How much better does the offense really need to be for us to win 10 games this year?

Good post @pat.

Doog accusations forthcoming.

dnc said:

pat_hm said:

TurdBuffer said:

Good post @pat.

Doog accusations forthcoming.

Thanks man. I just really don't understand all the hate towards Browning. It's insane. We're all bitter and pissed that we haven't been any good in 15 years but this actual time to be at least slightly optimistic. We have a good defense. We have a quarterback. Fuck. People hate it when you bring up actual statistics. "BUT REMEMBER WHEN HE MISSED THAT DEEP BALL WHEN MICKENS WAS WIDE OPEN AND HE DROPPED IT. BROWNING SUCKS."

He was better than Rosen last season and people on here still bitch and moan. It's almost like people don't want UW to do well. Makes no sense. And i'm no fucking doog, just optimistic for once given the situation UW football finds itself in 2016. I'll be at Husky Stadium for the Idaho game, bitches.

You had an upvote from me until the "people don't want UW to do well" doogism.

I agree there's plenty of reasons for optimism. OTOH, there's 2001-2015. It's understandable that people are going to be skeptical. We've heard all the "But this year's different!" reasons for a decade and a half.

I really do think this is the year we win 10 games (#whyIstayed), but still, we suck until we don't (#whyishouldaleft).

The reason I say that is all the people who make the argument that UW is going to suck again don't bring up any statistical evidence besides the fact that UW has been garbage since 2001. Tell me why you think they're going to win 7 games again!! Make an argument. Present facts. Don't just bash someone with positive stance and label them as a doog. Listen, I'm with you. It's hard to not dwell on the fact we've sucked for so long. But what happened in 2007, 2009, or 2003 has nothing no with this years team. I think we need to approach every season objectively with a new lens as opposed to having a mindset stuck in the past.

pat_hm said:

Jake Browing had a strong first season and there are further components that lead me to believe he'll improve in his second year rather than regress. First off he's very accurate. You can't teach that. He is physically stronger and the undisputed leader of the offense going into his second season. He looked sharp this spring. I believe the deep ball criticism has been overhyped. His X receivers were stone hands Mickens and drop king Marvin Hall for christ's sake. Given the conditions of his true freshman season I'd say he performed exceptionally well. We knew there would be growing pains. But he got better throughout the year and arrow is most undoubtedly pointing up.

The bad news is the offense loses 1752 yards receiving, over half of Browning's production from last season. The good news is only departure of signficance is Josh Perkins who I thought played well. Renfro is gone. Mickens, Dwayne Washington and Hall were all wildly inconsistent players who were routinely out matched on the field. I'd argue the offense will become more efficient with their departures.

The addition of John Ross to go along with now junior Dante Pettis takes care of the outside and Chico will fill the vacated slot targets. I like him there. Andre Baccellia performed well this spring and should fill a role. Lenius is still an unknown but it's make or break for the guy. Sample and Daniels will share the tight end work. It's reasonable to determine that Browning's weapon arsenal has been upgraded in comparison to what he was working with last season. I believe that Browing's accuracy allows for a more pass friendly scheme and with Tedford apparently coming on board that should only grow.

Take it for what it's worth but Pro football Focus is very forthright in their fondness for Browning. They've got smart football people there and have written up several articles breaking down his game. Rosen got off to the faster start and received more hype because he's a rich OC kid who goes to UCLA but Jake actually finished stronger and posted positive grades in five of his last six games. Browning's accuracy percentage of 74.6 % ranked second among the nations true freshman. Strong quarterback play is essential and Browning is the best young player at the position UW has had in a long time.

Myles Gaskin was incredible and shows no signs of slowing down and taking his game to the next level. Among true freshman, Gaskin ranked second in missed tackles forced (51) and third in elusive rating (95.9). He averaged 3.65 yards after contact which not only emphasizes his raw talent but helps explain how he achieved such production behind an average at best offensive line. Hopefully that unit can improve. Lavon Coleman looked decent in the bowl game and would be nice for him to take 5-8 carries a game to help soften the defense. Despite his slight frame, McGrew will play the same role Chico did last season and will likely be given a handful of touches based purely on his speed. The wild card would be a player like Byron Murphy making the switch over to offense and helping to build the depth at wide receivers. I have no idea if that will happen though and would prefer to keep him on defense.

I saw that someone posted the average point differential on our loses last season was around 8.5 points give or take. I'll take the over. That's a touchdown and a field goal more a game than last season, not exactly a huge leap in my estimation given the factors stated above. As far as the hype goes, if it gets more people in Husky stadium and sets the expectations for the program higher I think it's a good thing. There are reasons to be optimistic for the first time in over a decade, however if UW is going to win the North they're going to need a lot of parts go their way. Building an offense around a intelligent, accurate quarterback and true talent like Gaskin isn't such a bad situation to be in given that the consensus strength of the team is the defense. That pendulum should tild a little more evenly in 2016, which in turn should lead to more wins.

You lost me after this: "I believe the deep ball criticism has been overhyped."

Not sure which games you watched last year, but even Petersen said that Jake needs to work on his deep ball.

huskyhooligan said:

I have hope he'll get better, he needs to in order for the team to reach its full potential on offense. By most accounts he had a great, true freshman, season. Ultimately though, as someone who touches the ball on virtually every offensive play, he needs to get better, I also think he can / will.

Right. If we want reach our full potential he's going to have to make improvements in his game.

Passion said:

pat_hm said:

Jake Browing had a strong first season and there are further components that lead me to believe he'll improve in his second year rather than regress. First off he's very accurate. You can't teach that. He is physically stronger and the undisputed leader of the offense going into his second season. He looked sharp this spring. I believe the deep ball criticism has been overhyped. His X receivers were stone hands Mickens and drop king Marvin Hall for christ's sake. Given the conditions of his true freshman season I'd say he performed exceptionally well. We knew there would be growing pains. But he got better throughout the year and arrow is most undoubtedly pointing up.

The bad news is the offense loses 1752 yards receiving, over half of Browning's production from last season. The good news is only departure of signficance is Josh Perkins who I thought played well. Renfro is gone. Mickens, Dwayne Washington and Hall were all wildly inconsistent players who were routinely out matched on the field. I'd argue the offense will become more efficient with their departures.

The addition of John Ross to go along with now junior Dante Pettis takes care of the outside and Chico will fill the vacated slot targets. I like him there. Andre Baccellia performed well this spring and should fill a role. Lenius is still an unknown but it's make or break for the guy. Sample and Daniels will share the tight end work. It's reasonable to determine that Browning's weapon arsenal has been upgraded in comparison to what he was working with last season. I believe that Browing's accuracy allows for a more pass friendly scheme and with Tedford apparently coming on board that should only grow.

Take it for what it's worth but Pro football Focus is very forthright in their fondness for Browning. They've got smart football people there and have written up several articles breaking down his game. Rosen got off to the faster start and received more hype because he's a rich OC kid who goes to UCLA but Jake actually finished stronger and posted positive grades in five of his last six games. Browning's accuracy percentage of 74.6 % ranked second among the nations true freshman. Strong quarterback play is essential and Browning is the best young player at the position UW has had in a long time.

Myles Gaskin was incredible and shows no signs of slowing down and taking his game to the next level. Among true freshman, Gaskin ranked second in missed tackles forced (51) and third in elusive rating (95.9). He averaged 3.65 yards after contact which not only emphasizes his raw talent but helps explain how he achieved such production behind an average at best offensive line. Hopefully that unit can improve. Lavon Coleman looked decent in the bowl game and would be nice for him to take 5-8 carries a game to help soften the defense. Despite his slight frame, McGrew will play the same role Chico did last season and will likely be given a handful of touches based purely on his speed. The wild card would be a player like Byron Murphy making the switch over to offense and helping to build the depth at wide receivers. I have no idea if that will happen though and would prefer to keep him on defense.

I saw that someone posted the average point differential on our loses last season was around 8.5 points give or take. I'll take the over. That's a touchdown and a field goal more a game than last season, not exactly a huge leap in my estimation given the factors stated above. As far as the hype goes, if it gets more people in Husky stadium and sets the expectations for the program higher I think it's a good thing. There are reasons to be optimistic for the first time in over a decade, however if UW is going to win the North they're going to need a lot of parts go their way. Building an offense around a intelligent, accurate quarterback and true talent like Gaskin isn't such a bad situation to be in given that the consensus strength of the team is the defense. That pendulum should tild a little more evenly in 2016, which in turn should lead to more wins.

You lost me after this: "I believe the deep ball criticism has been overhyped."

Not sure which games you watched last year, but even Petersen said that Jake needs to work on his deep ball.

I watched every game last season. He wasn't elite as a true freshman throwing the deep ball but my point is you can't place all the blame on Browning when looking at what he had to work with. I re watched the bowl game the other day and his deep ball looked great. He threw a bomb to Marvin Hall that went right threw his hands. I remember a few through out the season were under thrown.

I think his struggles with the deeper passes had more to do with his lack of strength as an 18 year old rather than an actual mechanic flaw which was I'm assuming you feel is the problem based on your criticism.

EsophagealFeces said:

pat_hm said:

huskyhooligan said:

I have hope he'll get better, he needs to in order for the team to reach its full potential on offense. By most accounts he had a great, true freshman, season. Ultimately though, as someone who touches the ball on virtually every offensive play, he needs to get better, I also think he can / will.

Right. If we want reach our full potential he's going to have to make improvements in his game.

Passion said:

pat_hm said:

Jake Browing had a strong first season and there are further components that lead me to believe he'll improve in his second year rather than regress. First off he's very accurate. You can't teach that. He is physically stronger and the undisputed leader of the offense going into his second season. He looked sharp this spring. I believe the deep ball criticism has been overhyped. His X receivers were stone hands Mickens and drop king Marvin Hall for christ's sake. Given the conditions of his true freshman season I'd say he performed exceptionally well. We knew there would be growing pains. But he got better throughout the year and arrow is most undoubtedly pointing up.

The bad news is the offense loses 1752 yards receiving, over half of Browning's production from last season. The good news is only departure of signficance is Josh Perkins who I thought played well. Renfro is gone. Mickens, Dwayne Washington and Hall were all wildly inconsistent players who were routinely out matched on the field. I'd argue the offense will become more efficient with their departures.

The addition of John Ross to go along with now junior Dante Pettis takes care of the outside and Chico will fill the vacated slot targets. I like him there. Andre Baccellia performed well this spring and should fill a role. Lenius is still an unknown but it's make or break for the guy. Sample and Daniels will share the tight end work. It's reasonable to determine that Browning's weapon arsenal has been upgraded in comparison to what he was working with last season. I believe that Browing's accuracy allows for a more pass friendly scheme and with Tedford apparently coming on board that should only grow.

Take it for what it's worth but Pro football Focus is very forthright in their fondness for Browning. They've got smart football people there and have written up several articles breaking down his game. Rosen got off to the faster start and received more hype because he's a rich OC kid who goes to UCLA but Jake actually finished stronger and posted positive grades in five of his last six games. Browning's accuracy percentage of 74.6 % ranked second among the nations true freshman. Strong quarterback play is essential and Browning is the best young player at the position UW has had in a long time.

Myles Gaskin was incredible and shows no signs of slowing down and taking his game to the next level. Among true freshman, Gaskin ranked second in missed tackles forced (51) and third in elusive rating (95.9). He averaged 3.65 yards after contact which not only emphasizes his raw talent but helps explain how he achieved such production behind an average at best offensive line. Hopefully that unit can improve. Lavon Coleman looked decent in the bowl game and would be nice for him to take 5-8 carries a game to help soften the defense. Despite his slight frame, McGrew will play the same role Chico did last season and will likely be given a handful of touches based purely on his speed. The wild card would be a player like Byron Murphy making the switch over to offense and helping to build the depth at wide receivers. I have no idea if that will happen though and would prefer to keep him on defense.

I saw that someone posted the average point differential on our loses last season was around 8.5 points give or take. I'll take the over. That's a touchdown and a field goal more a game than last season, not exactly a huge leap in my estimation given the factors stated above. As far as the hype goes, if it gets more people in Husky stadium and sets the expectations for the program higher I think it's a good thing. There are reasons to be optimistic for the first time in over a decade, however if UW is going to win the North they're going to need a lot of parts go their way. Building an offense around a intelligent, accurate quarterback and true talent like Gaskin isn't such a bad situation to be in given that the consensus strength of the team is the defense. That pendulum should tild a little more evenly in 2016, which in turn should lead to more wins.

You lost me after this: "I believe the deep ball criticism has been overhyped."

Not sure which games you watched last year, but even Petersen said that Jake needs to work on his deep ball.

I watched every game last season. He wasn't elite as a true freshman throwing the deep ball but my point is you can't place all the blame on Browning when looking at what he had to work with. I re watched the bowl game the other day and his deep ball looked great. He threw a bomb to Marvin Hall that went right threw his hands. I remember a few through out the season were under thrown.

I think his struggles with the deeper passes had more to do with his lack of strength as an 18 year old rather than an actual mechanic flaw which was I'm assuming you feel is the problem based on your criticism.

He badly overthrew a lot of deep balls, so I don't think your lack of strength argument works. Unless he didn't trust his arm to get it there, and overthrew it as a result. Either way, he sucked shit throwing the ball downfield and needs to be significantly better this year or it's going to be 7-6 all over again.

I still think all you are exaggerating. The sky isn't falling when your true freshman (63 % completion percentage) over threw or under threw a few deep balls in his true freshman season to a group of receivers more suited for the WAC than the pac 12. Our receivers "sucked shit" but all I hear you old fucking whiners complain about is Brownings deep ball. It's hilarious. Browning is a legit talent and you either believe he will get better or stagnate. I think he will improve and in turn our win total will increase.

So is it your argument that his lack of refinement on the deep ball is the reason the team won 7 games?

sarktastic said:

sounds like you really care about how others feel about Jen's football squad?

I actually still do for some insane reason and I shouldn't because the last 15 years have been a total disaster. I graduated UW in 2006 and my entire adult life has been steeped in non fulfillment at the hands of UW. There was a time that we actually had a program where the expectation was a Rose Bowl every year or it was a failure. Ten wins was the floor. It's been a while.

This is the first year since when, 2000, when UW will actually be ranked somewhere between 15-20 in the pre season polls? I've never really been a fan of those polls to being with, likely due to UW never even coming close to making it. But it feels good. People are talking BCS, Rose Bowl, winning the North, beating Stanford and Oregon. The opportunity is there. Execute. Fuck.

And there reasons to believe that some this talk might actually be warranted. Washington is bring back the best defensive unit in the pac12 with another year under their belts. We have a strong front 7. Qualls and Sidney Jones are first round picks. Baker looks poised to fully breakout. Azeem & Jo Jo. Gains & Vea. They are building proper depth. Special teams have turned a complete 180 under Petersen.

When Ty was in power and we went over to the husky half brains, all anyone ever wanted, besides Mora, was a nasty defense and a strong running game. UW has never really been build all around a flashy QB, we won upfront, pounding with the run and bludgeoning the opponent in all three phases.

Browning's strength, short to intermediate passing, is really all you need with the occasional shot down field. Establish the run, work the play action, get the tight end involved. We have those pieces. Gaskin can run the ball. We've got a few guys who can catch the ball. I would have killed for this team back then. But we had a safety playing quarterback. He did have a great deep ball though..