Pissing off millions of golfers is a good business strategy.
Just flat out wrong
It’s way beyond just pissing off golfers. Combined with Justin Thomas over the weekend, it just needs to stay off the woke radar. Local Government could really screw golf over with new property tax rules and environmental regulations.
Trump is just toxic at this point and the sooner he’s not on the radar for the masses the better ... don’t feel like going into huge detail on that
JT is an idiot ... so I think he meant anything malicious? Of course not. Do I think we would be well served to be reminded of a “sticks and stones ... but words will never hurt me” mindset? Yep. But everybody should be well aware of the environment you live in and this isn’t JT’s 1st dumbass comment. Comes with the territory.
Local government screwing over golf courses? Perhaps but I think it’s going to be much more localized and nuanced. Seattle for instance is going to go out of their way to shit on golf so that they can repurpose the land. Tacoma ain’t going to fuck with Chambers because that place prints money for them. Places like Bend aren’t going to shit on the tourist economy that props up the region.
I guess intuitively it could be fun to see the government get really nuanced in picking winners and losers in terms of taxes.
I’m was agreeing with you... There is no upside into fighting this battle, whether it’s just or not. By fighting, you are making golf itself a target for who knows what. I’m describing how golf could actually get cancelled if the mob wanted to do so.
There’s push in Seattle to turn the city owned public ones into drug shooting zones, but there have also been pushes in Seattle and LA at least to start assessing the private course property values differently. That’s how you would kill them.
Seattle’s a mess with respect to golf
They have the ability to leverage land to create their own version of Chambers Bay ... which is desperately needed ... but it’s easier to feed the narrative that golf is elitist and serves the select few.
I’ve seen first hand how you can make golf fun and enjoyable for non golfers creating relatively easy entry points into the game ... but whatever
In the end it’s much easier to have class warfare
I’m not super familiar with the public courses in LA proper but my sense is most of the good courses are private
The private clubs that are filled with the ultra rich will just laugh at the added taxes ... but on the other end of things, with COVID proving many of us can work from anywhere, cities are going to be walking fine lines about overplaying their hands leading to large population departures
Seattle is a mess with golf, but given the constrained housing supply, building a top class golf course would just be absurd urban planning at this point. Hopefully the four Seattle munis can survive the current push to become Sawantville, because they really do offer golf to a population that would otherwise have no exposure to it.
But is it?
The big problem with the current City courses is that they are largely unprofitable (partly because of effectively fees/royalties added onto each facility). The ranges are good money makers based on available space but there aren’t a ton of them in the area.
If the City was to repurpose the existing courses (leaving the ranges at Interbay, Jefferson, and Jackson) and create a higher end 36 hole facility that was more of a destination (leveraging the Chambers model) then the City would find itself far more profitable while also satisfying the needs of the community
1) The PGA should be moved if for no other reason than Trump’s name/presence will take the oxygen and focus from the event
2) It’s bad business for golf to retain the close ties to Trump particularly given that the sport is already viewed as highly elitist
3) It’s impossible to be affiliated with Trump after the actions of this week ... the fireworks are coming after he leaves office
1) You honestly think a year from now his name really is going to matter?
2) Viewed as elitist? Have you looked at the cost of a decent set of irons? The price of green fees for a decent 18 hole course? (I know I sound poor) Golf is as elitist as it gets. Been that way for over 100 years. That perception will never change.
3) People that watch and play golf won't change their opinion regardless.
1) Trump’s effectively trash as a brand going forward whether in business or politics ... there will be a fringe niche that will give him business but that’s it. His golf properties that are public will likely see dramatic revenue reductions forcing a sale. The private clubs will see an exodus of membership as the guilty by association is bad business for the members who have plenty to lose.
Politically I suspect there will be a number on the right that move more to the center and leave the far right on their own. Either the far right will have to adjust or the moderate left will get so pissed at the socialist arm of the Dems that you’ll get a 2nd spinoff where a merged centrist/moderate party is created with potentially more numbers than each of the polarized extremes.
2) I’m an avid golfer and I know the cost. I rarely buy anything in terms of balls or clothes at full price. Clubs can be hit or miss in terms of getting on sale vs full price (even at full price I get a full setting and often tax paid for). Plenty of golf deals out there if you know what you’re doing. Lots of programs out there for kids with the First Tee that eliminate some of the “country club” stigma. I grew up playing as much as I could and I promise you I’m far from an elitist. Cost of growing up playing baseball and hockey just as examples are far more expensive than golf. I don’t know the particulars with soccer but that wouldn’t surprise me either.
3) Not sure what you’re referencing about nothing will change but if you’re suggesting all golfers are Trump supporters that’s a very erroneous assumption
Golf stereotype is rich white Republicans
I don't really play (it's been four or five years) so that might have changed a bit, but I doubt it. I think this will piss off a lot of golfers.
If that was the case then why do you have so many that play on the West Coast?
Pissing off millions of golfers is a good business strategy.
Just flat out wrong
It’s way beyond just pissing off golfers. Combined with Justin Thomas over the weekend, it just needs to stay off the woke radar. Local Government could really screw golf over with new property tax rules and environmental regulations.
Trump is just toxic at this point and the sooner he’s not on the radar for the masses the better ... don’t feel like going into huge detail on that
JT is an idiot ... so I think he meant anything malicious? Of course not. Do I think we would be well served to be reminded of a “sticks and stones ... but words will never hurt me” mindset? Yep. But everybody should be well aware of the environment you live in and this isn’t JT’s 1st dumbass comment. Comes with the territory.
Local government screwing over golf courses? Perhaps but I think it’s going to be much more localized and nuanced. Seattle for instance is going to go out of their way to shit on golf so that they can repurpose the land. Tacoma ain’t going to fuck with Chambers because that place prints money for them. Places like Bend aren’t going to shit on the tourist economy that props up the region.
I guess intuitively it could be fun to see the government get really nuanced in picking winners and losers in terms of taxes.
I’m was agreeing with you... There is no upside into fighting this battle, whether it’s just or not. By fighting, you are making golf itself a target for who knows what. I’m describing how golf could actually get cancelled if the mob wanted to do so.
There’s push in Seattle to turn the city owned public ones into drug shooting zones, but there have also been pushes in Seattle and LA at least to start assessing the private course property values differently. That’s how you would kill them.
Seattle’s a mess with respect to golf
They have the ability to leverage land to create their own version of Chambers Bay ... which is desperately needed ... but it’s easier to feed the narrative that golf is elitist and serves the select few.
I’ve seen first hand how you can make golf fun and enjoyable for non golfers creating relatively easy entry points into the game ... but whatever
In the end it’s much easier to have class warfare
I’m not super familiar with the public courses in LA proper but my sense is most of the good courses are private
The private clubs that are filled with the ultra rich will just laugh at the added taxes ... but on the other end of things, with COVID proving many of us can work from anywhere, cities are going to be walking fine lines about overplaying their hands leading to large population departures
The crazy exclusive ones will exist forever. Most private ones aren’t that way as a whole. I can tell you from being on the budget committee of one that there is a lot of elasticity in the monthly dues. Dues go up and people try and sell. The ultra rich are happy to fund budget gaps themselves but their trade off request is to always reduce the membership numbers to make it even more exclusive.
1) The PGA should be moved if for no other reason than Trump’s name/presence will take the oxygen and focus from the event
2) It’s bad business for golf to retain the close ties to Trump particularly given that the sport is already viewed as highly elitist
3) It’s impossible to be affiliated with Trump after the actions of this week ... the fireworks are coming after he leaves office
1) You honestly think a year from now his name really is going to matter?
2) Viewed as elitist? Have you looked at the cost of a decent set of irons? The price of green fees for a decent 18 hole course? (I know I sound poor) Golf is as elitist as it gets. Been that way for over 100 years. That perception will never change.
3) People that watch and play golf won't change their opinion regardless.
1) Trump’s effectively trash as a brand going forward whether in business or politics ... there will be a fringe niche that will give him business but that’s it. His golf properties that are public will likely see dramatic revenue reductions forcing a sale. The private clubs will see an exodus of membership as the guilty by association is bad business for the members who have plenty to lose.
Politically I suspect there will be a number on the right that move more to the center and leave the far right on their own. Either the far right will have to adjust or the moderate left will get so pissed at the socialist arm of the Dems that you’ll get a 2nd spinoff where a merged centrist/moderate party is created with potentially more numbers than each of the polarized extremes.
2) I’m an avid golfer and I know the cost. I rarely buy anything in terms of balls or clothes at full price. Clubs can be hit or miss in terms of getting on sale vs full price (even at full price I get a full setting and often tax paid for). Plenty of golf deals out there if you know what you’re doing. Lots of programs out there for kids with the First Tee that eliminate some of the “country club” stigma. I grew up playing as much as I could and I promise you I’m far from an elitist. Cost of growing up playing baseball and hockey just as examples are far more expensive than golf. I don’t know the particulars with soccer but that wouldn’t surprise me either.
3) Not sure what you’re referencing about nothing will change but if you’re suggesting all golfers are Trump supporters that’s a very erroneous assumption
Golf stereotype is rich white Republicans
I don't really play (it's been four or five years) so that might have changed a bit, but I doubt it. I think this will piss off a lot of golfers.
If that was the case then why do you have so many that play on the West Coast?
Math and logic is hard
The 50 miles closest to the ocean of the West Coast isn't indicative of Murucuh
Pissing off millions of golfers is a good business strategy.
Just flat out wrong
It’s way beyond just pissing off golfers. Combined with Justin Thomas over the weekend, it just needs to stay off the woke radar. Local Government could really screw golf over with new property tax rules and environmental regulations.
Trump is just toxic at this point and the sooner he’s not on the radar for the masses the better ... don’t feel like going into huge detail on that
JT is an idiot ... so I think he meant anything malicious? Of course not. Do I think we would be well served to be reminded of a “sticks and stones ... but words will never hurt me” mindset? Yep. But everybody should be well aware of the environment you live in and this isn’t JT’s 1st dumbass comment. Comes with the territory.
Local government screwing over golf courses? Perhaps but I think it’s going to be much more localized and nuanced. Seattle for instance is going to go out of their way to shit on golf so that they can repurpose the land. Tacoma ain’t going to fuck with Chambers because that place prints money for them. Places like Bend aren’t going to shit on the tourist economy that props up the region.
I guess intuitively it could be fun to see the government get really nuanced in picking winners and losers in terms of taxes.
I’m was agreeing with you... There is no upside into fighting this battle, whether it’s just or not. By fighting, you are making golf itself a target for who knows what. I’m describing how golf could actually get cancelled if the mob wanted to do so.
There’s push in Seattle to turn the city owned public ones into drug shooting zones, but there have also been pushes in Seattle and LA at least to start assessing the private course property values differently. That’s how you would kill them.
Seattle’s a mess with respect to golf
They have the ability to leverage land to create their own version of Chambers Bay ... which is desperately needed ... but it’s easier to feed the narrative that golf is elitist and serves the select few.
I’ve seen first hand how you can make golf fun and enjoyable for non golfers creating relatively easy entry points into the game ... but whatever
In the end it’s much easier to have class warfare
I’m not super familiar with the public courses in LA proper but my sense is most of the good courses are private
The private clubs that are filled with the ultra rich will just laugh at the added taxes ... but on the other end of things, with COVID proving many of us can work from anywhere, cities are going to be walking fine lines about overplaying their hands leading to large population departures
The crazy exclusive ones will exist forever. Most private ones aren’t that way as a whole. I can tell you from being on the budget committee of one that there is a lot of elasticity in the monthly dues. Dues go up and people try and sell. The ultra rich are happy to fund budget gaps themselves but their trade off request is to always reduce the membership numbers to make it even more exclusive.
I am far from a private club snob ... it’s not my lane at all.
Closest thing I’ll ever come will be retirement living in a community whether Bend, Palm Springs, Scottsdale, etc where I have access to a private club. Even then the only thing that I will ever care about will be making sure I can get a tee time.
The thing about golf that I personally love as an aging try hard athlete is that it’s a game that will always challenge you. I don’t want to play the same course over and over ... that’s boring to me.
The reason that I’m a member of the Chambers Bay Golf Club ain’t because it’s bougie or whatever ... it’s because it’s the best, most challenging course in the area and I enjoy it immensely.
Pissing off millions of golfers is a good business strategy.
Just flat out wrong
It’s way beyond just pissing off golfers. Combined with Justin Thomas over the weekend, it just needs to stay off the woke radar. Local Government could really screw golf over with new property tax rules and environmental regulations.
Trump is just toxic at this point and the sooner he’s not on the radar for the masses the better ... don’t feel like going into huge detail on that
JT is an idiot ... so I think he meant anything malicious? Of course not. Do I think we would be well served to be reminded of a “sticks and stones ... but words will never hurt me” mindset? Yep. But everybody should be well aware of the environment you live in and this isn’t JT’s 1st dumbass comment. Comes with the territory.
Local government screwing over golf courses? Perhaps but I think it’s going to be much more localized and nuanced. Seattle for instance is going to go out of their way to shit on golf so that they can repurpose the land. Tacoma ain’t going to fuck with Chambers because that place prints money for them. Places like Bend aren’t going to shit on the tourist economy that props up the region.
I guess intuitively it could be fun to see the government get really nuanced in picking winners and losers in terms of taxes.
I’m was agreeing with you... There is no upside into fighting this battle, whether it’s just or not. By fighting, you are making golf itself a target for who knows what. I’m describing how golf could actually get cancelled if the mob wanted to do so.
There’s push in Seattle to turn the city owned public ones into drug shooting zones, but there have also been pushes in Seattle and LA at least to start assessing the private course property values differently. That’s how you would kill them.
Seattle’s a mess with respect to golf
They have the ability to leverage land to create their own version of Chambers Bay ... which is desperately needed ... but it’s easier to feed the narrative that golf is elitist and serves the select few.
I’ve seen first hand how you can make golf fun and enjoyable for non golfers creating relatively easy entry points into the game ... but whatever
In the end it’s much easier to have class warfare
I’m not super familiar with the public courses in LA proper but my sense is most of the good courses are private
The private clubs that are filled with the ultra rich will just laugh at the added taxes ... but on the other end of things, with COVID proving many of us can work from anywhere, cities are going to be walking fine lines about overplaying their hands leading to large population departures
The crazy exclusive ones will exist forever. Most private ones aren’t that way as a whole. I can tell you from being on the budget committee of one that there is a lot of elasticity in the monthly dues. Dues go up and people try and sell. The ultra rich are happy to fund budget gaps themselves but their trade off request is to always reduce the membership numbers to make it even more exclusive.
I am far from a private club snob ... it’s not my lane at all.
Closest thing I’ll ever come will be retirement living in a community whether Bend, Palm Springs, Scottsdale, etc where I have access to a private club. Even then the only thing that I will ever care about will be making sure I can get a tee time.
The thing about golf that I personally love as an aging try hard athlete is that it’s a game that will always challenge you. I don’t want to play the same course over and over ... that’s boring to me.
The reason that I’m a member of the Chambers Bay Golf Club ain’t because it’s bougie or whatever ... it’s because it’s the best, most challenging course in the area and I enjoy it immensely.
I hear you on Chambers. I used to play all over and enjoyed it, then had kids and it’s too hard to set your schedule in advance. Kind of forces you to go close to home private if you want to play.
Comments
The big problem with the current City courses is that they are largely unprofitable (partly because of effectively fees/royalties added onto each facility). The ranges are good money makers based on available space but there aren’t a ton of them in the area.
If the City was to repurpose the existing courses (leaving the ranges at Interbay, Jefferson, and Jackson) and create a higher end 36 hole facility that was more of a destination (leveraging the Chambers model) then the City would find itself far more profitable while also satisfying the needs of the community
Closest thing I’ll ever come will be retirement living in a community whether Bend, Palm Springs, Scottsdale, etc where I have access to a private club. Even then the only thing that I will ever care about will be making sure I can get a tee time.
The thing about golf that I personally love as an aging try hard athlete is that it’s a game that will always challenge you. I don’t want to play the same course over and over ... that’s boring to me.
The reason that I’m a member of the Chambers Bay Golf Club ain’t because it’s bougie or whatever ... it’s because it’s the best, most challenging course in the area and I enjoy it immensely.