
  • RaceBannonRaceBannon Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 105,976 Founders Club
    Tequilla said:

    I can't help but set some of the record straight on defense and the Big 12 ... you have to understand what is leading into this to understand that a lot of it starts way before the kids get onto a college campus.

    If you go to the HS level in Texas, EVERYBODY is running the spread offense and putting all of their best players on offense. HS offense in Texas is really simple ... spread everybody out, identify the defender that sucks, and attack that player over and over and over again. As a result, the balance of offensive to defensive recruits in Texas is a little skewed.

    Then, when you get to the games in the Big 12, the one thing that they do probably better than anybody else (and this is stemmed from the transition for many kids from HS to college) is play with tempo to the point that they keep defensive players on the field in positions where not only can they not sub, but lining up and getting defensive calls is a challenge. For example, prior to this week's debacle at Okie Lite, Charlie Strong was getting a ton of credit for how the Texas offense got changed over ... pretty much the credit is driven by the fact that they installed the offense of their freshman QB from HS so that he didn't have to learn anything new.

    Specifically as it pertains to TCU and Gary Patterson or even Oklahoma and Bob Stoops, this is a situation where I think with both of them you have situations where you have a convergence of the underlying HS feeder systems (including best players on offense) and needing to reconsider some of their schemes in relation to not only what other teams are running, but what they are able to recruit.

    As a bit of an aside to the above, the best way to stop spread teams is to be able to rush 3-4 guys, drop the rest into coverage to flood the passing lanes (forcing teams to go sideways), and being sure tacklers. If you really get down to it, go back the last 2-4 years in the Big 12 and find me elite DL's ... you won't find one and you won't find one that is anywhere close to what Washington has right now

    Anybody that understand the defense of Gary Patterson can tell you that it is simplistic in its scheme and is based on execution by its players. It's probably a defense at this point that would work better in the NFL than what he has had at TCU the last few years. Last year, literally every single projected defensive starter had an injury at some point during the year and many of those injuries were season ending injuries. If you go back and look at the defensive output it got better throughout the year. This year the secondary is flat out bad by TCU standards and as a result it gets compromised easily. And against spread teams, if you can't cover and shade your defense to protect against the pass whether it is setting your LBs a little deeper or playing your DBs with more cushion you're in a position where you're likely going to be outnumbered in the run game (anybody that watched the TCU-Oklahoma game could see that easily) and/or giving up easy throws in the passing game.

    Moreover, in calling out the 2014 game against Baylor where TCU lost 61-58, it's glossing over the balance of a 12-1 season where 1) the team averaged giving up 19 points per game defensively (which including giving up 61 in a game) and 2) destroyed a very good Ole Miss team in the Peach Bowl by giving up 3 points to them. Specifically in the Baylor game, looking at the numbers shines a bit of a light on how Big 12 offenses can really stretch defenses. In that game, Bryce Petty for Baylor completed only 28 of his 55 catches ... but those 28 completions went for 510 yards. Simply put, once Baylor realized that they couldn't complete their usual short passing game against the TCU defense, they more or less decided to just take shot after shot after shot for the rest of the game (which had also been a staple of many other recent TCU/Baylor games at the time). In doing so, it also softened TCU's run defense allowing Baylor to run 54 times for 272 yards. And while the yardage looked great, the results weren't there because with 11:38 to go in the game TCU was up by 21 points. However, when you run close to 100 plays in a game and are asked to defend that many plays, at some point you break and that's what happened to TCU's defense at that point.

    There's a lot that goes into the mess that is Big 12 defenses right now. But the balance of it starts with the allocation of players between offense/defense and how the offensive coaches are able to stretch every rule advantage in their favor as possible whether it be the hurry up to prevent substitutions or getting OL down the field on RPO's. What's going on in the Big 12 right now isn't that dissimilar to some of what went on in the PAC 10 in the 1990's where seemingly every single team had a QB that was really good and if that QB got hot in a game you were in trouble

    I didn't read this one
  • TurdBomberTurdBomber Member Posts: 19,971 Standard Supporter

    I didn't read this one

    Didn't read what?
  • SoutherndawgSoutherndawg Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 8,299 Founders Club
    Baylor is a turd from a turd conference. Enough said on that.
  • H_DH_D Member Posts: 6,098

    H_D said:

    What the fuck kind of "pizza" is that?

    Northlake Tavern or GTFO.
    image
    I thought I knew you man.
  • TurdBomberTurdBomber Member Posts: 19,971 Standard Supporter

    Baylor is a turd from a turd conference. Enough said on that.

    I'll be the judge of that, thank you.
  • SoutherndawgSoutherndawg Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 8,299 Founders Club

    Baylor is a turd from a turd conference. Enough said on that.

    I'll be the judge of that, thank you.
    Well?
  • TurdBomberTurdBomber Member Posts: 19,971 Standard Supporter
    edited October 2016

    Baylor is a turd from a turd conference. Enough said on that.

    I'll be the judge of that, thank you.
    Well?
    I say wait 2 to 3 more weeks to see how things play out. Conference could be a corny turd, a healthy floater, or diaper gravy. Too soon. It's not the SEC, but is it worse than the ACC, the Pac12, or 9 of the 13 teams in the Big 10?

    Program is very Rapey, but my guess is Baylor will make a decent bowl and play to a one or two score result against a mid-level team like BYU. Again, too soon to make the turdy call yet.
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