How bad was S&C under Ivan? (Tequila long)

whatshouldicareabout

"Just wait until Ivan gets a hold of him!!"

...then what?



What piqued my interest during the Pac-12 media says was a quote by Ben Riva when questioned about the biggest difference between Sark and Petersen.

https://twitter.com/seattlesports89/statuses/492398934426271745

The point was further clarified by Riva (skip to 2:14)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yOJPW-aw-TE#t=134

And again by Petersen (on the subject of his attention to details): http://blog.thenewstribune.com/uwsports/2014/07/25/more-thoughts-from-chris-petersen-on-players-getting-in-trouble-recruiting-jonathan-smith-budda-baker-and-sleep-schedules/

“I don’t think it’s every any one thing. I think it’s everything. It’s how we keep our locker room... How you lift weights, how you show up, your mindset, how you practice. We all know you can go through the motions on anything. Just all those things."

So that's three separate times the weight room was brought up during Pac-12 media day. And these weren't comments that were provoked necessarily either, but rather the answers to broad subjects about the general change in culture between the two programs.


But what evidence do we have that the weight room was a problem under Sark/Ivan?


Perhaps the first piece of evidence should be the 2013 UW Pro Day where our starting safety and back-up CB out-repped our starting C at the 225lb bench. http://blogs.seattletimes.com/huskyfootball/2013/03/13/pro-day-scenes/

The results are similar when looking at the 2014 UW Pro Day where Sankey out-repped everyone and ASJ could only do 17. http://seattletimes.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/huskyfootball/files/2014/04/ProDay.png

Pretty significant, right? Socha really hasn't had too much time to revamp the S&C program, but after winter and spring, at least the program is moving in the right direction. Of course, the best measure would be to examine these reps before and after a year of Socha for the team in general, but the best measure we have now are the Top 5 after the Husky Combine this past May:

https://twitter.com/coachtimsocha/status/468872771804880897

Yes, I realize the bias in measuring the Top 5 here and the Pro Day numbers, but it is proof the program is moving in the right direction. Here, we see 4/5 are OL and the fifth is a DE (could also play MLB in jumbo packages). Oh, and that's another positive to like about Socha - the Husky Combine. He held an open competition to show where each player where they are in their strength and conditioning, helping to motivate the players to show improvement between the spring and fall camp. Not only that, but the event was FREE PUB!! with some NFL scouts taking times and measurements. The Husky Combine was a huge success and will be a significant factor to motivate the players through off-season workouts.

If you made it this far and are still reading, you're a champ. And you might be wondering how does this translate to results on the field? Good question, and it's impossible to measure right now, but it shouldn't be hard to see a jump in strength and conditioning when playing the elite teams in the conference. If you need evidence, here are three videos I strongly recommend you watch (not going to embed them).

www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VTh9m9ogN0

www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb51YuDNmBE

www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0U-3sC9SvQ

Those three games are where our S&C failed us and have continued to fail us during Ivan's tenure. The fact that there's this newfound emphasis on the weight room and Pete's/Socha's culture has me confident that this program is ready to take the next step. The S&C was a huge liability with Sark and the fact that Pete is aggressively addressing this issue is a reason to be excited for the future.

WilburHooksHands

Another post like this and it's a timeout. No more warnings, just gone.

section8

Bench press reps aren't really that important, winning hot dog eating contests is a better indicator of a program being on the right track.

MisterEm

section8 said:

Bench press reps aren't really that important, winning hot dog eating contests is a better indicator of a program being on the right track.

Yea.... but can Petahman hit the crossbar from the 40 with ome arm while balancing a TopPot bacon covered maple bar in the other hand.


That's what I thought.

SpoonieLuv

Meek

problem is, muscles slow you down during the 20 high speed scripted plays that were supposed to result in an immediate 14-0 lead.

HuskyJW

What has always stuck me as odd.....I know a bunch of guys that went to Idaho from about '93-'99.

Not football players per se...but guys friends with them....I was friends with some.

Nobody ever heard about an Ivan Lewis....nobody.

Meek

HuskyJW said:

What has always stuck me as odd.....I know a bunch of guys that went to Idaho from about '93-'99.

Not football players per se...but guys friends with them....I was friends with some.

Nobody ever heard about an Ivan Lewis....nobody.

Brian Cook disagrees

Mosster47

Your S&C program needs to mirror your style of play.

bananasnblondes

Ivan was a complete fraud. When Sark took over there was all this talk about "the players Willingham left all have huge bellies and skinny arms". Well, after Ivan got a hold of em they just had skinny arms. For visual proof you can go find the fall practice pics from last year that the LP3 took. Pay special attention to Erik Kohler. This is a guy who was in "Ivan's system" for 4 years and he had the physique of a backup on a high school team. I don't think ASJ added a pound of muscle in his years as a husky, and then there were all the non-contact injuries.

It's nice to see that Socha is a proponent of old school strength training. Ivan was big into resistance bands and crossfit type shit that he was probably getting kick backs on. Last years strength numbers were so appalling I'm surprised Sark even let them be leaked, and of course Kim was there to quickly tell everyone that they didn't understand how football strength training works now.

Much like with the head coaches office, it's nice to have an adult in the weight room again

CFetters_Nacho_Lover

Watching that 3rd video, it's easy to see that Myles Jack was sloppy and out of shape. Sark really dodged a bullet there.

For that alone, we should be thankful for Sark and his tenure leading UW back to its former glory. I knew he'd get us back, I never imagined it would happen so quickly.

Gladstone

Here's a list of games during Sark's tenure that we can all agree our superior conditioning led directly to our victory:

PostGameOrangeSlices

Dont know where youre getting this info brah. Everyone knows iso biceps 5 days a week, when used in tandem with Advocare products, produces Gameday champions

Dardanus

Vegasdawg

If you recall, Ivan was supposed to replace Tyrone's guy (can't recall his name) and bring the team up to big college strength and size. It's another example of Sark's fraudulent head coach status, a great coach would know who was a top guy for that position from years of experience. Now watch the USC 4 and 5 star kids regress in the training program.

RoadDawg55

bananasnblondes said:

Ivan was a complete fraud. When Sark took over there was all this talk about "the players Willingham left all have huge bellies and skinny arms". Well, after Ivan got a hold of em they just had skinny arms. For visual proof you can go find the fall practice pics from last year that the LP3 took. Pay special attention to Erik Kohler. This is a guy who was in "Ivan's system" for 4 years and he had the physique of a backup on a high school team. I don't think ASJ added a pound of muscle in his years as a husky, and then there were all the non-contact injuries.

It's nice to see that Socha is a proponent of old school strength training. Ivan was big into resistance bands and crossfit type shit that he was probably getting kick backs on. Last years strength numbers were so appalling I'm surprised Sark even let them be leaked, and of course Kim was there to quickly tell everyone that they didn't understand how football strength training works now.

Much like with the head coaches office, it's nice to have an adult in the weight room again

I still can't believe ASJ came back weighing 290 going into the season last year. I don't get how that was even possible or how Sark allowed it to happen. That alone should have been cause for Sark being fired. I feel the same way about Sark supposedly allowing Mike Cox to dick around recruiting Garnett and Banner. I hope Woodward was at least chewing Sark out about that type of stuff and asking him what the fuck he was doing.

Strength coaches are important, but they are somewhat interchangeable. If you get in the weight room and work hard, the results will come. I know that's simplistic and there is a lot of intricate stuff that goes into a college football S&C program, but the head coach sets the tone. We went from having a fat, undisciplined party animal to a real football coach. The whole program has been improved because of that.

DerekJohnson

Trent Greener was his name. The players disliked him so much that some of them like CJ Wallace ended up training at Gold's Gym instead.

HeretoBeatmyChest

S&C was a huge emphasis for Carroll when first he got to USC. I recall reading something about how very few players could squat and clean a certain amount. Then a year later it something like 20 guys were able to lift that amount.

I guess we don't need to wait, because Socha has already got a hold of them.

CFetters_Nacho_Lover

DerekJohnson said:

Trent Greener was his name. The players disliked him so much that some of them like CJ Wallace ended up training at Gold's Gym instead.

Wasn't Greener Willingham's 1st S&C coach and then when he was replaced, Kim and the LP3 started telling us how terrible he was and the new guy was awesome?

whatshouldicareabout

Here is some more evidence, thanks to USC's scout site. http://usc.scout.com/story/1377439-lewis-tough-enough-to-eat-nails

He seems more concerned with addressing the question "why" rather than "how much", a philosophy he's cultivated in his own time as a head coach and a method he says differs slightly than his mentor's. "It's not always about the weights, it's about the whys. Why we do things." Lewis explained. "Coach Carlisle's philosophy was really about how to, how fast, how much."

This quote helps strengthen (lol) the previous statements on why the S&C program is much more difficult now. Under Lewis, it isn't always about the weights, and it isn't about completing a certain amount. Now, Socha sets quotas for these players to meet and demands that they do these work-outs properly. No shit the S&C is going to be a lot harder when you have a coach that demands you complete what was assigned to you and that you complete them the right way. Just go back to Riva's video. Or look at those Pro Days numbers above. Or back to ASJ's assessment by the NFL scouts, calling him soft.

Other gems from the article:
Lewis emphasized multiple times the importance of players "buying in" to a strength program.
"It's just a great staff who has been put together and we are just buying into that."
"We're going to play 100 miles per hour and we're going to win. It's going to be great."

DugtheDoog

CFetters_Nacho_Lover said:

DerekJohnson said:

Trent Greener was his name. The players disliked him so much that some of them like CJ Wallace ended up training at Gold's Gym instead.

Wasn't Greener Willingham's 1st S&C coach and then when he was replaced, Kim and the LP3 started telling us how terrible he was and the new guy was awesome?

Greener was a joke. Ty basically threw Emptermann under the bus and fucked him over. Needless to say, the team was not happy about that at all. Not that it's important that the team is friends with the S&C coach, but to fire Emptermann after the spring and bring in a guy the whole team hated and was a complete joke. I'll just say in Ty's first year, that didn't exactly help the players buy into his system (not that he even had one).