Top MBAs - Foster School Climbs to #20 in US News
Highest ranking I've ever seen, and now with really good company. They've invested a lot in the B-school and it shows. Took a walk around campus a few weeks back and don't even recognize the place.
We all know the giants, in changing order Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Chicago, MIT, Columbia, NYU, etc. The next round includes some that are debatably in the top group .... UCLA, UNC, Virginia, Cornell, Dartmouth, Duke, Michigan. Surprised to see Yale in the top ten ... in my day, Yale was a lower top 30 program and not known for its school of management. Shows what $31 billion can buy you when you feel like buying it.
Anyway, Foster is climbing. There are also always MBA programs that aren't as highly ranked but get you there depending on where "there" is. SMU, Northeastern, Boston University, Boston College, Indiana and Emory are some programs that I've been told over the years are strong feeders to Wall Street to a degree that is disproportionate to their respective rankings.
Any thoughts about other programs that punch above their ranking weight? I think the tech companies love Carnegie Mellon. @whlinder , GT is ranked #27.
Comments
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Funny thing about SMU is that TCU took all of their top faculty back in the day
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I had always heard that SMU, undergrad and grad, is more about doing a good job with connections ... like USC is known for. Just a high level general Impression.Tequilla said:Funny thing about SMU is that TCU took all of their top faculty back in the day
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It's funny, when I was doing the JD/MBA degree program, the law school was ranked about where Foster is now, and the Business School struck me as being about where the Law School is these days. But I've watched and been impressed with Foster's improvement over the years. I've known Frank Hodge for close to twenty years. Foster is in good hands.
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JHU didn't establish a MBA program and a business school until 2007. They have been investing pretty heavily in it. I wonder if they will ever get ranked?
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Agreed. I didn't do the JD/MBA, and part of the reason for that was that I had an undergrad degree from there and thought it was redundant to an extent.HHusky said:It's funny, when I was doing the JD/MBA degree program, the law school was ranked about where Foster is now, and the Business School struck me as being about where the Law School is these days. But I've watched and been impressed with Foster's improvement over the years. I've known Frank Hodge for close to twenty years. Foster is in good hands.
They've done well, but as I'm sure you'd agree, UW Law is criminally under-ranked. In terms of selectivity, areas of high competence and, now, facilities, it seems clear that it is outranked by lesser schools. I've never been able to figure it. When I was applying, I think they achieved like 23 or 22, right ahead of or behind Boston College. They haven't been close ever since. -
Just saw that. Very new, just got accredited recently, and unranked. That said, that's a name on which I'd gamble. Is the average person really going to say "pass" and take the guy with the Arizona MBA because it's ranked 46th?Swaye said:JHU didn't establish a MBA program and a business school until 2007. They have been investing pretty heavily in it. I wonder if they will ever get ranked?
I think especially now as healthcare investments are just flying and JHU's ability to connect with their vaunted health care wing, that MBA with the healthcare focus will be yuge.
And you also have to remember how fast schools can rise when they have money and throw it at a program they want to build. JHU has a pretty hefty endowment, and that's with Bloomberg still alive. He's going to Phil Knight JHU when he passes. -
No doubt ... SMU is the definition of Dallas moneycreepycoug said:
I had always heard that SMU, undergrad and grad, is more about doing a good job with connections ... like USC is known for. Just a high level general Impression.Tequilla said:Funny thing about SMU is that TCU took all of their top faculty back in the day
Not that TCU and Ft Worth doesn’t have money because they definitely do ... it’s just a different kind of money
And if you don’t understand that, then you don’t know DFW -
I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years. -
Northwestern Tier I? At least for marketing they were always thought of as tippy top. MIT as well?Woof said:I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years. -
They just put 25 M into the Carey school this year. I do know JHU doesn't fuck around. When they decide they want to do something they go hard. Probably be a top 30 program in 20 years.creepycoug said:
Just saw that. Very new, just got accredited recently, and unranked. That said, that's a name on which I'd gamble. Is the average person really going to say "pass" and take the guy with the Arizona MBA because it's ranked 46th?Swaye said:JHU didn't establish a MBA program and a business school until 2007. They have been investing pretty heavily in it. I wonder if they will ever get ranked?
I think especially now as healthcare investments are just flying and JHU's ability to connect with their vaunted health care wing, that MBA with the healthcare focus will be yuge.
And you also have to remember how fast schools can rise when they have money and throw it at a program they want to build. JHU has a pretty hefty endowment, and that's with Bloomberg still alive. He's going to Phil Knight JHU when he passes. -
Sooner I would guess. Money talks.Swaye said:
They just put 25 M into the Carey school this year. I do know JHU doesn't fuck around. When they decide they want to do something they go hard. Probably be a top 30 program in 20 years.creepycoug said:
Just saw that. Very new, just got accredited recently, and unranked. That said, that's a name on which I'd gamble. Is the average person really going to say "pass" and take the guy with the Arizona MBA because it's ranked 46th?Swaye said:JHU didn't establish a MBA program and a business school until 2007. They have been investing pretty heavily in it. I wonder if they will ever get ranked?
I think especially now as healthcare investments are just flying and JHU's ability to connect with their vaunted health care wing, that MBA with the healthcare focus will be yuge.
And you also have to remember how fast schools can rise when they have money and throw it at a program they want to build. JHU has a pretty hefty endowment, and that's with Bloomberg still alive. He's going to Phil Knight JHU when he passes. -
M7 school are considered tier 1creepycoug said:
Northwestern Tier I? At least for marketing they were always thought of as tippy top. MIT as well?Woof said:I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years. -
I'd bet HBS, GSB, and Wharton win 95% of the dual admits vs. Kellogg. To me, Booth is the best of the M7, so that's why I lean toward them being in Tier I, but most Booth grads I've met are strange.creepycoug said:
Northwestern Tier I? At least for marketing they were always thought of as tippy top. MIT as well?Woof said:I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years.
Honestly I don't see a massive difference between a school like Duke or UVA and a Kellogg. Deeper class, but not meaningfully so. That's the difference between Tier II and III, better opportunities in terms of employers and the depth of quality candidates. -
All that matters is job placement when talking about a MBA. Why the fuck spend all that $ and not make moneyWoof said:
I'd bet HBS, GSB, and Wharton win 95% of the dual admits vs. Kellogg. To me, Booth is the best of the M7, so that's why I lean toward them being in Tier I, but most Booth grads I've met are strange.creepycoug said:
Northwestern Tier I? At least for marketing they were always thought of as tippy top. MIT as well?Woof said:I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years.
Honestly I don't see a massive difference between a school like Duke or UVA and a Kellogg. Deeper class, but not meaningfully so. That's the difference between Tier II and III, better opportunities in terms of employers and the depth of quality candidates. -
I agree with this. There are a lot of educational pursuits you might chase that have varying other degrees of value. I would say law is one of them. There are a lot of reasons to get a law degree that go well beyond private practice or even sitting for the bar. It was one hell of an education and eye opener for me.FireCohen said:
All that matters is job placement when talking about a MBA. Why the fuck spend all that $ and not make moneyWoof said:
I'd bet HBS, GSB, and Wharton win 95% of the dual admits vs. Kellogg. To me, Booth is the best of the M7, so that's why I lean toward them being in Tier I, but most Booth grads I've met are strange.creepycoug said:
Northwestern Tier I? At least for marketing they were always thought of as tippy top. MIT as well?Woof said:I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years.
Honestly I don't see a massive difference between a school like Duke or UVA and a Kellogg. Deeper class, but not meaningfully so. That's the difference between Tier II and III, better opportunities in terms of employers and the depth of quality candidates.
But the MBA is for punching your ticket IMO. -
Money money boost my moralecreepycoug said:
I agree with this. There are a lot of educational pursuits you might chase that have varying other degrees of value. I would say law is one of them. There are a lot of reasons to get a law degree that go well beyond private practice or even sitting for the bar. It was one hell of an education and eye opener for me.FireCohen said:
All that matters is job placement when talking about a MBA. Why the fuck spend all that $ and not make moneyWoof said:
I'd bet HBS, GSB, and Wharton win 95% of the dual admits vs. Kellogg. To me, Booth is the best of the M7, so that's why I lean toward them being in Tier I, but most Booth grads I've met are strange.creepycoug said:
Northwestern Tier I? At least for marketing they were always thought of as tippy top. MIT as well?Woof said:I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years.
Honestly I don't see a massive difference between a school like Duke or UVA and a Kellogg. Deeper class, but not meaningfully so. That's the difference between Tier II and III, better opportunities in terms of employers and the depth of quality candidates.
But the MBA is for punching your ticket IMO. -
Yes, but don't undervalue the network you also get. Your friends and classmates at HBS are in general going to be CEOs and your classmates at a Tier III MBA are going to be middle to upper management management. Getting paid immediately after MBA is important but earnings 10 years is also a metric you can't overlook.FireCohen said:
All that matters is job placement when talking about a MBA. Why the fuck spend all that $ and not make moneyWoof said:
I'd bet HBS, GSB, and Wharton win 95% of the dual admits vs. Kellogg. To me, Booth is the best of the M7, so that's why I lean toward them being in Tier I, but most Booth grads I've met are strange.creepycoug said:
Northwestern Tier I? At least for marketing they were always thought of as tippy top. MIT as well?Woof said:I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years.
Honestly I don't see a massive difference between a school like Duke or UVA and a Kellogg. Deeper class, but not meaningfully so. That's the difference between Tier II and III, better opportunities in terms of employers and the depth of quality candidates. -
All of education is the long game. I've preached that to my kids. When you think about it, that's probably what it signals to future employers ... that you play the long game.Woof said:
Yes, but don't undervalue the network you also get. Your friends and classmates at HBS are in general going to be CEOs and your classmates at a Tier III MBA are going to be middle to upper management management. Getting paid immediately after MBA is important but earnings 10 years is also a metric you can't overlook.FireCohen said:
All that matters is job placement when talking about a MBA. Why the fuck spend all that $ and not make moneyWoof said:
I'd bet HBS, GSB, and Wharton win 95% of the dual admits vs. Kellogg. To me, Booth is the best of the M7, so that's why I lean toward them being in Tier I, but most Booth grads I've met are strange.creepycoug said:
Northwestern Tier I? At least for marketing they were always thought of as tippy top. MIT as well?Woof said:I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years.
Honestly I don't see a massive difference between a school like Duke or UVA and a Kellogg. Deeper class, but not meaningfully so. That's the difference between Tier II and III, better opportunities in terms of employers and the depth of quality candidates.
I'll never know what the ROI on undergrad would have been because I took one year off and then went to law school. The ROI on the latter was pretty good. I paid for that (or, more accurately, others paid for it) with pennies on the dollar in today's tuition. So, really, it was amazingly good. -
I agree, but I would say only about 20% of the folks that go the same elite mba programs really stay in touch. Others will forget about each other. It really matters if you are in position to start raising capital for some start up or fucking fundWoof said:
Yes, but don't undervalue the network you also get. Your friends and classmates at HBS are in general going to be CEOs and your classmates at a Tier III MBA are going to be middle to upper management management. Getting paid immediately after MBA is important but earnings 10 years is also a metric you can't overlook.FireCohen said:
All that matters is job placement when talking about a MBA. Why the fuck spend all that $ and not make moneyWoof said:
I'd bet HBS, GSB, and Wharton win 95% of the dual admits vs. Kellogg. To me, Booth is the best of the M7, so that's why I lean toward them being in Tier I, but most Booth grads I've met are strange.creepycoug said:
Northwestern Tier I? At least for marketing they were always thought of as tippy top. MIT as well?Woof said:I don't really pay attention to the exact number of each school, but I think there are essentially 4 tiers to MBA programs.
Tier 1 - Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Booth - if you get in, you have to go, even if nearly every person I've ever met from Booth is fucking weird.
Tier II - Every other school in the top 15 - if you get in, in 95% of situations it makes sense to go
Tier III - Every school in the top 30 - if you get in, crunch the math, but it probably makes sense to go
Tier IV - Everyone else - It could be worth it, but I hope someone else is paying
Foster used to be Tier IV, but is definitely climbing the past 5-10 years.
Honestly I don't see a massive difference between a school like Duke or UVA and a Kellogg. Deeper class, but not meaningfully so. That's the difference between Tier II and III, better opportunities in terms of employers and the depth of quality candidates. -
Are mbas still good? It seems like a more valuable thing if you've already got some experience and are using it as kind of a stepping stone.
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That used to be the case. These days mostly to rebrand into better jobsPitchfork51 said:Are mbas still good? It seems like a more valuable thing if you've already got some experience and are using it as kind of a stepping stone.
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What's the deal with UW law? Why is it tanking?HHusky said:It's funny, when I was doing the JD/MBA degree program, the law school was ranked about where Foster is now, and the Business School struck me as being about where the Law School is these days. But I've watched and been impressed with Foster's improvement over the years. I've known Frank Hodge for close to twenty years. Foster is in good hands.
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I honestly don't know. Back in the day, when it peaked at #22 and tied with BC, we? used to get dinged because of our facilities. I always thought that was a little cheap; because although Condon Hall is a particularly ugly example of brutalist architecture, it was functional.BennyBeaver said:
What's the deal with UW law? Why is it tanking?HHusky said:It's funny, when I was doing the JD/MBA degree program, the law school was ranked about where Foster is now, and the Business School struck me as being about where the Law School is these days. But I've watched and been impressed with Foster's improvement over the years. I've known Frank Hodge for close to twenty years. Foster is in good hands.
Now that they have a great new building and nothing else seems to have changed, they seem to be losing in the rankings wars. -
I'm hearing the faculty sucks. Just what I'm hearing though so don't twist it.creepycoug said:
I honestly don't know. Back in the day, when it peaked at #22 and tied with BC, we? used to get dinged because of our facilities. I always thought that was a little cheap; because although Condon Hall is a particularly ugly example of brutalist architecture, it was functional.BennyBeaver said:
What's the deal with UW law? Why is it tanking?HHusky said:It's funny, when I was doing the JD/MBA degree program, the law school was ranked about where Foster is now, and the Business School struck me as being about where the Law School is these days. But I've watched and been impressed with Foster's improvement over the years. I've known Frank Hodge for close to twenty years. Foster is in good hands.
Now that they have a great new building and nothing else seems to have changed, they seem to be losing in the rankings wars.
#42 per US News.
Behind such bastions of academis like: BYU, UM (gophers), ASU, UFla, UCIrvine, UCDavis -
I know. Don’t really know about the faculty.BennyBeaver said:
I'm hearing the faculty sucks. Just what I'm hearing though so don't twist it.creepycoug said:
I honestly don't know. Back in the day, when it peaked at #22 and tied with BC, we? used to get dinged because of our facilities. I always thought that was a little cheap; because although Condon Hall is a particularly ugly example of brutalist architecture, it was functional.BennyBeaver said:
What's the deal with UW law? Why is it tanking?HHusky said:It's funny, when I was doing the JD/MBA degree program, the law school was ranked about where Foster is now, and the Business School struck me as being about where the Law School is these days. But I've watched and been impressed with Foster's improvement over the years. I've known Frank Hodge for close to twenty years. Foster is in good hands.
Now that they have a great new building and nothing else seems to have changed, they seem to be losing in the rankings wars.
#42 per US News.
Behind such bastions of academis like: BYU, UM (gophers), ASU, UFla, UCIrvine, UCDavis
