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Salem, OR vs Seattle
Comments
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Still wants to deflect from his proposal.HHusky said:
Deflect? Funny, I don't see you proposing anything on the topic of homelessness.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Deflect deflect deflect. If you were funnier I'd think you were one of J's alts attempting to mimic a bad attorney.HHusky said:
Actually, Jesus said something like that too. I quoted it above. Race told Him to fuck off.UW_Doog_Bot said:HHusky said:
Isn't the biggest problem with society's current approach the decentralization and lack of uniformity between approaches? As GreenRiver said, a single, federal approach would be better. As things stand, some cities "solve" the problem by buying the homeless bus tickets to Seattle and SF. And I am torn when I give to local homelessness charities, because there is a free rider issue; if some communities are charitable and others aren't, the ones that are will end up bearing more than their share of the burdens.Doogles said:
Stop giving away millions of "free" needles. Off top no google like pump, SF spent over 50 million last year on cleaning up human feces.HHusky said:
Substance abuse and mental health problems are certainly involved. (The cause and effect relationship between those conditions and homelessness probably runs in both directions, depending on the individual.) So do you think mentally ill people can just decide to stop being mentally ill? Substance abuse can be treated, but it's a long process and not inexpensive. Any proposed solutions besides not "enabling" the homeless? Whatever that means.Doogles said:Nobody is homeless because they can no longer afford the 5k a month mortgage. I'd be homeless too if I refused to pay rent and live anywhere but Malibu on the ocean.
It almost always boils down to substance abuse and mental health. Enablement is the cruelest killer.
You need to reopen mental health facilities, i like the idea of a tiered system. If people are cited enough, you take them out of society and evaluate where they are at. If they are insane you go from there, if they are showing rehabilitation you move them along to the next level, until you get them to a point to return to society.
The amount of money being spent on the homeless problem while it only gets worse is proof it's not working. Giving safe zones and encampments only encourages antisocial behavior while killing the value of surrounding property and business.
It may seem inhumane on the surface, but the faster people hit their bottom the better. They need to get wrecked to realize it's not working. Accept reality you can't save everyone.
The sad truth is a lot of people need to die so others can live. People are going to get blood born disease using dirty needles, clean needles, fucking for dope, etc. Enforcing consequences for actions shouldn't be viewed as a negative.
I was a pretty high bottom guy, functioning making 6-figs, but always on the verge of snapping. I hang out and help homeless, former homeless, pretty much everyday now for two years.
They would have all been happy hooked up to a slow drip, drooling out the side of their mouths for eternity if you let them. I used to give the bum begging for change fives all the time. I don't give them a cent anymore, i'll toss them food that's it. The stories i hear and the things i've seen have opened my eyes to the reality you need these people to fail spectacularly for them to change.
Societies current approach is akin to the classic story of the loving mother giving her obvious junkie son another 20, and another 20, and another 20, and where is the TV?, but he's a good boy so here's another 20...this is not a winning strategy and it hurts all parties involved in the most destructive, painful, and drawn out way imaginable.
Imposing deadly consequences for addiction is a bridge too far for me. Addiction is not merely a behavioral issue. Clean needles are the bandaid you apply when treatment is too expensive and/or unavailable. I'd prefer we provided treatment. But it's spendy. Same with mental illness.
Remembers comrade, the wars on poverty never ends!
Why must we atheists always do the Lord's work?
No, no, please do go on about how a massive federal program for housing? would successfully solve homelessness... -
The poor are disproportionately hurt by left policies that jack up energy and housing pricesMikeDamone said:
The "poor" aren't homeless. HTHHHusky said:"The poor you will always have with you."
Those who wanted to see an end to boardinghouses and flophouses, and also want to limit or curtail publicly subsidized housing, didn't leave the poor--especially the single poor--a lot of alternatives. And charity raises the NIMBY cries too.
Salem rents are only low relative to Seattle, Portland, SF and LA. And supply?
Dumbfucks like H support those policies -
Okay. Just so we're clear, the TugCon position is that we shouldn't help the homeless ('cuz that's Communism) and it would be better if they just all died of a virus ('cuz they're unpleasant to look at and they leave a mess). Why not just euthanize them? It's quick and humane and the cities will look a lot cleaner.Doogles said:
I did not see it was responding to you, but the idea society would be better off if the rona wiped out the homeless is not wrong.salemcoog said:
Et tu DooglesThomasFremont said:
Look, I’m. It saying I want it to happen. But if you and all your homeless friends got the Rona and died, society would be better off.salemcoog said: -
I guess I grow tired of having my hard-earned money taken by people like Jay Inslee and Pramila Jayapal to pay for the shitty Life choices made by others. Feel free to call me a heartless monster, but it is not my fault that you decided to eat yourself into morbid obesity and all of the health problems that come along with that, or that you decided to try heroin in your 20s and now the party is over because AIDS and Hep C are kicking down doors in your internal organs at age 35. I didn’t enable your crippling alcoholism or pill addiction. In fact, the people that think Medicare for all is the answer to our healthcare spending issues, or that a clean needle exchange 2 blocks from Westlake Park is more important than the health of the surrounding businesses are the ones enabling your sloth/drug addiction/alcoholism, so maybe they should pay for all of these Tin Pot exercises in sociological masturbation to try and fix them.
Mental health is another issue altogether, and I am actually in favor of more resources allocated to those in need. That said, if you take a shit in the middle of 7th and Pine downtown, your ass should go to jail for a few days and you can detox from your White China skag in an 8x10. If my tax dollars are going to pay for you to eat and sleep somewhere, it may as well be where I don’t have to fucking see it or walk in it. -
How's wishing it would go away working?UW_Doog_Bot said:
Still wants to deflect from his proposal.HHusky said:
Deflect? Funny, I don't see you proposing anything on the topic of homelessness.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Deflect deflect deflect. If you were funnier I'd think you were one of J's alts attempting to mimic a bad attorney.HHusky said:
Actually, Jesus said something like that too. I quoted it above. Race told Him to fuck off.UW_Doog_Bot said:HHusky said:
Isn't the biggest problem with society's current approach the decentralization and lack of uniformity between approaches? As GreenRiver said, a single, federal approach would be better. As things stand, some cities "solve" the problem by buying the homeless bus tickets to Seattle and SF. And I am torn when I give to local homelessness charities, because there is a free rider issue; if some communities are charitable and others aren't, the ones that are will end up bearing more than their share of the burdens.Doogles said:
Stop giving away millions of "free" needles. Off top no google like pump, SF spent over 50 million last year on cleaning up human feces.HHusky said:
Substance abuse and mental health problems are certainly involved. (The cause and effect relationship between those conditions and homelessness probably runs in both directions, depending on the individual.) So do you think mentally ill people can just decide to stop being mentally ill? Substance abuse can be treated, but it's a long process and not inexpensive. Any proposed solutions besides not "enabling" the homeless? Whatever that means.Doogles said:Nobody is homeless because they can no longer afford the 5k a month mortgage. I'd be homeless too if I refused to pay rent and live anywhere but Malibu on the ocean.
It almost always boils down to substance abuse and mental health. Enablement is the cruelest killer.
You need to reopen mental health facilities, i like the idea of a tiered system. If people are cited enough, you take them out of society and evaluate where they are at. If they are insane you go from there, if they are showing rehabilitation you move them along to the next level, until you get them to a point to return to society.
The amount of money being spent on the homeless problem while it only gets worse is proof it's not working. Giving safe zones and encampments only encourages antisocial behavior while killing the value of surrounding property and business.
It may seem inhumane on the surface, but the faster people hit their bottom the better. They need to get wrecked to realize it's not working. Accept reality you can't save everyone.
The sad truth is a lot of people need to die so others can live. People are going to get blood born disease using dirty needles, clean needles, fucking for dope, etc. Enforcing consequences for actions shouldn't be viewed as a negative.
I was a pretty high bottom guy, functioning making 6-figs, but always on the verge of snapping. I hang out and help homeless, former homeless, pretty much everyday now for two years.
They would have all been happy hooked up to a slow drip, drooling out the side of their mouths for eternity if you let them. I used to give the bum begging for change fives all the time. I don't give them a cent anymore, i'll toss them food that's it. The stories i hear and the things i've seen have opened my eyes to the reality you need these people to fail spectacularly for them to change.
Societies current approach is akin to the classic story of the loving mother giving her obvious junkie son another 20, and another 20, and another 20, and where is the TV?, but he's a good boy so here's another 20...this is not a winning strategy and it hurts all parties involved in the most destructive, painful, and drawn out way imaginable.
Imposing deadly consequences for addiction is a bridge too far for me. Addiction is not merely a behavioral issue. Clean needles are the bandaid you apply when treatment is too expensive and/or unavailable. I'd prefer we provided treatment. But it's spendy. Same with mental illness.
Remembers comrade, the wars on poverty never ends!
Why must we atheists always do the Lord's work?
No, no, please do go on about how a massive federal program for housing? would successfully solve homelessness... -
Still nothing on your position? Seems like a really well flushed out idea and policy.HHusky said:
How's wishing it would go away working?UW_Doog_Bot said:
Still wants to deflect from his proposal.HHusky said:
Deflect? Funny, I don't see you proposing anything on the topic of homelessness.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Deflect deflect deflect. If you were funnier I'd think you were one of J's alts attempting to mimic a bad attorney.HHusky said:
Actually, Jesus said something like that too. I quoted it above. Race told Him to fuck off.UW_Doog_Bot said:HHusky said:
Isn't the biggest problem with society's current approach the decentralization and lack of uniformity between approaches? As GreenRiver said, a single, federal approach would be better. As things stand, some cities "solve" the problem by buying the homeless bus tickets to Seattle and SF. And I am torn when I give to local homelessness charities, because there is a free rider issue; if some communities are charitable and others aren't, the ones that are will end up bearing more than their share of the burdens.Doogles said:
Stop giving away millions of "free" needles. Off top no google like pump, SF spent over 50 million last year on cleaning up human feces.HHusky said:
Substance abuse and mental health problems are certainly involved. (The cause and effect relationship between those conditions and homelessness probably runs in both directions, depending on the individual.) So do you think mentally ill people can just decide to stop being mentally ill? Substance abuse can be treated, but it's a long process and not inexpensive. Any proposed solutions besides not "enabling" the homeless? Whatever that means.Doogles said:Nobody is homeless because they can no longer afford the 5k a month mortgage. I'd be homeless too if I refused to pay rent and live anywhere but Malibu on the ocean.
It almost always boils down to substance abuse and mental health. Enablement is the cruelest killer.
You need to reopen mental health facilities, i like the idea of a tiered system. If people are cited enough, you take them out of society and evaluate where they are at. If they are insane you go from there, if they are showing rehabilitation you move them along to the next level, until you get them to a point to return to society.
The amount of money being spent on the homeless problem while it only gets worse is proof it's not working. Giving safe zones and encampments only encourages antisocial behavior while killing the value of surrounding property and business.
It may seem inhumane on the surface, but the faster people hit their bottom the better. They need to get wrecked to realize it's not working. Accept reality you can't save everyone.
The sad truth is a lot of people need to die so others can live. People are going to get blood born disease using dirty needles, clean needles, fucking for dope, etc. Enforcing consequences for actions shouldn't be viewed as a negative.
I was a pretty high bottom guy, functioning making 6-figs, but always on the verge of snapping. I hang out and help homeless, former homeless, pretty much everyday now for two years.
They would have all been happy hooked up to a slow drip, drooling out the side of their mouths for eternity if you let them. I used to give the bum begging for change fives all the time. I don't give them a cent anymore, i'll toss them food that's it. The stories i hear and the things i've seen have opened my eyes to the reality you need these people to fail spectacularly for them to change.
Societies current approach is akin to the classic story of the loving mother giving her obvious junkie son another 20, and another 20, and another 20, and where is the TV?, but he's a good boy so here's another 20...this is not a winning strategy and it hurts all parties involved in the most destructive, painful, and drawn out way imaginable.
Imposing deadly consequences for addiction is a bridge too far for me. Addiction is not merely a behavioral issue. Clean needles are the bandaid you apply when treatment is too expensive and/or unavailable. I'd prefer we provided treatment. But it's spendy. Same with mental illness.
Remembers comrade, the wars on poverty never ends!
Why must we atheists always do the Lord's work?
No, no, please do go on about how a massive federal program for housing? would successfully solve homelessness... -
You’re still here but we’re willing to LIPO.HHusky said:
How's wishing it would go away working?UW_Doog_Bot said:
Still wants to deflect from his proposal.HHusky said:
Deflect? Funny, I don't see you proposing anything on the topic of homelessness.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Deflect deflect deflect. If you were funnier I'd think you were one of J's alts attempting to mimic a bad attorney.HHusky said:
Actually, Jesus said something like that too. I quoted it above. Race told Him to fuck off.UW_Doog_Bot said:HHusky said:
Isn't the biggest problem with society's current approach the decentralization and lack of uniformity between approaches? As GreenRiver said, a single, federal approach would be better. As things stand, some cities "solve" the problem by buying the homeless bus tickets to Seattle and SF. And I am torn when I give to local homelessness charities, because there is a free rider issue; if some communities are charitable and others aren't, the ones that are will end up bearing more than their share of the burdens.Doogles said:
Stop giving away millions of "free" needles. Off top no google like pump, SF spent over 50 million last year on cleaning up human feces.HHusky said:
Substance abuse and mental health problems are certainly involved. (The cause and effect relationship between those conditions and homelessness probably runs in both directions, depending on the individual.) So do you think mentally ill people can just decide to stop being mentally ill? Substance abuse can be treated, but it's a long process and not inexpensive. Any proposed solutions besides not "enabling" the homeless? Whatever that means.Doogles said:Nobody is homeless because they can no longer afford the 5k a month mortgage. I'd be homeless too if I refused to pay rent and live anywhere but Malibu on the ocean.
It almost always boils down to substance abuse and mental health. Enablement is the cruelest killer.
You need to reopen mental health facilities, i like the idea of a tiered system. If people are cited enough, you take them out of society and evaluate where they are at. If they are insane you go from there, if they are showing rehabilitation you move them along to the next level, until you get them to a point to return to society.
The amount of money being spent on the homeless problem while it only gets worse is proof it's not working. Giving safe zones and encampments only encourages antisocial behavior while killing the value of surrounding property and business.
It may seem inhumane on the surface, but the faster people hit their bottom the better. They need to get wrecked to realize it's not working. Accept reality you can't save everyone.
The sad truth is a lot of people need to die so others can live. People are going to get blood born disease using dirty needles, clean needles, fucking for dope, etc. Enforcing consequences for actions shouldn't be viewed as a negative.
I was a pretty high bottom guy, functioning making 6-figs, but always on the verge of snapping. I hang out and help homeless, former homeless, pretty much everyday now for two years.
They would have all been happy hooked up to a slow drip, drooling out the side of their mouths for eternity if you let them. I used to give the bum begging for change fives all the time. I don't give them a cent anymore, i'll toss them food that's it. The stories i hear and the things i've seen have opened my eyes to the reality you need these people to fail spectacularly for them to change.
Societies current approach is akin to the classic story of the loving mother giving her obvious junkie son another 20, and another 20, and another 20, and where is the TV?, but he's a good boy so here's another 20...this is not a winning strategy and it hurts all parties involved in the most destructive, painful, and drawn out way imaginable.
Imposing deadly consequences for addiction is a bridge too far for me. Addiction is not merely a behavioral issue. Clean needles are the bandaid you apply when treatment is too expensive and/or unavailable. I'd prefer we provided treatment. But it's spendy. Same with mental illness.
Remembers comrade, the wars on poverty never ends!
Why must we atheists always do the Lord's work?
No, no, please do go on about how a massive federal program for housing? would successfully solve homelessness... -
"left wing" policies are the main drivers of housing prices? Gonna need you to flesh that argument out a bit.RaceBannon said:
The poor are disproportionately hurt by left policies that jack up energy and housing pricesMikeDamone said:
The "poor" aren't homeless. HTHHHusky said:"The poor you will always have with you."
Those who wanted to see an end to boardinghouses and flophouses, and also want to limit or curtail publicly subsidized housing, didn't leave the poor--especially the single poor--a lot of alternatives. And charity raises the NIMBY cries too.
Salem rents are only low relative to Seattle, Portland, SF and LA. And supply?
Dumbfucks like H support those policies
Most of them aren't homeless.MikeDamone said:
The "poor" aren't homeless. HTHHHusky said:"The poor you will always have with you."
Those who wanted to see an end to boardinghouses and flophouses, and also want to limit or curtail publicly subsidized housing, didn't leave the poor--especially the single poor--a lot of alternatives. And charity raises the NIMBY cries too.
Salem rents are only low relative to Seattle, Portland, SF and LA. And supply?
How many of the homeless aren't poor though? -
WWJTTFO?RaceBannon said:
Fuck off theocratHHusky said:
Actually, Jesus said something like that too. I quoted it above. Race told Him to fuck off.UW_Doog_Bot said:HHusky said:
Isn't the biggest problem with society's current approach the decentralization and lack of uniformity between approaches? As GreenRiver said, a single, federal approach would be better. As things stand, some cities "solve" the problem by buying the homeless bus tickets to Seattle and SF. And I am torn when I give to local homelessness charities, because there is a free rider issue; if some communities are charitable and others aren't, the ones that are will end up bearing more than their share of the burdens.Doogles said:
Stop giving away millions of "free" needles. Off top no google like pump, SF spent over 50 million last year on cleaning up human feces.HHusky said:
Substance abuse and mental health problems are certainly involved. (The cause and effect relationship between those conditions and homelessness probably runs in both directions, depending on the individual.) So do you think mentally ill people can just decide to stop being mentally ill? Substance abuse can be treated, but it's a long process and not inexpensive. Any proposed solutions besides not "enabling" the homeless? Whatever that means.Doogles said:Nobody is homeless because they can no longer afford the 5k a month mortgage. I'd be homeless too if I refused to pay rent and live anywhere but Malibu on the ocean.
It almost always boils down to substance abuse and mental health. Enablement is the cruelest killer.
You need to reopen mental health facilities, i like the idea of a tiered system. If people are cited enough, you take them out of society and evaluate where they are at. If they are insane you go from there, if they are showing rehabilitation you move them along to the next level, until you get them to a point to return to society.
The amount of money being spent on the homeless problem while it only gets worse is proof it's not working. Giving safe zones and encampments only encourages antisocial behavior while killing the value of surrounding property and business.
It may seem inhumane on the surface, but the faster people hit their bottom the better. They need to get wrecked to realize it's not working. Accept reality you can't save everyone.
The sad truth is a lot of people need to die so others can live. People are going to get blood born disease using dirty needles, clean needles, fucking for dope, etc. Enforcing consequences for actions shouldn't be viewed as a negative.
I was a pretty high bottom guy, functioning making 6-figs, but always on the verge of snapping. I hang out and help homeless, former homeless, pretty much everyday now for two years.
They would have all been happy hooked up to a slow drip, drooling out the side of their mouths for eternity if you let them. I used to give the bum begging for change fives all the time. I don't give them a cent anymore, i'll toss them food that's it. The stories i hear and the things i've seen have opened my eyes to the reality you need these people to fail spectacularly for them to change.
Societies current approach is akin to the classic story of the loving mother giving her obvious junkie son another 20, and another 20, and another 20, and where is the TV?, but he's a good boy so here's another 20...this is not a winning strategy and it hurts all parties involved in the most destructive, painful, and drawn out way imaginable.
Imposing deadly consequences for addiction is a bridge too far for me. Addiction is not merely a behavioral issue. Clean needles are the bandaid you apply when treatment is too expensive and/or unavailable. I'd prefer we provided treatment. But it's spendy. Same with mental illness.
Remembers comrade, the wars on poverty never ends!
Why must we atheists always do the Lord's work? -
HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
-
Your critique of my position is that poverty may still exist even with governmental involvement. If you want to make better the enemy of perfection, that's your issue. Most of us like better.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Still nothing on your position? Seems like a really well flushed out idea and policy.HHusky said:
How's wishing it would go away working?UW_Doog_Bot said:
Still wants to deflect from his proposal.HHusky said:
Deflect? Funny, I don't see you proposing anything on the topic of homelessness.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Deflect deflect deflect. If you were funnier I'd think you were one of J's alts attempting to mimic a bad attorney.HHusky said:
Actually, Jesus said something like that too. I quoted it above. Race told Him to fuck off.UW_Doog_Bot said:HHusky said:
Isn't the biggest problem with society's current approach the decentralization and lack of uniformity between approaches? As GreenRiver said, a single, federal approach would be better. As things stand, some cities "solve" the problem by buying the homeless bus tickets to Seattle and SF. And I am torn when I give to local homelessness charities, because there is a free rider issue; if some communities are charitable and others aren't, the ones that are will end up bearing more than their share of the burdens.Doogles said:
Stop giving away millions of "free" needles. Off top no google like pump, SF spent over 50 million last year on cleaning up human feces.HHusky said:
Substance abuse and mental health problems are certainly involved. (The cause and effect relationship between those conditions and homelessness probably runs in both directions, depending on the individual.) So do you think mentally ill people can just decide to stop being mentally ill? Substance abuse can be treated, but it's a long process and not inexpensive. Any proposed solutions besides not "enabling" the homeless? Whatever that means.Doogles said:Nobody is homeless because they can no longer afford the 5k a month mortgage. I'd be homeless too if I refused to pay rent and live anywhere but Malibu on the ocean.
It almost always boils down to substance abuse and mental health. Enablement is the cruelest killer.
You need to reopen mental health facilities, i like the idea of a tiered system. If people are cited enough, you take them out of society and evaluate where they are at. If they are insane you go from there, if they are showing rehabilitation you move them along to the next level, until you get them to a point to return to society.
The amount of money being spent on the homeless problem while it only gets worse is proof it's not working. Giving safe zones and encampments only encourages antisocial behavior while killing the value of surrounding property and business.
It may seem inhumane on the surface, but the faster people hit their bottom the better. They need to get wrecked to realize it's not working. Accept reality you can't save everyone.
The sad truth is a lot of people need to die so others can live. People are going to get blood born disease using dirty needles, clean needles, fucking for dope, etc. Enforcing consequences for actions shouldn't be viewed as a negative.
I was a pretty high bottom guy, functioning making 6-figs, but always on the verge of snapping. I hang out and help homeless, former homeless, pretty much everyday now for two years.
They would have all been happy hooked up to a slow drip, drooling out the side of their mouths for eternity if you let them. I used to give the bum begging for change fives all the time. I don't give them a cent anymore, i'll toss them food that's it. The stories i hear and the things i've seen have opened my eyes to the reality you need these people to fail spectacularly for them to change.
Societies current approach is akin to the classic story of the loving mother giving her obvious junkie son another 20, and another 20, and another 20, and where is the TV?, but he's a good boy so here's another 20...this is not a winning strategy and it hurts all parties involved in the most destructive, painful, and drawn out way imaginable.
Imposing deadly consequences for addiction is a bridge too far for me. Addiction is not merely a behavioral issue. Clean needles are the bandaid you apply when treatment is too expensive and/or unavailable. I'd prefer we provided treatment. But it's spendy. Same with mental illness.
Remembers comrade, the wars on poverty never ends!
Why must we atheists always do the Lord's work?
No, no, please do go on about how a massive federal program for housing? would successfully solve homelessness... -
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
-
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass. -
I think HH needs to be a pro bono homeless/vagrant attorney.
That would ensure their demise!
The vast majority of these people live this way by choice! I dealt with them for nearly 30 years. They want to be there. For those that don't there is lots of help available. -
Get a $12 and hour minimum wage. Get two room mates that make $12 hour. Work 160 hours a month x 3 x 12 = $5,760 a month. Plenty to pay for a crappy apartment in Salem or Tacoma. Your poor but not homeless. If you are homeless, that's a choice if your aren't mentally ill or physically disable. This was pre-lockdown. You can thank the leftards for that.
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Move to Iran if you want a theocracyHHusky said:
WWJTTFO?RaceBannon said:
Fuck off theocratHHusky said:
Actually, Jesus said something like that too. I quoted it above. Race told Him to fuck off.UW_Doog_Bot said:HHusky said:
Isn't the biggest problem with society's current approach the decentralization and lack of uniformity between approaches? As GreenRiver said, a single, federal approach would be better. As things stand, some cities "solve" the problem by buying the homeless bus tickets to Seattle and SF. And I am torn when I give to local homelessness charities, because there is a free rider issue; if some communities are charitable and others aren't, the ones that are will end up bearing more than their share of the burdens.Doogles said:
Stop giving away millions of "free" needles. Off top no google like pump, SF spent over 50 million last year on cleaning up human feces.HHusky said:
Substance abuse and mental health problems are certainly involved. (The cause and effect relationship between those conditions and homelessness probably runs in both directions, depending on the individual.) So do you think mentally ill people can just decide to stop being mentally ill? Substance abuse can be treated, but it's a long process and not inexpensive. Any proposed solutions besides not "enabling" the homeless? Whatever that means.Doogles said:Nobody is homeless because they can no longer afford the 5k a month mortgage. I'd be homeless too if I refused to pay rent and live anywhere but Malibu on the ocean.
It almost always boils down to substance abuse and mental health. Enablement is the cruelest killer.
You need to reopen mental health facilities, i like the idea of a tiered system. If people are cited enough, you take them out of society and evaluate where they are at. If they are insane you go from there, if they are showing rehabilitation you move them along to the next level, until you get them to a point to return to society.
The amount of money being spent on the homeless problem while it only gets worse is proof it's not working. Giving safe zones and encampments only encourages antisocial behavior while killing the value of surrounding property and business.
It may seem inhumane on the surface, but the faster people hit their bottom the better. They need to get wrecked to realize it's not working. Accept reality you can't save everyone.
The sad truth is a lot of people need to die so others can live. People are going to get blood born disease using dirty needles, clean needles, fucking for dope, etc. Enforcing consequences for actions shouldn't be viewed as a negative.
I was a pretty high bottom guy, functioning making 6-figs, but always on the verge of snapping. I hang out and help homeless, former homeless, pretty much everyday now for two years.
They would have all been happy hooked up to a slow drip, drooling out the side of their mouths for eternity if you let them. I used to give the bum begging for change fives all the time. I don't give them a cent anymore, i'll toss them food that's it. The stories i hear and the things i've seen have opened my eyes to the reality you need these people to fail spectacularly for them to change.
Societies current approach is akin to the classic story of the loving mother giving her obvious junkie son another 20, and another 20, and another 20, and where is the TV?, but he's a good boy so here's another 20...this is not a winning strategy and it hurts all parties involved in the most destructive, painful, and drawn out way imaginable.
Imposing deadly consequences for addiction is a bridge too far for me. Addiction is not merely a behavioral issue. Clean needles are the bandaid you apply when treatment is too expensive and/or unavailable. I'd prefer we provided treatment. But it's spendy. Same with mental illness.
Remembers comrade, the wars on poverty never ends!
Why must we atheists always do the Lord's work? -
You wouldn't follow it any better than the last 23 timesHHusky said:
"left wing" policies are the main drivers of housing prices? Gonna need you to flesh that argument out a bit.RaceBannon said:
The poor are disproportionately hurt by left policies that jack up energy and housing pricesMikeDamone said:
The "poor" aren't homeless. HTHHHusky said:"The poor you will always have with you."
Those who wanted to see an end to boardinghouses and flophouses, and also want to limit or curtail publicly subsidized housing, didn't leave the poor--especially the single poor--a lot of alternatives. And charity raises the NIMBY cries too.
Salem rents are only low relative to Seattle, Portland, SF and LA. And supply?
Dumbfucks like H support those policies
Most of them aren't homeless.MikeDamone said:
The "poor" aren't homeless. HTHHHusky said:"The poor you will always have with you."
Those who wanted to see an end to boardinghouses and flophouses, and also want to limit or curtail publicly subsidized housing, didn't leave the poor--especially the single poor--a lot of alternatives. And charity raises the NIMBY cries too.
Salem rents are only low relative to Seattle, Portland, SF and LA. And supply?
How many of the homeless aren't poor though?
That's why you vote for morons -
I vote we start throwing poo at them
I've got just the guy for it. He walks by our building all the time. He's affectionately known as shitbeard -
So you don't want any solution to homelessness that costs you any money; presumably looking at them and stepping over them is still a burden you'll bear if the alternative is spending money. blob wants to increase police and jail budgets to warehouse them, so you disagree with one another. Doogles is hoping they just die or are cured of homelessness spontaneously. Gasbag wants them, three at a time no less, to interview for jobs and immediately work full time, while homeless, convince a landlord to let (the three of) them take the lease, while homeless, and provide the landlord the references, credit scores, background checks and deposits required in order to make that case. Race and Doog are just concerned that any governmental role--outside of jailing them--is almost certain to lead us to Communism.thechatch said:
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass.
But you are willing to let me keep giving to various charities. Awesome! Thanks!
-
And there's the misrepresentation of the opposition.HHusky said:
Your critique of my position is that poverty may still exist even with governmental involvement. If you want to make better the enemy of perfection, that's your issue. Most of us like better.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Still nothing on your position? Seems like a really well flushed out idea and policy.HHusky said:
How's wishing it would go away working?UW_Doog_Bot said:
Still wants to deflect from his proposal.HHusky said:
Deflect? Funny, I don't see you proposing anything on the topic of homelessness.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Deflect deflect deflect. If you were funnier I'd think you were one of J's alts attempting to mimic a bad attorney.HHusky said:
Actually, Jesus said something like that too. I quoted it above. Race told Him to fuck off.UW_Doog_Bot said:HHusky said:
Isn't the biggest problem with society's current approach the decentralization and lack of uniformity between approaches? As GreenRiver said, a single, federal approach would be better. As things stand, some cities "solve" the problem by buying the homeless bus tickets to Seattle and SF. And I am torn when I give to local homelessness charities, because there is a free rider issue; if some communities are charitable and others aren't, the ones that are will end up bearing more than their share of the burdens.Doogles said:
Stop giving away millions of "free" needles. Off top no google like pump, SF spent over 50 million last year on cleaning up human feces.HHusky said:
Substance abuse and mental health problems are certainly involved. (The cause and effect relationship between those conditions and homelessness probably runs in both directions, depending on the individual.) So do you think mentally ill people can just decide to stop being mentally ill? Substance abuse can be treated, but it's a long process and not inexpensive. Any proposed solutions besides not "enabling" the homeless? Whatever that means.Doogles said:Nobody is homeless because they can no longer afford the 5k a month mortgage. I'd be homeless too if I refused to pay rent and live anywhere but Malibu on the ocean.
It almost always boils down to substance abuse and mental health. Enablement is the cruelest killer.
You need to reopen mental health facilities, i like the idea of a tiered system. If people are cited enough, you take them out of society and evaluate where they are at. If they are insane you go from there, if they are showing rehabilitation you move them along to the next level, until you get them to a point to return to society.
The amount of money being spent on the homeless problem while it only gets worse is proof it's not working. Giving safe zones and encampments only encourages antisocial behavior while killing the value of surrounding property and business.
It may seem inhumane on the surface, but the faster people hit their bottom the better. They need to get wrecked to realize it's not working. Accept reality you can't save everyone.
The sad truth is a lot of people need to die so others can live. People are going to get blood born disease using dirty needles, clean needles, fucking for dope, etc. Enforcing consequences for actions shouldn't be viewed as a negative.
I was a pretty high bottom guy, functioning making 6-figs, but always on the verge of snapping. I hang out and help homeless, former homeless, pretty much everyday now for two years.
They would have all been happy hooked up to a slow drip, drooling out the side of their mouths for eternity if you let them. I used to give the bum begging for change fives all the time. I don't give them a cent anymore, i'll toss them food that's it. The stories i hear and the things i've seen have opened my eyes to the reality you need these people to fail spectacularly for them to change.
Societies current approach is akin to the classic story of the loving mother giving her obvious junkie son another 20, and another 20, and another 20, and where is the TV?, but he's a good boy so here's another 20...this is not a winning strategy and it hurts all parties involved in the most destructive, painful, and drawn out way imaginable.
Imposing deadly consequences for addiction is a bridge too far for me. Addiction is not merely a behavioral issue. Clean needles are the bandaid you apply when treatment is too expensive and/or unavailable. I'd prefer we provided treatment. But it's spendy. Same with mental illness.
Remembers comrade, the wars on poverty never ends!
Why must we atheists always do the Lord's work?
No, no, please do go on about how a massive federal program for housing? would successfully solve homelessness...
You still haven't expanded on anything. -
I'm sorry. You're right. You attached a picture too.UW_Doog_Bot said:
And there's the misrepresentation of the opposition.HHusky said:
Your critique of my position is that poverty may still exist even with governmental involvement. If you want to make better the enemy of perfection, that's your issue. Most of us like better.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Still nothing on your position? Seems like a really well flushed out idea and policy.HHusky said:
How's wishing it would go away working?UW_Doog_Bot said:
Still wants to deflect from his proposal.HHusky said:
Deflect? Funny, I don't see you proposing anything on the topic of homelessness.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Deflect deflect deflect. If you were funnier I'd think you were one of J's alts attempting to mimic a bad attorney.HHusky said:
Actually, Jesus said something like that too. I quoted it above. Race told Him to fuck off.UW_Doog_Bot said:HHusky said:
Isn't the biggest problem with society's current approach the decentralization and lack of uniformity between approaches? As GreenRiver said, a single, federal approach would be better. As things stand, some cities "solve" the problem by buying the homeless bus tickets to Seattle and SF. And I am torn when I give to local homelessness charities, because there is a free rider issue; if some communities are charitable and others aren't, the ones that are will end up bearing more than their share of the burdens.Doogles said:
Stop giving away millions of "free" needles. Off top no google like pump, SF spent over 50 million last year on cleaning up human feces.HHusky said:
Substance abuse and mental health problems are certainly involved. (The cause and effect relationship between those conditions and homelessness probably runs in both directions, depending on the individual.) So do you think mentally ill people can just decide to stop being mentally ill? Substance abuse can be treated, but it's a long process and not inexpensive. Any proposed solutions besides not "enabling" the homeless? Whatever that means.Doogles said:Nobody is homeless because they can no longer afford the 5k a month mortgage. I'd be homeless too if I refused to pay rent and live anywhere but Malibu on the ocean.
It almost always boils down to substance abuse and mental health. Enablement is the cruelest killer.
You need to reopen mental health facilities, i like the idea of a tiered system. If people are cited enough, you take them out of society and evaluate where they are at. If they are insane you go from there, if they are showing rehabilitation you move them along to the next level, until you get them to a point to return to society.
The amount of money being spent on the homeless problem while it only gets worse is proof it's not working. Giving safe zones and encampments only encourages antisocial behavior while killing the value of surrounding property and business.
It may seem inhumane on the surface, but the faster people hit their bottom the better. They need to get wrecked to realize it's not working. Accept reality you can't save everyone.
The sad truth is a lot of people need to die so others can live. People are going to get blood born disease using dirty needles, clean needles, fucking for dope, etc. Enforcing consequences for actions shouldn't be viewed as a negative.
I was a pretty high bottom guy, functioning making 6-figs, but always on the verge of snapping. I hang out and help homeless, former homeless, pretty much everyday now for two years.
They would have all been happy hooked up to a slow drip, drooling out the side of their mouths for eternity if you let them. I used to give the bum begging for change fives all the time. I don't give them a cent anymore, i'll toss them food that's it. The stories i hear and the things i've seen have opened my eyes to the reality you need these people to fail spectacularly for them to change.
Societies current approach is akin to the classic story of the loving mother giving her obvious junkie son another 20, and another 20, and another 20, and where is the TV?, but he's a good boy so here's another 20...this is not a winning strategy and it hurts all parties involved in the most destructive, painful, and drawn out way imaginable.
Imposing deadly consequences for addiction is a bridge too far for me. Addiction is not merely a behavioral issue. Clean needles are the bandaid you apply when treatment is too expensive and/or unavailable. I'd prefer we provided treatment. But it's spendy. Same with mental illness.
Remembers comrade, the wars on poverty never ends!
Why must we atheists always do the Lord's work?
No, no, please do go on about how a massive federal program for housing? would successfully solve homelessness...
You still haven't expanded on anything. -
And you keep spewing shitHHusky said:
So you don't want any solution to homelessness that costs you any money; presumably looking at them and stepping over them is still a burden you'll bear if the alternative is spending money. blob wants to increase police and jail budgets to warehouse them, so you disagree with one another. Doogles is hoping they just die or are cured of homelessness spontaneously. Gasbag wants them, three at a time no less, to interview for jobs and immediately work full time, while homeless, convince a landlord to let (the three of) them take the lease, while homeless, and provide the landlord the references, credit scores, background checks and deposits required in order to make that case. Race and Doog are just concerned that any governmental role--outside of jailing them--is almost certain to lead us to Communism.thechatch said:
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass.
But you are willing to let me keep giving to various charities. Awesome! Thanks!
-
What do you do, Race? I'm reading a lot here about what you don't want, but nothing about what you are doing or want done.RaceBannon said:
And you keep spewing shitHHusky said:
So you don't want any solution to homelessness that costs you any money; presumably looking at them and stepping over them is still a burden you'll bear if the alternative is spending money. blob wants to increase police and jail budgets to warehouse them, so you disagree with one another. Doogles is hoping they just die or are cured of homelessness spontaneously. Gasbag wants them, three at a time no less, to interview for jobs and immediately work full time, while homeless, convince a landlord to let (the three of) them take the lease, while homeless, and provide the landlord the references, credit scores, background checks and deposits required in order to make that case. Race and Doog are just concerned that any governmental role--outside of jailing them--is almost certain to lead us to Communism.thechatch said:
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass.
But you are willing to let me keep giving to various charities. Awesome! Thanks! -
What the fuck are you talking about? I was responding to Salem about a thomas fremont joke wishing the Rona took them out.HHusky said:
Okay. Just so we're clear, the TugCon position is that we shouldn't help the homeless ('cuz that's Communism) and it would be better if they just all died of a virus ('cuz they're unpleasant to look at and they leave a mess). Why not just euthanize them? It's quick and humane and the cities will look a lot cleaner.Doogles said:
I did not see it was responding to you, but the idea society would be better off if the rona wiped out the homeless is not wrong.salemcoog said:
Et tu DooglesThomasFremont said:
Look, I’m. It saying I want it to happen. But if you and all your homeless friends got the Rona and died, society would be better off.salemcoog said:
You're missing the point about what actually helping the homeless looks like. Giving them needles and encouraging antisocial behavior is not helping, it's hurting. I'm all for taking the huge budget of the current failed programs that have seen homelessness explode in progressive cities and putting it towards mental health and rehabilitation facilities, preferably in a tiered system where the initial intake most closely resembles a jail with rigid structure and filters out from there as they "graduate" back into society so to speak.
I don't speak for conservatives. I'm the creepycoug of the west, half puerto, half white. -
So still nothing about your position.HHusky said:
So you don't want any solution to homelessness that costs you any money; presumably looking at them and stepping over them is still a burden you'll bear if the alternative is spending money. blob wants to increase police and jail budgets to warehouse them, so you disagree with one another. Doogles is hoping they just die or are cured of homelessness spontaneously. Gasbag wants them, three at a time no less, to interview for jobs and immediately work full time, while homeless, convince a landlord to let (the three of) them take the lease, while homeless, and provide the landlord the references, credit scores, background checks and deposits required in order to make that case. Race and Doog are just concerned that any governmental role--outside of jailing them--is almost certain to lead us to Communism.thechatch said:
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass.
But you are willing to let me keep giving to various charities. Awesome! Thanks! -
Haven't read anything about what you want except for a laugher about the fed and central policy.HHusky said:
What do you do, Race? I'm reading a lot here about what you don't want, but nothing about what you are doing or want done.RaceBannon said:
And you keep spewing shitHHusky said:
So you don't want any solution to homelessness that costs you any money; presumably looking at them and stepping over them is still a burden you'll bear if the alternative is spending money. blob wants to increase police and jail budgets to warehouse them, so you disagree with one another. Doogles is hoping they just die or are cured of homelessness spontaneously. Gasbag wants them, three at a time no less, to interview for jobs and immediately work full time, while homeless, convince a landlord to let (the three of) them take the lease, while homeless, and provide the landlord the references, credit scores, background checks and deposits required in order to make that case. Race and Doog are just concerned that any governmental role--outside of jailing them--is almost certain to lead us to Communism.thechatch said:
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass.
But you are willing to let me keep giving to various charities. Awesome! Thanks!
Probably why you won't expand on your position. -
His policies are in place, he's getting the results of his position.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Haven't read anything about what you want except for a laugher about the fed and central policy.HHusky said:
What do you do, Race? I'm reading a lot here about what you don't want, but nothing about what you are doing or want done.RaceBannon said:
And you keep spewing shitHHusky said:
So you don't want any solution to homelessness that costs you any money; presumably looking at them and stepping over them is still a burden you'll bear if the alternative is spending money. blob wants to increase police and jail budgets to warehouse them, so you disagree with one another. Doogles is hoping they just die or are cured of homelessness spontaneously. Gasbag wants them, three at a time no less, to interview for jobs and immediately work full time, while homeless, convince a landlord to let (the three of) them take the lease, while homeless, and provide the landlord the references, credit scores, background checks and deposits required in order to make that case. Race and Doog are just concerned that any governmental role--outside of jailing them--is almost certain to lead us to Communism.thechatch said:
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass.
But you are willing to let me keep giving to various charities. Awesome! Thanks!
Probably why you won't expand on your position. -
BullshitDoogles said:
His policies are in place, he's getting the results of his position.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Haven't read anything about what you want except for a laugher about the fed and central policy.HHusky said:
What do you do, Race? I'm reading a lot here about what you don't want, but nothing about what you are doing or want done.RaceBannon said:
And you keep spewing shitHHusky said:
So you don't want any solution to homelessness that costs you any money; presumably looking at them and stepping over them is still a burden you'll bear if the alternative is spending money. blob wants to increase police and jail budgets to warehouse them, so you disagree with one another. Doogles is hoping they just die or are cured of homelessness spontaneously. Gasbag wants them, three at a time no less, to interview for jobs and immediately work full time, while homeless, convince a landlord to let (the three of) them take the lease, while homeless, and provide the landlord the references, credit scores, background checks and deposits required in order to make that case. Race and Doog are just concerned that any governmental role--outside of jailing them--is almost certain to lead us to Communism.thechatch said:
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass.
But you are willing to let me keep giving to various charities. Awesome! Thanks!
Probably why you won't expand on your position. -
Having all the oars pulling in the same direction is just nuts, of course. The scattershot approach we have now just needs more tim.UW_Doog_Bot said:
Haven't read anything about what you want except for a laugher about the fed and central policy.HHusky said:
What do you do, Race? I'm reading a lot here about what you don't want, but nothing about what you are doing or want done.RaceBannon said:
And you keep spewing shitHHusky said:
So you don't want any solution to homelessness that costs you any money; presumably looking at them and stepping over them is still a burden you'll bear if the alternative is spending money. blob wants to increase police and jail budgets to warehouse them, so you disagree with one another. Doogles is hoping they just die or are cured of homelessness spontaneously. Gasbag wants them, three at a time no less, to interview for jobs and immediately work full time, while homeless, convince a landlord to let (the three of) them take the lease, while homeless, and provide the landlord the references, credit scores, background checks and deposits required in order to make that case. Race and Doog are just concerned that any governmental role--outside of jailing them--is almost certain to lead us to Communism.thechatch said:
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass.
But you are willing to let me keep giving to various charities. Awesome! Thanks!
Probably why you won't expand on your position.
-
IronicHHusky said:
What do you do, Race? I'm reading a lot here about what you don't want, but nothing about what you are doing or want done.RaceBannon said:
And you keep spewing shitHHusky said:
So you don't want any solution to homelessness that costs you any money; presumably looking at them and stepping over them is still a burden you'll bear if the alternative is spending money. blob wants to increase police and jail budgets to warehouse them, so you disagree with one another. Doogles is hoping they just die or are cured of homelessness spontaneously. Gasbag wants them, three at a time no less, to interview for jobs and immediately work full time, while homeless, convince a landlord to let (the three of) them take the lease, while homeless, and provide the landlord the references, credit scores, background checks and deposits required in order to make that case. Race and Doog are just concerned that any governmental role--outside of jailing them--is almost certain to lead us to Communism.thechatch said:
Like I said in my post above.HHusky said:
White people aren't homeless. Who knew?thechatch said:HHusky wants more of your money to pay for things that help him chase the white guilt away.
If you want it so badly, pay for it.
Everyone wants Police, firemen, roads, schools, bridges, and airports. I’ll gladly pay taxes for that shit. Corporate welfare? Free needles for crackheads? Free healthcare for illegal aliens and fat fucks?
Hard pass.
But you are willing to let me keep giving to various charities. Awesome! Thanks!
