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WSDOT: Too few minorities, women on tunnel project
Comments
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And you call me an idealist. "lol"PurpleJ said:It's way too easy to judge people solely on the basis of their qualifications and abilities. It isn't fair. We need to even out the playing field by creating a different set of standards for the people who we deem to be at a disadvantage. That's fair.
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Throughout this thread I've been speaking about the educational merits of the law.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
Look, AA isn't perfect and there are egregous examples of its misuse popping up. For instance wealthy African Americans students are a huge benefactor in the college admissions process.RaceBannon said:
Self loathing is sadCollegeDoog said:Why are we even building a tunnel? Waterfront streets would be much bettter.
Also, AA is necessary.
I find the trust fund babies who lack any real skills getting jobs on Wall Street because of dad much more appalling.
I don't like that it makes people too beholden to their background although they may have different views.
But there's something to be said about "critical mass" in education and the socioeconomic intentions of the law.
I imagine it will become less important over time.
Justice O'Connor's opinion in Grutter v Bollinger is a good read.
If the trust fund babies get the Wall Street job, they have to be good at it to keep it. Their rich daddy can't save them from getting fired if they consistently lose their clients Millions.
AA is reverse sexism and racism whose only function is to keep those that normally wouldn't be good enough to get a job or keep it, on board a company to meet their diversity goals.
In many insistences, the benefactors of AA are good enough to be hired and maybe even promoted anyway. In most cities, people have evolved enough to look beyond a person's skin color or breastesses. Discrimination laws in hiring and the workplace have bigger teeth than you may realize. AA, at least in most areas has outlived it's designation. It's more about nanny politics now.
A
Please do tell of what you learned by being exposed to people who normally didn't deserve to be where they are. I'm curious to know.
I've seen plenty of unqualified kids get jobs doing analytics, investment banking, sales for banks, hedge funds, etc. The finance industry is where personal connections and favoritism is the worst when it comes to hiring.
That's my observation though. -
Well Kid. That's how the world works. You get farther by having professional and personal connections in the field that you are entering.CollegeDoog said:
Throughout this thread I've been speaking about the educational merits of the law.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
Look, AA isn't perfect and there are egregous examples of its misuse popping up. For instance wealthy African Americans students are a huge benefactor in the college admissions process.RaceBannon said:
Self loathing is sadCollegeDoog said:Why are we even building a tunnel? Waterfront streets would be much bettter.
Also, AA is necessary.
I find the trust fund babies who lack any real skills getting jobs on Wall Street because of dad much more appalling.
I don't like that it makes people too beholden to their background although they may have different views.
But there's something to be said about "critical mass" in education and the socioeconomic intentions of the law.
I imagine it will become less important over time.
Justice O'Connor's opinion in Grutter v Bollinger is a good read.
If the trust fund babies get the Wall Street job, they have to be good at it to keep it. Their rich daddy can't save them from getting fired if they consistently lose their clients Millions.
AA is reverse sexism and racism whose only function is to keep those that normally wouldn't be good enough to get a job or keep it, on board a company to meet their diversity goals.
In many insistences, the benefactors of AA are good enough to be hired and maybe even promoted anyway. In most cities, people have evolved enough to look beyond a person's skin color or breastesses. Discrimination laws in hiring and the workplace have bigger teeth than you may realize. AA, at least in most areas has outlived it's designation. It's more about nanny politics now.
A
Please do tell of what you learned by being exposed to people who normally didn't deserve to be where they are. I'm curious to know.
I've seen plenty of unqualified kids get jobs doing analytics, investment banking, sales for banks, hedge funds, etc. The finance industry is where personal connections and favoritism is the worst when it comes to hiring.
That's my observation though.
The real measure of whether they are "unqualified" or not is whether they are good enough to succeed in their position. If they aren't any good, than they will be down the road. If they are good at what they do and succeed than they were never "unqualified" in the first place despite having such advantages.
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I do not have a problem with "some" affirmative action. However, when I saw the majority of AA Law School grads failing the Bar Exam, it just becomes absurd. Graduate School slots are in short supply. Admitting less than the Best and the Brightest into Graduate Schools has had an incredible cost to our society.
Public education has become a joke. The government and the teachers unions are destroying our children. Affirmative Action has destroyed upper education. There is no diversity. Where is the diversity of thought?
If you are so concerned with "diversity", set-aside 30% of faculty jobs for Republicans.
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Go talk to Lew Ranieri and get back to me on that.CollegeDoog said:
Throughout this thread I've been speaking about the educational merits of the law.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
Look, AA isn't perfect and there are egregous examples of its misuse popping up. For instance wealthy African Americans students are a huge benefactor in the college admissions process.RaceBannon said:
Self loathing is sadCollegeDoog said:Why are we even building a tunnel? Waterfront streets would be much bettter.
Also, AA is necessary.
I find the trust fund babies who lack any real skills getting jobs on Wall Street because of dad much more appalling.
I don't like that it makes people too beholden to their background although they may have different views.
But there's something to be said about "critical mass" in education and the socioeconomic intentions of the law.
I imagine it will become less important over time.
Justice O'Connor's opinion in Grutter v Bollinger is a good read.
If the trust fund babies get the Wall Street job, they have to be good at it to keep it. Their rich daddy can't save them from getting fired if they consistently lose their clients Millions.
AA is reverse sexism and racism whose only function is to keep those that normally wouldn't be good enough to get a job or keep it, on board a company to meet their diversity goals.
In many insistences, the benefactors of AA are good enough to be hired and maybe even promoted anyway. In most cities, people have evolved enough to look beyond a person's skin color or breastesses. Discrimination laws in hiring and the workplace have bigger teeth than you may realize. AA, at least in most areas has outlived it's designation. It's more about nanny politics now.
A
Please do tell of what you learned by being exposed to people who normally didn't deserve to be where they are. I'm curious to know.
I've seen plenty of unqualified kids get jobs doing analytics, investment banking, sales for banks, hedge funds, etc. The finance industry is where personal connections and favoritism is the worst when it comes to hiring.
That's my observation though.
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I understand that's the reality. It's not a perfect world. Shit isn't fair.salemcoog said:
Well Kid. That's how the world works. You get farther by having professional and personal connections in the field that you are entering.CollegeDoog said:
Throughout this thread I've been speaking about the educational merits of the law.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
Look, AA isn't perfect and there are egregous examples of its misuse popping up. For instance wealthy African Americans students are a huge benefactor in the college admissions process.RaceBannon said:
Self loathing is sadCollegeDoog said:Why are we even building a tunnel? Waterfront streets would be much bettter.
Also, AA is necessary.
I find the trust fund babies who lack any real skills getting jobs on Wall Street because of dad much more appalling.
I don't like that it makes people too beholden to their background although they may have different views.
But there's something to be said about "critical mass" in education and the socioeconomic intentions of the law.
I imagine it will become less important over time.
Justice O'Connor's opinion in Grutter v Bollinger is a good read.
If the trust fund babies get the Wall Street job, they have to be good at it to keep it. Their rich daddy can't save them from getting fired if they consistently lose their clients Millions.
AA is reverse sexism and racism whose only function is to keep those that normally wouldn't be good enough to get a job or keep it, on board a company to meet their diversity goals.
In many insistences, the benefactors of AA are good enough to be hired and maybe even promoted anyway. In most cities, people have evolved enough to look beyond a person's skin color or breastesses. Discrimination laws in hiring and the workplace have bigger teeth than you may realize. AA, at least in most areas has outlived it's designation. It's more about nanny politics now.
A
Please do tell of what you learned by being exposed to people who normally didn't deserve to be where they are. I'm curious to know.
I've seen plenty of unqualified kids get jobs doing analytics, investment banking, sales for banks, hedge funds, etc. The finance industry is where personal connections and favoritism is the worst when it comes to hiring.
That's my observation though.
The real measure of whether they are "unqualified" or not is whether they are good enough to succeed in their position. If they aren't any good, than they will be down the road. If they are good at what they do and succeed than they were never "unqualified" in the first place despite having such advantages.
What are you trying to say? -
Affirmative action has not destroyed upper education.death2ducks said:I do not have a problem with "some" affirmative action. However, when I saw the majority of AA Law School grads failing the Bar Exam, it just becomes absurd. Graduate School slots are in short supply. Admitting less than the Best and the Brightest into Graduate Schools has had an incredible cost to our society.
Public education has become a joke. The government and the teachers unions are destroying our children. Affirmative Action has destroyed upper education. There is no diversity. Where is the diversity of thought?
If you are so concerned with "diversity", set-aside 30% of faculty jobs for Republicans.
People from all over the world come to the US because we offer the best higher learning.
You speak from a paranoid conservative position.
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CollegeDoog said:
I understand that's the reality. It's not a perfect world. Shit isn't fair.salemcoog said:
Well Kid. That's how the world works. You get farther by having professional and personal connections in the field that you are entering.CollegeDoog said:
Throughout this thread I've been speaking about the educational merits of the law.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
Look, AA isn't perfect and there are egregous examples of its misuse popping up. For instance wealthy African Americans students are a huge benefactor in the college admissions process.RaceBannon said:
Self loathing is sadCollegeDoog said:Why are we even building a tunnel? Waterfront streets would be much bettter.
Also, AA is necessary.
I find the trust fund babies who lack any real skills getting jobs on Wall Street because of dad much more appalling.
I don't like that it makes people too beholden to their background although they may have different views.
But there's something to be said about "critical mass" in education and the socioeconomic intentions of the law.
I imagine it will become less important over time.
Justice O'Connor's opinion in Grutter v Bollinger is a good read.
If the trust fund babies get the Wall Street job, they have to be good at it to keep it. Their rich daddy can't save them from getting fired if they consistently lose their clients Millions.
AA is reverse sexism and racism whose only function is to keep those that normally wouldn't be good enough to get a job or keep it, on board a company to meet their diversity goals.
In many insistences, the benefactors of AA are good enough to be hired and maybe even promoted anyway. In most cities, people have evolved enough to look beyond a person's skin color or breastesses. Discrimination laws in hiring and the workplace have bigger teeth than you may realize. AA, at least in most areas has outlived it's designation. It's more about nanny politics now.
A
Please do tell of what you learned by being exposed to people who normally didn't deserve to be where they are. I'm curious to know.
I've seen plenty of unqualified kids get jobs doing analytics, investment banking, sales for banks, hedge funds, etc. The finance industry is where personal connections and favoritism is the worst when it comes to hiring.
That's my observation though.
The real measure of whether they are "unqualified" or not is whether they are good enough to succeed in their position. If they aren't any good, than they will be down the road. If they are good at what they do and succeed than they were never "unqualified" in the first place despite having such advantages.
What are you trying to say?
Just pointing out that it's ridiculous to think that someone who is male and white doesn't deserve to have as equal opportunity to have a job that He is performing well at just because He isn't a minority or a woman. -
I do?CollegeDoog said:
And you call me an idealist. "lol"PurpleJ said:It's way too easy to judge people solely on the basis of their qualifications and abilities. It isn't fair. We need to even out the playing field by creating a different set of standards for the people who we deem to be at a disadvantage. That's fair.
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Discriminatory policies are inherently bad.CollegeDoog said:
It's not the answer to everything but it's not inherently a "bad" law and it's not the reason social mobility is down.TierbsHsotBoobs said:
Totally agree. Affirmative action is just a way of distracting ifrom the REAL problems that you've correctly identified.CollegeDoog said:
Studies show that the link between family background and future income is especially strong in the US than in other countries. Wealthy families still have better access to education like private schools, or well funded public schools. There are lots of wealthy Midd students that went to Rye HS in Westchester, Darien HS in Connecticut, and other public schools in wealthy areas.TierbsHsotBoobs said:
What other policies are those?CollegeDoog said:
Causation? I'd lay the blame on other policies, not the one that helps those from disadvantaged backgrounds get better educations.TierbsHsotBoobs said:
Those policies have been in place for 40 years.CollegeDoog said:
I speak from a statistical position.CuntWaffle said:
Once again you speak of minorities like they are a peg below other people, as in you have no faith that they can accomplish things that everyone should be able to. If you have determination and drive you will succeed.CollegeDoog said:People coming from poorer areas generally go to high schools that aren't as good as those from more affluent areas.
In Seattle you can look a schools like Garfield, Rainier Beach, Cleveland. These are minority heavy schools. If a kid can do well with that kind of disadvantage I think they deserve a boost in the admissions process.
The fact is class mobility is low and continues to decline.
I don't understand why some hate policies that seek to reverse that trend.
You have just presented a logical argument that those policies have failed miserably.
You're the one who linked affirmative action to lower class mobility, not me.
I'd say the misuse of public funds in education and the shitiness of public teachers unions is the biggest hamper.
Public education in America is woeful.
There are much more cynical factors in play.
Water is wet. -
Exactly.CollegeDoog said:
I speak from a statistical position.CuntWaffle said:
Once again you speak of minorities like they are a peg below other people, as in you have no faith that they can accomplish things that everyone should be able to. If you have determination and drive you will succeed.CollegeDoog said:People coming from poorer areas generally go to high schools that aren't as good as those from more affluent areas.
In Seattle you can look a schools like Garfield, Rainier Beach, Cleveland. These are minority heavy schools. If a kid can do well with that kind of disadvantage I think they deserve a boost in the admissions process.
The fact is class mobility is low and continues to decline.
I don't understand why some hate policies that seek to reverse that trend.
Upward mobility continues to decline for almost everyone, including poor (and middle class, or what's left of it) whites. Why not work toward policies that help everyone?
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Tell them you're ghey and you might get the job.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
I understand that's the reality. It's not a perfect world. Shit isn't fair.salemcoog said:
Well Kid. That's how the world works. You get farther by having professional and personal connections in the field that you are entering.CollegeDoog said:
Throughout this thread I've been speaking about the educational merits of the law.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
Look, AA isn't perfect and there are egregous examples of its misuse popping up. For instance wealthy African Americans students are a huge benefactor in the college admissions process.RaceBannon said:
Self loathing is sadCollegeDoog said:Why are we even building a tunnel? Waterfront streets would be much bettter.
Also, AA is necessary.
I find the trust fund babies who lack any real skills getting jobs on Wall Street because of dad much more appalling.
I don't like that it makes people too beholden to their background although they may have different views.
But there's something to be said about "critical mass" in education and the socioeconomic intentions of the law.
I imagine it will become less important over time.
Justice O'Connor's opinion in Grutter v Bollinger is a good read.
If the trust fund babies get the Wall Street job, they have to be good at it to keep it. Their rich daddy can't save them from getting fired if they consistently lose their clients Millions.
AA is reverse sexism and racism whose only function is to keep those that normally wouldn't be good enough to get a job or keep it, on board a company to meet their diversity goals.
In many insistences, the benefactors of AA are good enough to be hired and maybe even promoted anyway. In most cities, people have evolved enough to look beyond a person's skin color or breastesses. Discrimination laws in hiring and the workplace have bigger teeth than you may realize. AA, at least in most areas has outlived it's designation. It's more about nanny politics now.
A
Please do tell of what you learned by being exposed to people who normally didn't deserve to be where they are. I'm curious to know.
I've seen plenty of unqualified kids get jobs doing analytics, investment banking, sales for banks, hedge funds, etc. The finance industry is where personal connections and favoritism is the worst when it comes to hiring.
That's my observation though.
The real measure of whether they are "unqualified" or not is whether they are good enough to succeed in their position. If they aren't any good, than they will be down the road. If they are good at what they do and succeed than they were never "unqualified" in the first place despite having such advantages.
What are you trying to say?
Just pointing out that it's ridiculous to think that someone who is male and white doesn't deserve to have as equal opportunity to have a job that He is performing well at just because He isn't a minority or a woman. -
The government is too fucking retarded to do something that sensible. It's more important to make steep cuts in the food stamp program so that we can afford to give aid money to arabs that want to kill us, isolate and offend our allies, overturn the will of voters to let gays marry in states that don't want it there, construct propaganda that tells us the recession is over, force idiotic laws on us that politicians don't even bother to read before they pass them, give tax handouts to oil companies and other large corporations who in turn use it to line their CEO's pockets with gold while raping their workers with wage and benefits cuts, etc., etc.Fire_Marshall_Bill said:
Exactly.CollegeDoog said:
I speak from a statistical position.CuntWaffle said:
Once again you speak of minorities like they are a peg below other people, as in you have no faith that they can accomplish things that everyone should be able to. If you have determination and drive you will succeed.CollegeDoog said:People coming from poorer areas generally go to high schools that aren't as good as those from more affluent areas.
In Seattle you can look a schools like Garfield, Rainier Beach, Cleveland. These are minority heavy schools. If a kid can do well with that kind of disadvantage I think they deserve a boost in the admissions process.
The fact is class mobility is low and continues to decline.
I don't understand why some hate policies that seek to reverse that trend.
Upward mobility continues to decline for almost everyone, including poor (and middle class, or what's left of it) whites. Why not work toward policies that help everyone? -
Garfield is two seperate cohorts that just happen to share the same building. I speak from experience.
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Just for kicks, I investigated the job postings for "Security Personnel" for the Libyan Embassy shortly after the 9/11/11 attack. There were many openings. I assume that means they were severely under-staffed. The applications were restricted to LGBT partners of current federal employees.oregonblitzkrieg said:
Tell them you're ghey and you might get the job.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
I understand that's the reality. It's not a perfect world. Shit isn't fair.salemcoog said:
Well Kid. That's how the world works. You get farther by having professional and personal connections in the field that you are entering.CollegeDoog said:
Throughout this thread I've been speaking about the educational merits of the law.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
Look, AA isn't perfect and there are egregous examples of its misuse popping up. For instance wealthy African Americans students are a huge benefactor in the college admissions process.RaceBannon said:
Self loathing is sadCollegeDoog said:Why are we even building a tunnel? Waterfront streets would be much bettter.
Also, AA is necessary.
I find the trust fund babies who lack any real skills getting jobs on Wall Street because of dad much more appalling.
I don't like that it makes people too beholden to their background although they may have different views.
But there's something to be said about "critical mass" in education and the socioeconomic intentions of the law.
I imagine it will become less important over time.
Justice O'Connor's opinion in Grutter v Bollinger is a good read.
If the trust fund babies get the Wall Street job, they have to be good at it to keep it. Their rich daddy can't save them from getting fired if they consistently lose their clients Millions.
AA is reverse sexism and racism whose only function is to keep those that normally wouldn't be good enough to get a job or keep it, on board a company to meet their diversity goals.
In many insistences, the benefactors of AA are good enough to be hired and maybe even promoted anyway. In most cities, people have evolved enough to look beyond a person's skin color or breastesses. Discrimination laws in hiring and the workplace have bigger teeth than you may realize. AA, at least in most areas has outlived it's designation. It's more about nanny politics now.
A
Please do tell of what you learned by being exposed to people who normally didn't deserve to be where they are. I'm curious to know.
I've seen plenty of unqualified kids get jobs doing analytics, investment banking, sales for banks, hedge funds, etc. The finance industry is where personal connections and favoritism is the worst when it comes to hiring.
That's my observation though.
The real measure of whether they are "unqualified" or not is whether they are good enough to succeed in their position. If they aren't any good, than they will be down the road. If they are good at what they do and succeed than they were never "unqualified" in the first place despite having such advantages.
What are you trying to say?
Just pointing out that it's ridiculous to think that someone who is male and white doesn't deserve to have as equal opportunity to have a job that He is performing well at just because He isn't a minority or a woman.
You talk about "policies"? The "policies" are written by fucking idiots. -
Just for kicks, I need to see a linkdeath2ducks said:
Just for kicks, I investigated the job postings for "Security Personnel" for the Libyan Embassy shortly after the 9/11/11 attack. There were many openings. I assume that means they were severely under-staffed. The applications were restricted to LGBT partners of current federal employees.oregonblitzkrieg said:
Tell them you're ghey and you might get the job.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
I understand that's the reality. It's not a perfect world. Shit isn't fair.salemcoog said:
Well Kid. That's how the world works. You get farther by having professional and personal connections in the field that you are entering.CollegeDoog said:
Throughout this thread I've been speaking about the educational merits of the law.salemcoog said:CollegeDoog said:
Look, AA isn't perfect and there are egregous examples of its misuse popping up. For instance wealthy African Americans students are a huge benefactor in the college admissions process.RaceBannon said:
Self loathing is sadCollegeDoog said:Why are we even building a tunnel? Waterfront streets would be much bettter.
Also, AA is necessary.
I find the trust fund babies who lack any real skills getting jobs on Wall Street because of dad much more appalling.
I don't like that it makes people too beholden to their background although they may have different views.
But there's something to be said about "critical mass" in education and the socioeconomic intentions of the law.
I imagine it will become less important over time.
Justice O'Connor's opinion in Grutter v Bollinger is a good read.
If the trust fund babies get the Wall Street job, they have to be good at it to keep it. Their rich daddy can't save them from getting fired if they consistently lose their clients Millions.
AA is reverse sexism and racism whose only function is to keep those that normally wouldn't be good enough to get a job or keep it, on board a company to meet their diversity goals.
In many insistences, the benefactors of AA are good enough to be hired and maybe even promoted anyway. In most cities, people have evolved enough to look beyond a person's skin color or breastesses. Discrimination laws in hiring and the workplace have bigger teeth than you may realize. AA, at least in most areas has outlived it's designation. It's more about nanny politics now.
A
Please do tell of what you learned by being exposed to people who normally didn't deserve to be where they are. I'm curious to know.
I've seen plenty of unqualified kids get jobs doing analytics, investment banking, sales for banks, hedge funds, etc. The finance industry is where personal connections and favoritism is the worst when it comes to hiring.
That's my observation though.
The real measure of whether they are "unqualified" or not is whether they are good enough to succeed in their position. If they aren't any good, than they will be down the road. If they are good at what they do and succeed than they were never "unqualified" in the first place despite having such advantages.
What are you trying to say?
Just pointing out that it's ridiculous to think that someone who is male and white doesn't deserve to have as equal opportunity to have a job that He is performing well at just because He isn't a minority or a woman.
You talk about "policies"? The "policies" are written by fucking idiots.
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