Robert Redford sells the couch
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Still disagree.
The list was provided for example's sake. There are giants in acting.
Redford was Jay Buhner, not Mickey Mantle.
Ralph Lauren makes shirts.
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Oh for Christ's sake.
You provided the list and it was a shit example. If it's shit, don't point to it because it doesn't help your case.
You proffered the theory that his best work was in support roles and I gave you four big ones in which he was the main event. And his "support roles" were iconic in part because of him. Nobody ever says, "well anyone could have played next to Newman in Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid." Literally nobody says that.
Ralph Lauren, love him or hate him, has played a major role in defining the collective sense of Americana fashion and style longer than you've been jerking off. He does a lot more than make shirts. You are probably wearing something right now that can be traced back to his influence.
Go back to bed wherever you are in Idaho with both of those replies and try again later. You sound like Roadie trying to cast yet another Miami perennial pro bowl player into the "he's just alright" role. At some point, when you're trying too hard you're trying too hard.
The Fucking Natural
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The competition for Mt Rushmore of his era is fierce. But Redford is definitely in the running.
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Jay Fucking Buhner indeed.
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Me and Bob, were about as close as could be without actually having met.
I've skied many times at his resort Sundance and experienced its fine dining. Eaten at his Park City restaurants too.
I went to about 4 or 5 Sundance Film Festival screenings over the years.
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You're the one saying he was Mt. Rushmore worthy. He wasn't and never will be. Sorry. Shifting goalposts - Mt Rushmore equals FOUR
Even with the list provided - not a chance in hell Robert Redford makes the Mt. Rushmore over this group of candidates.
Jack Nicholson
Marlon Brando
Robert De Niro
Al Pacino
Dustin Hoffman
Tom Hanks
Paul Newman
Denzel Washington
Jack Lemmon
Robert Duvall
Clint Eastwood
Gene Hackman
Let alone more current versions like Cruise, DiCaprio, Downey, Jr.
You got the part right about Redford and Pitt though. Same make, different model year.
Edit: Except Pitt plays different characters in his films. Not the same one every time.
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BTW, what you’re attempting to do is shift from a Mt Rushmore of acting to a Mt Rushmore of movie stardom
Not the same “range” (SWIDT)
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Did Creep say All Time Mt Rushmore or Mt Rushmore of his era? I'm saying he's in contention for his era which is basically 70's into early 80s.
So it's Hackman, Hoffman, Duval, Nicholson, Eastwood. Pacino was god father centric in the 70s and didn't get as many of the other iconic roles until the 80s. DeNiro started to break out in the 70s but didn't peak till the 80's and 90s. Brando is a 50s star who had a come back in a 70's film. Newman is more a 60's star.
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Best work in supporting roles: wrong
List provided as an example: not great putting it mildly
Redford is Jay Buhner: can't take your view on the matter seriously
Pitt playing different characters: if meant as a dig on Redford, that's fine but it also eliminates a few actors on your list. And I don't score Jeremiah Johnson and Roy Hobbs as the same character fwiw.
That all said, if we are strictly limited to Top 4, then I think there is room for reasonable debate about other actors pushing him off. I'll remember next time Mount Rushmore comes up that we are limited to actual Mount Rushmore spots. But his body of work in movies as an actor, including many that weren't written according to the blockbuster formula (Cruise, Hanks, Washington et al) along with his larger role in cinema as an attractor and developer of talent, producer, writer and director all put him up with the biggest names.
As a technical actor … I can't play the 4.8 vs. 4.4 game and I suspect nobody really can because it's stupid. Some guys have crazy range and can do all kinds of shit that makes you forget who they really are (De Niro, Hoffman, Nicholson) and others who can never hide the fact that they are who they are playing a role (Costner, Hanks, Newman, Washington, Eastwood, etc.). Even in Saving Private Ryan, Tom Hanks was Tom Hanks through and through playing Captain Miller. Same guy who was stranded on an island for 4 years. Same guy acting like a gay man dying of AIDs in Philadelphia. Always Tom Hanks.
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I'm not attempting anything. You are attempting to make it seem as if I'm attempting something but that does not make it so.
I said:
One of the greats. I don't agree about him making a better Michael Corleone but you'll get no push back from me on him taking his place on Mount Rushmore.
You replied:
Disagree. Redford was a solid actor but no Mt. Rushmore. Never won an Oscar for acting. Handsome motherfucker, for sure (no homo). Best roles were in support of greats like Paul Newman and Dustin Hoffman. (emphasis added)
If you want to navel gaze over the distinction between movie star and technical acting chops then I won't attempt to stand in your way but don't say I brought it up or I am trying to shift from away from anything. There are stage actors who are better at technical acting than many (most?) of the people on your list. Success on the big screen is part of this discussion, or at least I thought it was, and he had it.
As to the pecking order, "Mt. Rushmore" was merely a metaphorical reference to him being one of the greats of all time and I stand by that; he was. I didn't mean to start a discussion about whether he was in the T 4 most technically capable actors of all time. I don't know how you would even start that discussion. I don't know how you'd get Jimmy Stewart to play Josey Wales or DeNiro to play Hubbell or Redford to play Travis Bickle or Paul Newman to play John Keating. We could do this all day. I think the only guy who jumps out on that list who I'm convinced could play literally anything and make you forget is Daniel Day Lewis. But holy shit Christian Bale is down at 72 on your shit list and he's as good or better than a lot of dudes making the T20 and has played a wide array of characters and played them exceedingly well. I'll add that any shortcoming one can charge against Redford as an actor can be charged against Paul Newman as well and he's T10 on your list. Illustrates the point, for me at least.
