They're not coming for your guns

Swaye said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

YellowSnow said:

oregonblitzkrieg said:

This is the future if you don't vote. Socialists will eventually seize your guns. They have zero respect for the 2nd amendment. Putting cops in this position is unforgivable. Whoever is in charge of that state should be fucking arrested for violating the constitution.

See below OBK. It doesn't matter if the Reds respect it or not. 26% or more of the states in this country aren't abandoning the 2nd amendment.

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.

The intention of the "anti-gun" people has never been to repeal the 2nd for the obvious reasons you state. It's too damn difficult and it's against popular opinion.

Instead, it's always been to attempt to re-frame the conversation and pass laws such as the "assault weapons ban" to make owning a firearm legally an extremely difficult task. Always in the name of public safety.

If I can only buy firearms licensed and regulated by the state it kind of defeats the point of them being a check and balance on the state's power.

argumentum ad absurdum: The 2nd amendment isn't repealed but "common sense" laws are passed that only guns produced by Racebannon can be legally sold and kept. Oh what's that you say? Race doesn't produce any guns? Tough shit, it's the law.

If you don't think federal regulators would ever make such nonsense laws then you've never dealt with a federal regulator.

We have a winner.

UW_Doog_Bot said:

YellowSnow said:

oregonblitzkrieg said:

This is the future if you don't vote. Socialists will eventually seize your guns. They have zero respect for the 2nd amendment. Putting cops in this position is unforgivable. Whoever is in charge of that state should be fucking arrested for violating the constitution.

See below OBK. It doesn't matter if the Reds respect it or not. 26% or more of the states in this country aren't abandoning the 2nd amendment.

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.

The intention of the "anti-gun" people has never been to repeal the 2nd for the obvious reasons you state. It's too damn difficult and it's against popular opinion.

Instead, it's always been to attempt to re-frame the conversation and pass laws such as the "assault weapons ban" to make owning a firearm legally an extremely difficult task. Always in the name of public safety.

If I can only buy firearms licensed and regulated by the state it kind of defeats the point of them being a check and balance on the state's power.

argumentum ad absurdum: The 2nd amendment isn't repealed but "common sense" laws are passed that only guns produced by Racebannon can be legally sold and kept. Oh what's that you say? Race doesn't produce any guns? Tough shit, it's the law.

If you don't think federal regulators would ever make such nonsense laws then you've never dealt with a federal regulator.

YellowSnow said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

YellowSnow said:

UW_Doog_Bot said:

YellowSnow said:

oregonblitzkrieg said:

This is the future if you don't vote. Socialists will eventually seize your guns. They have zero respect for the 2nd amendment. Putting cops in this position is unforgivable. Whoever is in charge of that state should be fucking arrested for violating the constitution.

See below OBK. It doesn't matter if the Reds respect it or not. 26% or more of the states in this country aren't abandoning the 2nd amendment.

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.

The intention of the "anti-gun" people has never been to repeal the 2nd for the obvious reasons you state. It's too damn difficult and it's against popular opinion.

Instead, it's always been to attempt to re-frame the conversation and pass laws such as the "assault weapons ban" to make owning a firearm legally an extremely difficult task. Always in the name of public safety.

If I can only buy firearms licensed and regulated by the state it kind of defeats the point of them being a check and balance on the state's power.

argumentum ad absurdum: The 2nd amendment isn't repealed but "common sense" laws are passed that only guns produced by Racebannon can be legally sold and kept. Oh what's that you say? Race doesn't produce any guns? Tough shit, it's the law.

If you don't think federal regulators would ever make such nonsense laws then you've never dealt with a federal regulator.

Agree. Let's get rid of ALL nonsensical regulations of our right to own whatever ever firearms we want.

See there you go again Yella with a binary argument as though I'm some cheap Two silver dollar libertarian. You should know me better than that. I don't deal in absolutes when it comes to policy.

The poont of the 2nd has been and should always be a check on the power of the state.

Instead of an arms race between civilians and the state how about we scale back the military industrial complex? or the surveillance state? capisci?

And yes, I think the licensing program for full auto actually should be expanded as I'm not sure there's ever been a mass shooting in modern American History that has involved a licensed automatic weapon. If you provide me evidence to the contrary I would be open to altering my opinion.

I don't think of you as a cheap two silver dollar libertarian who only deals in absolutes. But as the oft stated cliché goes, where do you logically draw the line between what firearms we should have the right to own? It's a pretty flimsy position in my view (not saying you are so don't twist) to be for semi-auto AR style rifles, but against fully auto. And furthermore, if people truly believe that guns are the PRIMARY guarantor of liberty, then the citizenry should, in fact, be armed as heavily as possible to provide an adequate check on future tyranny. On a side note - while I think having a 2nd amendment certainly isn't a bad thing - I contend that is not the primary reason we are a free people; rather, this is more so due to the fact that we are country which was founded by brilliant men who were products of the English Enlightenment (that they were protestants played a big role too).

It's pointless to worry about the military industrial complex. It was a necessary evil forced upon us? by external actors. Furthermore, it's probably been more of a net positive to our nation than a negative. Think of all the kewl shit we have today as a result of all that Cold War R&D spending. Surveillance state is a necessary evil as well; if the A-rabs or whomever kill another 3,000 Americans, then we're going to get Patriot Act on steroids. The fact that we haven't had a major domestic terrorist attack in 17 years suggests that there is some ROI.