Swaye?? True??
Comments
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Everything you said was Trump's faultcreepycoug said:With the express qualification that I don't know, or care, whatever the fuck it is you guysms are arguing about - worst presidents I guess - I had a case when I was a judicial law clerk involving a state court's in rem jurisdiction over a parcel on an Injun (hey @Swaye) rez here in Warshington. This wasn't just any parcel. It was a piece of land that had been put into federal trust (a mechanism called a fee patent) by which Injun land could become privately owned land by Ten Bears and his nephews ... or whatever. When the fee patent was issued, pretty much anything having to do with that land was as Amurican and subject to all the usual goodies and bullshit as a block in mid-town Manhattan. In other words, it was like hole in the map of the rez ... that hole was 'non-rez', if you will.
Anywhoo, there were all kinds of problems with these various mechanisms, not least of which (true stories) was that whitey was really fucking good at talking Ten Bears and his nephews out of 100s of acres of valuable land for a car and a box of cigars. @Swaye's people got so fucking swindled it was ridicruous. Sooooo, the fed decided to baby sit, then decided it was a bad idea, then decided it was a good idea, and back and forth and forth and back, for years.
The layers of federal legislation on "what to do with these? people" was as helter skelter as anything Congress has done. The result is a huge pile of fucked and tangled up property rights.
The point of this particular story tim with Creepy is this: we have fucked these people as hard as you can fuck anything. We wanted to assimilate and disband tribal associations. Then we thought, nah, it was better before, and tried to unwind the other plan (which is especially hard when you create new property rights). Then we'd change our minds again, and try to disband, and then change them again. Over and over. What a fucking mess.
I'm all for the idea that the fate of the conquered is whatever the conqueror decides. But we really fucked around with these people and never made up our minds what we wanted to do. Which explains a lot for why conditions on the rez today are what they are. For most of our tim together, Injuns have been neither real Americans nor real Injuns. We've left them in a state of limbo.
I cry for @Swaye.
Now, back to Trump. -
You actually typed this up?creepycoug said:With the express qualification that I don't know, or care, whatever the fuck it is you guysms are arguing about - worst presidents I guess - I had a case when I was a judicial law clerk involving a state court's in rem jurisdiction over a parcel on an Injun (hey @Swaye) rez here in Warshington. This wasn't just any parcel. It was a piece of land that had been put into federal trust (a mechanism called a fee patent) by which Injun land could become privately owned land by Ten Bears and his nephews ... or whatever. When the fee patent was issued, pretty much anything having to do with that land was as Amurican and subject to all the usual goodies and bullshit as a block in mid-town Manhattan. In other words, it was like hole in the map of the rez ... that hole was 'non-rez', if you will.
Anywhoo, there were all kinds of problems with these various mechanisms, not least of which (true stories) was that whitey was really fucking good at talking Ten Bears and his nephews out of 100s of acres of valuable land for a car and a box of cigars. @Swaye's people got so fucking swindled it was ridicruous. Sooooo, the fed decided to baby sit, then decided it was a bad idea, then decided it was a good idea, and back and forth and forth and back, for years.
The layers of federal legislation on "what to do with these? people" was as helter skelter as anything Congress has done. The result is a huge pile of fucked and tangled up property rights.
The point of this particular story tim with Creepy is this: we have fucked these people as hard as you can fuck anything. We wanted to assimilate and disband tribal associations. Then we thought, nah, it was better before, and tried to unwind the other plan (which is especially hard when you create new property rights). Then we'd change our minds again, and try to disband, and then change them again. Over and over. What a fucking mess.
I'm all for the idea that the fate of the conquered is whatever the conqueror decides. But we really fucked around with these people and never made up our minds what we wanted to do. Which explains a lot for why conditions on the rez today are what they are. For most of our tim together, Injuns have been neither real Americans nor real Injuns. We've left them in a state of limbo.
I cry for @Swaye.
Now, back to Trump.
Props old man
I don't think I've written anything this long in like 12 years -
I did an in depth report on the Judge Boldt decision on fishing rights that came down while I was in high school
It was the least I could do for the Nisqually tribe who sold me cheap smokes
Dick Gregory got arrested in Olympia protesting and my dad visited him in jail
Csb -
Ehhhh, I’d give this trophy to FDR.RaceBannon said:Disagree
Jackson made decisions that fucked us for a century at least in our relations with the Swayes. He took the wrong side. The donor side
I like him as a General. Hate him as a President
Big gubment hack.
I’ll read the rest now...
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The problem with the rez is that it's a free sh*t hand out culture topped off with no natural resistance to alcohol. Then toss is drugs. Last Indian casino I went to I saw one Indian actually working at the casino. The rest were hispanic or white. This wasn't an historic Indian Reservation. In Oregon almost all the reservations were bought out by the Feds in the 1950s. Indians largely took the cash and partied. Small reservations were "restored" after liberal guilt and the crony capitalism that follows Indian casino opportunities around like remoras on sharks. Divorced lady across the street was 1/16th Indian something associated with the Spirit Mountain casino. Never lived near Grand Ronde, OR. She was about as Indian as I am. She did have high cheek bones. Gets a casino check. Her kids are 1/32 Indian, so no checks. Indians did get screwed. Signed pieces of paper that were ignored. But having some white guy with 1/16th Indian out in the Columbia placing gill nets from his power boat to celebrate his historical fishing rights seems a bit twisted.
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They’d both be on my bottom five list.MikeDamone said:
FDR was a piece of shit. As was WilsonYellowSnow said:Saying Jackson is the worst of all time is just woke laziness.
The YellaPiss Top 3 are: Buchanan, Andrew Johnson and Carter. -
True. Not just “free shit” but what the rest of the cultures may provide for a “fee”...Last Indian reservation I was on, the Indians looked for anything that got themWestlinnDuck said:The problem with the rez is that it's a free sh*t hand out culture topped off with no natural resistance to alcohol. Then toss is drugs. Last Indian casino I went to I saw one Indian actually working at the casino. The rest were hispanic or white. This wasn't an historic Indian Reservation. In Oregon almost all the reservations were bought out by the Feds in the 1950s. Indians largely took the cash and partied. Small reservations were "restored" after liberal guilt and the crony capitalism that follows Indian casino opportunities around like remoras on sharks. Divorced lady across the street was 1/16th Indian something associated with the Spirit Mountain casino. Never lived near Grand Ronde, OR. She was about as Indian as I am. She did have high cheek bones. Gets a casino check. Her kids are 1/32 Indian, so no checks. Indians did get screwed. Signed pieces of paper that were ignored. But having some white guy with 1/16th Indian out in the Columbia placing gill nets from his power boat to celebrate his historical fishing rights seems a bit twisted.
“To the next level.” Shooting alcohol straight to shooting wd/40 or battery acid type stuff in their veins. Lost limbs, liver shot, etc....drank firewater like water.
Don’t know if it was hopelessness or addiction but wasn’t pretty with their culture.
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What's that all-important phrase? "In common with ..."? I remember when that whole thing hit the shell fish people who invest $$ to raise oysters and other shell fish on their property. The threat was that the tribe could just roll up and take ... no comp., no nothin'.RaceBannon said:I did an in depth report on the Judge Boldt decision on fishing rights that came down while I was in high school
It was the least I could do for the Nisqually tribe who sold me cheap smokes
Dick Gregory got arrested in Olympia protesting and my dad visited him in jail
Csb
Then again, the Treaty of Olympia (Article 3 is where the offending language can be found - just looked it up - thanks Google!) was a binding contract. Or whatever. -
I've got a lot to say!Pitchfork51 said:
You actually typed this up?creepycoug said:With the express qualification that I don't know, or care, whatever the fuck it is you guysms are arguing about - worst presidents I guess - I had a case when I was a judicial law clerk involving a state court's in rem jurisdiction over a parcel on an Injun (hey @Swaye) rez here in Warshington. This wasn't just any parcel. It was a piece of land that had been put into federal trust (a mechanism called a fee patent) by which Injun land could become privately owned land by Ten Bears and his nephews ... or whatever. When the fee patent was issued, pretty much anything having to do with that land was as Amurican and subject to all the usual goodies and bullshit as a block in mid-town Manhattan. In other words, it was like hole in the map of the rez ... that hole was 'non-rez', if you will.
Anywhoo, there were all kinds of problems with these various mechanisms, not least of which (true stories) was that whitey was really fucking good at talking Ten Bears and his nephews out of 100s of acres of valuable land for a car and a box of cigars. @Swaye's people got so fucking swindled it was ridicruous. Sooooo, the fed decided to baby sit, then decided it was a bad idea, then decided it was a good idea, and back and forth and forth and back, for years.
The layers of federal legislation on "what to do with these? people" was as helter skelter as anything Congress has done. The result is a huge pile of fucked and tangled up property rights.
The point of this particular story tim with Creepy is this: we have fucked these people as hard as you can fuck anything. We wanted to assimilate and disband tribal associations. Then we thought, nah, it was better before, and tried to unwind the other plan (which is especially hard when you create new property rights). Then we'd change our minds again, and try to disband, and then change them again. Over and over. What a fucking mess.
I'm all for the idea that the fate of the conquered is whatever the conqueror decides. But we really fucked around with these people and never made up our minds what we wanted to do. Which explains a lot for why conditions on the rez today are what they are. For most of our tim together, Injuns have been neither real Americans nor real Injuns. We've left them in a state of limbo.
I cry for @Swaye.
Now, back to Trump.
Props old man
I don't think I've written anything this long in like 12 years -
agreed. this is a huge issue on the Quinault. @dflea probably knows more about that.WestlinnDuck said:The problem with the rez is that it's a free sh*t hand out culture topped off with no natural resistance to alcohol. Then toss is drugs. Last Indian casino I went to I saw one Indian actually working at the casino. The rest were hispanic or white. This wasn't an historic Indian Reservation. In Oregon almost all the reservations were bought out by the Feds in the 1950s. Indians largely took the cash and partied. Small reservations were "restored" after liberal guilt and the crony capitalism that follows Indian casino opportunities around like remoras on sharks. Divorced lady across the street was 1/16th Indian something associated with the Spirit Mountain casino. Never lived near Grand Ronde, OR. She was about as Indian as I am. She did have high cheek bones. Gets a casino check. Her kids are 1/32 Indian, so no checks. Indians did get screwed. Signed pieces of paper that were ignored. But having some white guy with 1/16th Indian out in the Columbia placing gill nets from his power boat to celebrate his historical fishing rights seems a bit twisted.
