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What do you want our secondary to look like?

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  • BroadcastingDawgBroadcastingDawg Member Posts: 1,245
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    Baphomet said:

    I was listening to the Dawgman podcast about the future of our secondary... and per usual, they made few predictions for what our secondary will truly look like going forward.

    Nice amount of detail. I'm not really that worried about our defense though. Lake is a stud coach and I trust him.

    I'm more worried about our run game and run game blocking. Can you do a write up like you did here, about that topic? I want an O that can run 200+ yards in the first 3 quarters on teams like tOSU and Auburn.

    Thanks in advance.
    I'd love to. But I'm not sure there's much question around what we're going to trot out there in the blocking game (virtually zero change at OL and TE from last year's team) and at running back. It will be a combo of Ahmed and Pleasant with McGrew mixed in... I don't know what's up with McGrew. He was a stud in high school and almost looks like he's lost a step or thinks too much when handed the ball at the college level. He was an elite speed guy who broke em' with regularity. I know that's high school and he did play on one of the elite programs in the country that maybe hid his flaws but I've expected more from him so far than we've gotten at running back and I'd be lying if I wasn't disappointed in him as a returner as well.

  • dirtysouwfdawgdirtysouwfdawg Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 11,704
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    Swaye's Wigwam

    jecornel said:

    I was listening to the Dawgman podcast about the future of our secondary... and per usual, they made few predictions for what our secondary will truly look like going forward.

    I think it can never really be a bad thing to recruit as solidly as we do in the secondary. That said, it's worrisome, at least to me, that the Dawgs might not put the most talented players out there next year given how the majority of our secondary has seen very little action thus far in their time with the program.

    So here are my thoughts, what are yours?

    Starting exterior CB's:

    Keith Taylor: I think this one is clearly a given. He's probably the most talented corner on the roster if you combine his experience and time in the program. At 6'2 190 he's got the prototypical size of a future NFL corner and his elite length combined with plus ball skills and physicality make him a probable future star at UW. He's going to start at least the next 2 seasons one would think. He's superior to Jordan Miller the second he's handed the starting role in my opinion.

    Elijah Molden: This one is a bit of a question mark for me. I like Molden... I like his smarts, his football IQ is elite, he's clearly a talent... but what do I hate about him? HIS SIZE. There's no way he's the 5'11 190 he's listed unless he's put on a lot of weight since the Rose Bowl and grown 2 inches. He played in the slot when Bryant was banged up and he was hit or miss for me in that role. At least from what I remember, when the opposition put tight ends on him his size was exposed. In the Stanford game Kaden Smith routinely chewed him up and spit him out. Now he's likely to start opposite Taylor on the outside and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little worried about how he'll handle bigger wideouts on the outside.

    Who else on the exterior?

    Kyler Gordon: This is where I said I'm concerned that if we start a guy like Molden, we're not starting our most talented players. If Kyler Gordon is as good an athlete as we think he is, how can we justify him sitting on the bench for the first 2, maybe 3 seasons as a Dawg? Elijah Molden is a Jr. and he's not gonna get drafted... so if Taylor is slated to start on the opposite side the next 2 years, where does Gordon get his playing time if he's not starting over Molden? From what I hear this kid is the next coming of Jesus athletically... I want him on the field. I guess the way it might happen is he'll be the primary backup for basically all corner positions, kind of like what Austin Joyner did in his first few years. Then in 2020, seeing as Bryant will be graduated, we could see Gordon take the starting exterior role from Molden... and Molden would move back to the nickel role as a senior.

    Dom Hampton: Again, someone who everyone raves about talent wise. I salivate at the prospect of having 2x 6'2 190 lb corners with a ton of length and athleticism starting outside for the Dawgs. But how can it happen? Outside of injuries we cant forecast... I just don't see a way Hampton gets on the field until at least 2020 and maybe only so in a role where he's playing 5 or so snaps a game like Taylor did while he was blocked. Again, it never hurts to have this much talent... you just hope a kid like Hampton not seeing the field isn't a detriment to our potential as a secondary.

    Starting Slot CB:

    Myles Bryant: This one is pretty much a given. Bryant isn't a fan favorite but the coaches and most fans with football intelligence love him. He's a gritty fighter who plays physical in coverage and hits hard. He's prone to some exposure at times because he plays more with intensity and effort than brains. That's the difference with him and Molden - it seems however, the reason he's better than Molden in the slot because physical will tends to outshine brains at the college level. I don't think anyone is complaining having him start in the slot.

    Who else on the interior?

    Like I said, I think Gordon is going to be the primary backup to all corner positions and I think they'd like to give him time at the position on the inside before putting him out on an island.

    Who else?

    Kamren Fabiculanan: A likely redshirt option and will probably not see any time until maybe 2021 on D.

    Trent McDuffie: Another likely redshirt in 2019. Will likely see time in year in 2020 as the backup slot corner and on special teams.

    Starting Strong Safety:

    Brandon McKinney:It might be a little harsh to judge him on his performance in the Rose Bowl when he spelled Taylor Rapp. Maybe he was playing outside of his natural position? Because his coverage skills left something to be desired. Haskins burned him multiple times with his eyes... looking off wideouts and MicKinney fell for it. He's got good size so maybe he's better suited for strong safety as someone who blitzes and assists in the run game than over the top? He's a junior who has far and away the most experience playing this position so you have to figure he's gonna be the starter going forward.

    Who else at SS?

    Alex Cook: This one is a bit of wild card. Cook maybe should have come to UW as a safety instead of wasting away as a WR his first 2 seasons. A lot of folks figured he'd play safety at the college level and it appears he's seen the writing on the wall. I like his size at SS as well... 6'2 190. Who knows how good he can or can't be here. He's been around for a bit and I wouldn't be upset seeing him get some run given how players who have switched from D to O or O to D have done in this program.

    Starting Free Safety:

    Julius Irvin: Again, another situation where you have to weigh elite talent versus a guy with experience in the system. Irvin was a big-time get out of SoCal with the Dawgs beating out SC, Bama and Notre Dame for the coveted safety. Everything I hear about the kid is that he's next in line to be a star at safety for the Dawgs. I'd like to throw him out there in case he's as good as advertised.

    Who else at FS?

    Isaiah Gilchrist: I almost feel bad slotting him here... and it's likely that he'll see more time than I want or is warranted. Who knows... maybe he's great. He's like Molden in the sense that I'm not sure he's near the talent level of the other guys but he's earned his chance to prove himself. Question is, can we afford to give him that chance? I don't know.

    Who else?

    Cam Williams: Likely see time in a few garbage games. Lake seems to love this kid. I watched a few recruiting tapes and loves this kid's makeup. He's a real leader and my guess is he'll star in special teams until he gets his chance down the road in the secondary.

    Asa Turner: Highly talented but not much space for him this year. Similar path to Williams. Maybe a redshirt.

    My thoughts are you spent way too much time on this post. Where were any of these guys going to play with the guys in front of them?

    Lake loves McKinney BTW.

    If you are questioning Molden in any fashion then I'm respectfully asking you to LEAVE!

    Eh, took me maybe 30 minutes to write it up. Have a degree in journalism.

    I like Molden, question his size and overall ceiling because of his size compared to other players.

    And that's my concern to begin with. Do we just start guys because they have more experience? Or do we let guys with more talent play even though they're less experienced? I hope the latter.
    Some get it, some don’t. The overall post was quality. Obviously points can be debated.

    I look at Molden and see similar size to Murphy. Though I think that’s pretty close to where the comparisons end, elite coaching takes elite talent and makes it NFL ready.

    I don’t think enough has been seen from Molden to place him in the “size is an issue” category. A yr from now, if his size is an issue and is an obvious point of O-coordinators in game plans, then let’s revisit.

    Until then...LIPO. Not enough data to draw a rationale conclusion.

    If Lake is elite, he’ll use his abundance of talent and we’ll have another pac leading secondary. Experience is not an excuse.
  • BennyBeaverBennyBeaver Member Posts: 13,333
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    Mostly white guys with lots of heart

    Pat Tillman TUFF!
  • chuckchuck Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 10,587
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    Pretty fucking simple...Hampton and Taylor at corner, bryant-molden nickel, Gordon and Dr J at safety. That's Pups DB scenario. I'd love to see Bryant to safety too, molden full-time nickel too. I'm fine with that, Gordon backup cb Linebacker is the worry so how about talk about that? Its grim!

    Hampton been my guy since day 1. He has Peter's ability at 6-2. He's a baller, physical and can close QUICK!! on ball or on back-wr. He's going to be good

    There's been plenty of lb talk too pup. There's a recent thread. Not going to highjack this one by summarizing it here and sending you off the rails telling us how fucked we are and how wrong everyone is.. I'm also not going to find it for you, but I hope you lend your thoughts there.
  • puppylove_sugarsteelpuppylove_sugarsteel Member Posts: 9,133
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    Lb a problem dont really want to look as I know everything wrong in that room. Make no mistake, the db room will take hits too as will the interior DL. The d will take a step back next year early ...how fast they get good will determine season. We ain't replacing 8 starters with the mash unit at lb and inexperience. Ohio st has 4-5 star kids in wing every year and could respond last year to the loss of all those early entries the year b4. Their defense was awful. We're not equipped to just reload next year. Lake will have dbs on hand , but safety will take a hit. ILB and nose will hurt. We wont stop run like last few years...1st half of season anyway
  • jecorneljecornel Member Posts: 9,516
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    jecornel said:

    I was listening to the Dawgman podcast about the future of our secondary... and per usual, they made few predictions for what our secondary will truly look like going forward.

    I think it can never really be a bad thing to recruit as solidly as we do in the secondary. That said, it's worrisome, at least to me, that the Dawgs might not put the most talented players out there next year given how the majority of our secondary has seen very little action thus far in their time with the program.

    So here are my thoughts, what are yours?

    Starting exterior CB's:

    Keith Taylor: I think this one is clearly a given. He's probably the most talented corner on the roster if you combine his experience and time in the program. At 6'2 190 he's got the prototypical size of a future NFL corner and his elite length combined with plus ball skills and physicality make him a probable future star at UW. He's going to start at least the next 2 seasons one would think. He's superior to Jordan Miller the second he's handed the starting role in my opinion.

    Elijah Molden: This one is a bit of a question mark for me. I like Molden... I like his smarts, his football IQ is elite, he's clearly a talent... but what do I hate about him? HIS SIZE. There's no way he's the 5'11 190 he's listed unless he's put on a lot of weight since the Rose Bowl and grown 2 inches. He played in the slot when Bryant was banged up and he was hit or miss for me in that role. At least from what I remember, when the opposition put tight ends on him his size was exposed. In the Stanford game Kaden Smith routinely chewed him up and spit him out. Now he's likely to start opposite Taylor on the outside and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little worried about how he'll handle bigger wideouts on the outside.

    Who else on the exterior?

    Kyler Gordon: This is where I said I'm concerned that if we start a guy like Molden, we're not starting our most talented players. If Kyler Gordon is as good an athlete as we think he is, how can we justify him sitting on the bench for the first 2, maybe 3 seasons as a Dawg? Elijah Molden is a Jr. and he's not gonna get drafted... so if Taylor is slated to start on the opposite side the next 2 years, where does Gordon get his playing time if he's not starting over Molden? From what I hear this kid is the next coming of Jesus athletically... I want him on the field. I guess the way it might happen is he'll be the primary backup for basically all corner positions, kind of like what Austin Joyner did in his first few years. Then in 2020, seeing as Bryant will be graduated, we could see Gordon take the starting exterior role from Molden... and Molden would move back to the nickel role as a senior.

    Dom Hampton: Again, someone who everyone raves about talent wise. I salivate at the prospect of having 2x 6'2 190 lb corners with a ton of length and athleticism starting outside for the Dawgs. But how can it happen? Outside of injuries we cant forecast... I just don't see a way Hampton gets on the field until at least 2020 and maybe only so in a role where he's playing 5 or so snaps a game like Taylor did while he was blocked. Again, it never hurts to have this much talent... you just hope a kid like Hampton not seeing the field isn't a detriment to our potential as a secondary.

    Starting Slot CB:

    Myles Bryant: This one is pretty much a given. Bryant isn't a fan favorite but the coaches and most fans with football intelligence love him. He's a gritty fighter who plays physical in coverage and hits hard. He's prone to some exposure at times because he plays more with intensity and effort than brains. That's the difference with him and Molden - it seems however, the reason he's better than Molden in the slot because physical will tends to outshine brains at the college level. I don't think anyone is complaining having him start in the slot.

    Who else on the interior?

    Like I said, I think Gordon is going to be the primary backup to all corner positions and I think they'd like to give him time at the position on the inside before putting him out on an island.

    Who else?

    Kamren Fabiculanan: A likely redshirt option and will probably not see any time until maybe 2021 on D.

    Trent McDuffie: Another likely redshirt in 2019. Will likely see time in year in 2020 as the backup slot corner and on special teams.

    Starting Strong Safety:

    Brandon McKinney:It might be a little harsh to judge him on his performance in the Rose Bowl when he spelled Taylor Rapp. Maybe he was playing outside of his natural position? Because his coverage skills left something to be desired. Haskins burned him multiple times with his eyes... looking off wideouts and MicKinney fell for it. He's got good size so maybe he's better suited for strong safety as someone who blitzes and assists in the run game than over the top? He's a junior who has far and away the most experience playing this position so you have to figure he's gonna be the starter going forward.

    Who else at SS?

    Alex Cook: This one is a bit of wild card. Cook maybe should have come to UW as a safety instead of wasting away as a WR his first 2 seasons. A lot of folks figured he'd play safety at the college level and it appears he's seen the writing on the wall. I like his size at SS as well... 6'2 190. Who knows how good he can or can't be here. He's been around for a bit and I wouldn't be upset seeing him get some run given how players who have switched from D to O or O to D have done in this program.

    Starting Free Safety:

    Julius Irvin: Again, another situation where you have to weigh elite talent versus a guy with experience in the system. Irvin was a big-time get out of SoCal with the Dawgs beating out SC, Bama and Notre Dame for the coveted safety. Everything I hear about the kid is that he's next in line to be a star at safety for the Dawgs. I'd like to throw him out there in case he's as good as advertised.

    Who else at FS?

    Isaiah Gilchrist: I almost feel bad slotting him here... and it's likely that he'll see more time than I want or is warranted. Who knows... maybe he's great. He's like Molden in the sense that I'm not sure he's near the talent level of the other guys but he's earned his chance to prove himself. Question is, can we afford to give him that chance? I don't know.

    Who else?

    Cam Williams: Likely see time in a few garbage games. Lake seems to love this kid. I watched a few recruiting tapes and loves this kid's makeup. He's a real leader and my guess is he'll star in special teams until he gets his chance down the road in the secondary.

    Asa Turner: Highly talented but not much space for him this year. Similar path to Williams. Maybe a redshirt.

    My thoughts are you spent way too much time on this post. Where were any of these guys going to play with the guys in front of them?

    Lake loves McKinney BTW.

    If you are questioning Molden in any fashion then I'm respectfully asking you to LEAVE!

    Eh, took me maybe 30 minutes to write it up. Have a degree in journalism.

    I like Molden, question his size and overall ceiling because of his size compared to other players.

    And that's my concern to begin with. Do we just start guys because they have more experience? Or do we let guys with more talent play even though they're less experienced? I hope the latter.
    Nuff said on that.

  • jecorneljecornel Member Posts: 9,516
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    You start the player who wins the job. Talent combined with work ethic and smarts usually gets the nod. Talent alone isn't enough unless you play basketball.

    Have seen a lot of talented players that sucked over the years.

  • jecorneljecornel Member Posts: 9,516
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    jecornel said:

    jecornel said:

    I was listening to the Dawgman podcast about the future of our secondary... and per usual, they made few predictions for what our secondary will truly look like going forward.

    I think it can never really be a bad thing to recruit as solidly as we do in the secondary. That said, it's worrisome, at least to me, that the Dawgs might not put the most talented players out there next year given how the majority of our secondary has seen very little action thus far in their time with the program.

    So here are my thoughts, what are yours?

    Starting exterior CB's:

    Keith Taylor: I think this one is clearly a given. He's probably the most talented corner on the roster if you combine his experience and time in the program. At 6'2 190 he's got the prototypical size of a future NFL corner and his elite length combined with plus ball skills and physicality make him a probable future star at UW. He's going to start at least the next 2 seasons one would think. He's superior to Jordan Miller the second he's handed the starting role in my opinion.

    Elijah Molden: This one is a bit of a question mark for me. I like Molden... I like his smarts, his football IQ is elite, he's clearly a talent... but what do I hate about him? HIS SIZE. There's no way he's the 5'11 190 he's listed unless he's put on a lot of weight since the Rose Bowl and grown 2 inches. He played in the slot when Bryant was banged up and he was hit or miss for me in that role. At least from what I remember, when the opposition put tight ends on him his size was exposed. In the Stanford game Kaden Smith routinely chewed him up and spit him out. Now he's likely to start opposite Taylor on the outside and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little worried about how he'll handle bigger wideouts on the outside.

    Who else on the exterior?

    Kyler Gordon: This is where I said I'm concerned that if we start a guy like Molden, we're not starting our most talented players. If Kyler Gordon is as good an athlete as we think he is, how can we justify him sitting on the bench for the first 2, maybe 3 seasons as a Dawg? Elijah Molden is a Jr. and he's not gonna get drafted... so if Taylor is slated to start on the opposite side the next 2 years, where does Gordon get his playing time if he's not starting over Molden? From what I hear this kid is the next coming of Jesus athletically... I want him on the field. I guess the way it might happen is he'll be the primary backup for basically all corner positions, kind of like what Austin Joyner did in his first few years. Then in 2020, seeing as Bryant will be graduated, we could see Gordon take the starting exterior role from Molden... and Molden would move back to the nickel role as a senior.

    Dom Hampton: Again, someone who everyone raves about talent wise. I salivate at the prospect of having 2x 6'2 190 lb corners with a ton of length and athleticism starting outside for the Dawgs. But how can it happen? Outside of injuries we cant forecast... I just don't see a way Hampton gets on the field until at least 2020 and maybe only so in a role where he's playing 5 or so snaps a game like Taylor did while he was blocked. Again, it never hurts to have this much talent... you just hope a kid like Hampton not seeing the field isn't a detriment to our potential as a secondary.

    Starting Slot CB:

    Myles Bryant: This one is pretty much a given. Bryant isn't a fan favorite but the coaches and most fans with football intelligence love him. He's a gritty fighter who plays physical in coverage and hits hard. He's prone to some exposure at times because he plays more with intensity and effort than brains. That's the difference with him and Molden - it seems however, the reason he's better than Molden in the slot because physical will tends to outshine brains at the college level. I don't think anyone is complaining having him start in the slot.

    Who else on the interior?

    Like I said, I think Gordon is going to be the primary backup to all corner positions and I think they'd like to give him time at the position on the inside before putting him out on an island.

    Who else?

    Kamren Fabiculanan: A likely redshirt option and will probably not see any time until maybe 2021 on D.

    Trent McDuffie: Another likely redshirt in 2019. Will likely see time in year in 2020 as the backup slot corner and on special teams.

    Starting Strong Safety:

    Brandon McKinney:It might be a little harsh to judge him on his performance in the Rose Bowl when he spelled Taylor Rapp. Maybe he was playing outside of his natural position? Because his coverage skills left something to be desired. Haskins burned him multiple times with his eyes... looking off wideouts and MicKinney fell for it. He's got good size so maybe he's better suited for strong safety as someone who blitzes and assists in the run game than over the top? He's a junior who has far and away the most experience playing this position so you have to figure he's gonna be the starter going forward.

    Who else at SS?

    Alex Cook: This one is a bit of wild card. Cook maybe should have come to UW as a safety instead of wasting away as a WR his first 2 seasons. A lot of folks figured he'd play safety at the college level and it appears he's seen the writing on the wall. I like his size at SS as well... 6'2 190. Who knows how good he can or can't be here. He's been around for a bit and I wouldn't be upset seeing him get some run given how players who have switched from D to O or O to D have done in this program.

    Starting Free Safety:

    Julius Irvin: Again, another situation where you have to weigh elite talent versus a guy with experience in the system. Irvin was a big-time get out of SoCal with the Dawgs beating out SC, Bama and Notre Dame for the coveted safety. Everything I hear about the kid is that he's next in line to be a star at safety for the Dawgs. I'd like to throw him out there in case he's as good as advertised.

    Who else at FS?

    Isaiah Gilchrist: I almost feel bad slotting him here... and it's likely that he'll see more time than I want or is warranted. Who knows... maybe he's great. He's like Molden in the sense that I'm not sure he's near the talent level of the other guys but he's earned his chance to prove himself. Question is, can we afford to give him that chance? I don't know.

    Who else?

    Cam Williams: Likely see time in a few garbage games. Lake seems to love this kid. I watched a few recruiting tapes and loves this kid's makeup. He's a real leader and my guess is he'll star in special teams until he gets his chance down the road in the secondary.

    Asa Turner: Highly talented but not much space for him this year. Similar path to Williams. Maybe a redshirt.

    My thoughts are you spent way too much time on this post. Where were any of these guys going to play with the guys in front of them?

    Lake loves McKinney BTW.

    If you are questioning Molden in any fashion then I'm respectfully asking you to LEAVE!

    Eh, took me maybe 30 minutes to write it up. Have a degree in journalism.

    I like Molden, question his size and overall ceiling because of his size compared to other players.

    And that's my concern to begin with. Do we just start guys because they have more experience? Or do we let guys with more talent play even though they're less experienced? I hope the latter.
    Nuff said on that.

    His father was a decent corner for being 5'10". ;)
  • TequillaTequilla Member Posts: 19,800
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    jecornel said:

    I was listening to the Dawgman podcast about the future of our secondary... and per usual, they made few predictions for what our secondary will truly look like going forward.

    I think it can never really be a bad thing to recruit as solidly as we do in the secondary. That said, it's worrisome, at least to me, that the Dawgs might not put the most talented players out there next year given how the majority of our secondary has seen very little action thus far in their time with the program.

    So here are my thoughts, what are yours?

    Starting exterior CB's:

    Keith Taylor: I think this one is clearly a given. He's probably the most talented corner on the roster if you combine his experience and time in the program. At 6'2 190 he's got the prototypical size of a future NFL corner and his elite length combined with plus ball skills and physicality make him a probable future star at UW. He's going to start at least the next 2 seasons one would think. He's superior to Jordan Miller the second he's handed the starting role in my opinion.

    Elijah Molden: This one is a bit of a question mark for me. I like Molden... I like his smarts, his football IQ is elite, he's clearly a talent... but what do I hate about him? HIS SIZE. There's no way he's the 5'11 190 he's listed unless he's put on a lot of weight since the Rose Bowl and grown 2 inches. He played in the slot when Bryant was banged up and he was hit or miss for me in that role. At least from what I remember, when the opposition put tight ends on him his size was exposed. In the Stanford game Kaden Smith routinely chewed him up and spit him out. Now he's likely to start opposite Taylor on the outside and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little worried about how he'll handle bigger wideouts on the outside.

    Who else on the exterior?

    Kyler Gordon: This is where I said I'm concerned that if we start a guy like Molden, we're not starting our most talented players. If Kyler Gordon is as good an athlete as we think he is, how can we justify him sitting on the bench for the first 2, maybe 3 seasons as a Dawg? Elijah Molden is a Jr. and he's not gonna get drafted... so if Taylor is slated to start on the opposite side the next 2 years, where does Gordon get his playing time if he's not starting over Molden? From what I hear this kid is the next coming of Jesus athletically... I want him on the field. I guess the way it might happen is he'll be the primary backup for basically all corner positions, kind of like what Austin Joyner did in his first few years. Then in 2020, seeing as Bryant will be graduated, we could see Gordon take the starting exterior role from Molden... and Molden would move back to the nickel role as a senior.

    Dom Hampton: Again, someone who everyone raves about talent wise. I salivate at the prospect of having 2x 6'2 190 lb corners with a ton of length and athleticism starting outside for the Dawgs. But how can it happen? Outside of injuries we cant forecast... I just don't see a way Hampton gets on the field until at least 2020 and maybe only so in a role where he's playing 5 or so snaps a game like Taylor did while he was blocked. Again, it never hurts to have this much talent... you just hope a kid like Hampton not seeing the field isn't a detriment to our potential as a secondary.

    Starting Slot CB:

    Myles Bryant: This one is pretty much a given. Bryant isn't a fan favorite but the coaches and most fans with football intelligence love him. He's a gritty fighter who plays physical in coverage and hits hard. He's prone to some exposure at times because he plays more with intensity and effort than brains. That's the difference with him and Molden - it seems however, the reason he's better than Molden in the slot because physical will tends to outshine brains at the college level. I don't think anyone is complaining having him start in the slot.

    Who else on the interior?

    Like I said, I think Gordon is going to be the primary backup to all corner positions and I think they'd like to give him time at the position on the inside before putting him out on an island.

    Who else?

    Kamren Fabiculanan: A likely redshirt option and will probably not see any time until maybe 2021 on D.

    Trent McDuffie: Another likely redshirt in 2019. Will likely see time in year in 2020 as the backup slot corner and on special teams.

    Starting Strong Safety:

    Brandon McKinney:It might be a little harsh to judge him on his performance in the Rose Bowl when he spelled Taylor Rapp. Maybe he was playing outside of his natural position? Because his coverage skills left something to be desired. Haskins burned him multiple times with his eyes... looking off wideouts and MicKinney fell for it. He's got good size so maybe he's better suited for strong safety as someone who blitzes and assists in the run game than over the top? He's a junior who has far and away the most experience playing this position so you have to figure he's gonna be the starter going forward.

    Who else at SS?

    Alex Cook: This one is a bit of wild card. Cook maybe should have come to UW as a safety instead of wasting away as a WR his first 2 seasons. A lot of folks figured he'd play safety at the college level and it appears he's seen the writing on the wall. I like his size at SS as well... 6'2 190. Who knows how good he can or can't be here. He's been around for a bit and I wouldn't be upset seeing him get some run given how players who have switched from D to O or O to D have done in this program.

    Starting Free Safety:

    Julius Irvin: Again, another situation where you have to weigh elite talent versus a guy with experience in the system. Irvin was a big-time get out of SoCal with the Dawgs beating out SC, Bama and Notre Dame for the coveted safety. Everything I hear about the kid is that he's next in line to be a star at safety for the Dawgs. I'd like to throw him out there in case he's as good as advertised.

    Who else at FS?

    Isaiah Gilchrist: I almost feel bad slotting him here... and it's likely that he'll see more time than I want or is warranted. Who knows... maybe he's great. He's like Molden in the sense that I'm not sure he's near the talent level of the other guys but he's earned his chance to prove himself. Question is, can we afford to give him that chance? I don't know.

    Who else?

    Cam Williams: Likely see time in a few garbage games. Lake seems to love this kid. I watched a few recruiting tapes and loves this kid's makeup. He's a real leader and my guess is he'll star in special teams until he gets his chance down the road in the secondary.

    Asa Turner: Highly talented but not much space for him this year. Similar path to Williams. Maybe a redshirt.

    My thoughts are you spent way too much time on this post. Where were any of these guys going to play with the guys in front of them?

    Lake loves McKinney BTW.

    If you are questioning Molden in any fashion then I'm respectfully asking you to LEAVE!

    Eh, took me maybe 30 minutes to write it up. Have a degree in journalism.

    I like Molden, question his size and overall ceiling because of his size compared to other players.

    And that's my concern to begin with. Do we just start guys because they have more experience? Or do we let guys with more talent play even though they're less experienced? I hope the latter.
    30 minutes for a TL, DR post is too much of a time commitment ... take it from the expert
  • DoogCouricsDoogCourics Member Posts: 5,739
    First Anniversary First Comment 5 Awesomes 5 Up Votes

    Decent takes for the most part, but you’re wrong about Molden. He’s fucking nails. You’re wrong to underestimate him.

    Also, get a goddamn avatar you fucking savage. We are civilized in these parts.

    Here, I’ll help:


    For more evidence towards this, here is a quote from a recent Caple article:

    "On a whim, I asked Browning and Myles Gaskin at pro day for an offensive and defensive player to watch in 2019. It’s telling, I think, that both quickly answered with the same name for their defensive selection: defensive back Elijah Molden."

    He has elite ball skills and will be a Byron Murphy type outside if that is where he plays (unlike Ballz I don't go based on day 1 of spring ball in regards to what the starting depth chart will be). If he plays Safety, he'll be nails there as well.
  • FireCohenFireCohen Member Posts: 21,823
    First Anniversary 5 Awesomes Combo Breaker 5 Up Votes

    Decent takes for the most part, but you’re wrong about Molden. He’s fucking nails. You’re wrong to underestimate him.

    Also, get a goddamn avatar you fucking savage. We are civilized in these parts.

    Here, I’ll help:


    Wow that is some dark shit man. SBS is a Korean tv station....that poor puppy
  • PurpleJPurpleJ Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 36,382
    First Anniversary 5 Up Votes 5 Awesomes Combo Breaker
    Swaye's Wigwam
    I trust the coaches.
  • puppylove_sugarsteelpuppylove_sugarsteel Member Posts: 9,133
    First Anniversary 5 Up Votes Combo Breaker 5 Awesomes

    I was listening to the Dawgman podcast about the future of our secondary... and per usual, they made few predictions for what our secondary will truly look like going forward.

    I think it can never really be a bad thing to recruit as solidly as we do in the secondary. That said, it's worrisome, at least to me, that the Dawgs might not put the most talented players out there next year given how the majority of our secondary has seen very little action thus far in their time with the program.

    So here are my thoughts, what are yours?

    Starting exterior CB's:

    Keith Taylor: I think this one is clearly a given. He's probably the most talented corner on the roster if you combine his experience and time in the program. At 6'2 190 he's got the prototypical size of a future NFL corner and his elite length combined with plus ball skills and physicality make him a probable future star at UW. He's going to start at least the next 2 seasons one would think. He's superior to Jordan Miller the second he's handed the starting role in my opinion.

    Elijah Molden: This one is a bit of a question mark for me. I like Molden... I like his smarts, his football IQ is elite, he's clearly a talent... but what do I hate about him? HIS SIZE. There's no way he's the 5'11 190 he's listed unless he's put on a lot of weight since the Rose Bowl and grown 2 inches. He played in the slot when Bryant was banged up and he was hit or miss for me in that role. At least from what I remember, when the opposition put tight ends on him his size was exposed. In the Stanford game Kaden Smith routinely chewed him up and spit him out. Now he's likely to start opposite Taylor on the outside and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little worried about how he'll handle bigger wideouts on the outside.

    Who else on the exterior?

    Kyler Gordon: This is where I said I'm concerned that if we start a guy like Molden, we're not starting our most talented players. If Kyler Gordon is as good an athlete as we think he is, how can we justify him sitting on the bench for the first 2, maybe 3 seasons as a Dawg? Elijah Molden is a Jr. and he's not gonna get drafted... so if Taylor is slated to start on the opposite side the next 2 years, where does Gordon get his playing time if he's not starting over Molden? From what I hear this kid is the next coming of Jesus athletically... I want him on the field. I guess the way it might happen is he'll be the primary backup for basically all corner positions, kind of like what Austin Joyner did in his first few years. Then in 2020, seeing as Bryant will be graduated, we could see Gordon take the starting exterior role from Molden... and Molden would move back to the nickel role as a senior.

    Dom Hampton: Again, someone who everyone raves about talent wise. I salivate at the prospect of having 2x 6'2 190 lb corners with a ton of length and athleticism starting outside for the Dawgs. But how can it happen? Outside of injuries we cant forecast... I just don't see a way Hampton gets on the field until at least 2020 and maybe only so in a role where he's playing 5 or so snaps a game like Taylor did while he was blocked. Again, it never hurts to have this much talent... you just hope a kid like Hampton not seeing the field isn't a detriment to our potential as a secondary.

    Starting Slot CB:

    Myles Bryant: This one is pretty much a given. Bryant isn't a fan favorite but the coaches and most fans with football intelligence love him. He's a gritty fighter who plays physical in coverage and hits hard. He's prone to some exposure at times because he plays more with intensity and effort than brains. That's the difference with him and Molden - it seems however, the reason he's better than Molden in the slot because physical will tends to outshine brains at the college level. I don't think anyone is complaining having him start in the slot.

    Who else on the interior?

    Like I said, I think Gordon is going to be the primary backup to all corner positions and I think they'd like to give him time at the position on the inside before putting him out on an island.

    Who else?

    Kamren Fabiculanan: A likely redshirt option and will probably not see any time until maybe 2021 on D.

    Trent McDuffie: Another likely redshirt in 2019. Will likely see time in year in 2020 as the backup slot corner and on special teams.

    Starting Strong Safety:

    Brandon McKinney:It might be a little harsh to judge him on his performance in the Rose Bowl when he spelled Taylor Rapp. Maybe he was playing outside of his natural position? Because his coverage skills left something to be desired. Haskins burned him multiple times with his eyes... looking off wideouts and MicKinney fell for it. He's got good size so maybe he's better suited for strong safety as someone who blitzes and assists in the run game than over the top? He's a junior who has far and away the most experience playing this position so you have to figure he's gonna be the starter going forward.

    Who else at SS?

    Alex Cook: This one is a bit of wild card. Cook maybe should have come to UW as a safety instead of wasting away as a WR his first 2 seasons. A lot of folks figured he'd play safety at the college level and it appears he's seen the writing on the wall. I like his size at SS as well... 6'2 190. Who knows how good he can or can't be here. He's been around for a bit and I wouldn't be upset seeing him get some run given how players who have switched from D to O or O to D have done in this program.

    Starting Free Safety:

    Julius Irvin: Again, another situation where you have to weigh elite talent versus a guy with experience in the system. Irvin was a big-time get out of SoCal with the Dawgs beating out SC, Bama and Notre Dame for the coveted safety. Everything I hear about the kid is that he's next in line to be a star at safety for the Dawgs. I'd like to throw him out there in case he's as good as advertised.

    Who else at FS?

    Isaiah Gilchrist: I almost feel bad slotting him here... and it's likely that he'll see more time than I want or is warranted. Who knows... maybe he's great. He's like Molden in the sense that I'm not sure he's near the talent level of the other guys but he's earned his chance to prove himself. Question is, can we afford to give him that chance? I don't know.

    Who else?

    Cam Williams: Likely see time in a few garbage games. Lake seems to love this kid. I watched a few recruiting tapes and loves this kid's makeup. He's a real leader and my guess is he'll star in special teams until he gets his chance down the road in the secondary.

    Asa Turner: Highly talented but not much space for him this year. Similar path to Williams. Maybe a redshirt.

    I hope you dont have a 25th post. Sheesh!!
  • PurpleBazePurpleBaze Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 29,483
    First Anniversary First Comment 5 Awesomes 5 Up Votes
    Founders Club

    I was listening to the Dawgman podcast about the future of our secondary... and per usual, they made few predictions for what our secondary will truly look like going forward.

    I think it can never really be a bad thing to recruit as solidly as we do in the secondary. That said, it's worrisome, at least to me, that the Dawgs might not put the most talented players out there next year given how the majority of our secondary has seen very little action thus far in their time with the program.

    So here are my thoughts, what are yours?

    Starting exterior CB's:

    Keith Taylor: I think this one is clearly a given. He's probably the most talented corner on the roster if you combine his experience and time in the program. At 6'2 190 he's got the prototypical size of a future NFL corner and his elite length combined with plus ball skills and physicality make him a probable future star at UW. He's going to start at least the next 2 seasons one would think. He's superior to Jordan Miller the second he's handed the starting role in my opinion.

    Elijah Molden: This one is a bit of a question mark for me. I like Molden... I like his smarts, his football IQ is elite, he's clearly a talent... but what do I hate about him? HIS SIZE. There's no way he's the 5'11 190 he's listed unless he's put on a lot of weight since the Rose Bowl and grown 2 inches. He played in the slot when Bryant was banged up and he was hit or miss for me in that role. At least from what I remember, when the opposition put tight ends on him his size was exposed. In the Stanford game Kaden Smith routinely chewed him up and spit him out. Now he's likely to start opposite Taylor on the outside and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little worried about how he'll handle bigger wideouts on the outside.

    Who else on the exterior?

    Kyler Gordon: This is where I said I'm concerned that if we start a guy like Molden, we're not starting our most talented players. If Kyler Gordon is as good an athlete as we think he is, how can we justify him sitting on the bench for the first 2, maybe 3 seasons as a Dawg? Elijah Molden is a Jr. and he's not gonna get drafted... so if Taylor is slated to start on the opposite side the next 2 years, where does Gordon get his playing time if he's not starting over Molden? From what I hear this kid is the next coming of Jesus athletically... I want him on the field. I guess the way it might happen is he'll be the primary backup for basically all corner positions, kind of like what Austin Joyner did in his first few years. Then in 2020, seeing as Bryant will be graduated, we could see Gordon take the starting exterior role from Molden... and Molden would move back to the nickel role as a senior.

    Dom Hampton: Again, someone who everyone raves about talent wise. I salivate at the prospect of having 2x 6'2 190 lb corners with a ton of length and athleticism starting outside for the Dawgs. But how can it happen? Outside of injuries we cant forecast... I just don't see a way Hampton gets on the field until at least 2020 and maybe only so in a role where he's playing 5 or so snaps a game like Taylor did while he was blocked. Again, it never hurts to have this much talent... you just hope a kid like Hampton not seeing the field isn't a detriment to our potential as a secondary.

    Starting Slot CB:

    Myles Bryant: This one is pretty much a given. Bryant isn't a fan favorite but the coaches and most fans with football intelligence love him. He's a gritty fighter who plays physical in coverage and hits hard. He's prone to some exposure at times because he plays more with intensity and effort than brains. That's the difference with him and Molden - it seems however, the reason he's better than Molden in the slot because physical will tends to outshine brains at the college level. I don't think anyone is complaining having him start in the slot.

    Who else on the interior?

    Like I said, I think Gordon is going to be the primary backup to all corner positions and I think they'd like to give him time at the position on the inside before putting him out on an island.

    Who else?

    Kamren Fabiculanan: A likely redshirt option and will probably not see any time until maybe 2021 on D.

    Trent McDuffie: Another likely redshirt in 2019. Will likely see time in year in 2020 as the backup slot corner and on special teams.

    Starting Strong Safety:

    Brandon McKinney:It might be a little harsh to judge him on his performance in the Rose Bowl when he spelled Taylor Rapp. Maybe he was playing outside of his natural position? Because his coverage skills left something to be desired. Haskins burned him multiple times with his eyes... looking off wideouts and MicKinney fell for it. He's got good size so maybe he's better suited for strong safety as someone who blitzes and assists in the run game than over the top? He's a junior who has far and away the most experience playing this position so you have to figure he's gonna be the starter going forward.

    Who else at SS?

    Alex Cook: This one is a bit of wild card. Cook maybe should have come to UW as a safety instead of wasting away as a WR his first 2 seasons. A lot of folks figured he'd play safety at the college level and it appears he's seen the writing on the wall. I like his size at SS as well... 6'2 190. Who knows how good he can or can't be here. He's been around for a bit and I wouldn't be upset seeing him get some run given how players who have switched from D to O or O to D have done in this program.

    Starting Free Safety:

    Julius Irvin: Again, another situation where you have to weigh elite talent versus a guy with experience in the system. Irvin was a big-time get out of SoCal with the Dawgs beating out SC, Bama and Notre Dame for the coveted safety. Everything I hear about the kid is that he's next in line to be a star at safety for the Dawgs. I'd like to throw him out there in case he's as good as advertised.

    Who else at FS?

    Isaiah Gilchrist: I almost feel bad slotting him here... and it's likely that he'll see more time than I want or is warranted. Who knows... maybe he's great. He's like Molden in the sense that I'm not sure he's near the talent level of the other guys but he's earned his chance to prove himself. Question is, can we afford to give him that chance? I don't know.

    Who else?

    Cam Williams: Likely see time in a few garbage games. Lake seems to love this kid. I watched a few recruiting tapes and loves this kid's makeup. He's a real leader and my guess is he'll star in special teams until he gets his chance down the road in the secondary.

    Asa Turner: Highly talented but not much space for him this year. Similar path to Williams. Maybe a redshirt.

    I hope you dont have a 25th post. Sheesh!!
    Pumpeii!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
  • TTJTTJ Member Posts: 4,795
    First Anniversary 5 Up Votes 5 Awesomes First Comment
    Q Richardson would have been a fucking savage under this coaching staff, imo.
  • chuckchuck Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 10,587
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    Swaye's Wigwam
    TTJ said:

    Q Richardson would have been a fucking savage under this coaching staff, imo.

    He's one if a handful of players worth wondering about from those days.

    Richardson was a big corner with good quickness and speed. He just wasn't the least bit physical and obviously didn't get the kind of coaching he would now. I think he would have at least been good by his 4th season.
  • haiehaie Member, Swaye's Wigwam Posts: 20,350
    First Anniversary 5 Up Votes First Comment 5 Awesomes
    Swaye's Wigwam
    jecornel said:

    jecornel said:

    I was listening to the Dawgman podcast about the future of our secondary... and per usual, they made few predictions for what our secondary will truly look like going forward.

    I think it can never really be a bad thing to recruit as solidly as we do in the secondary. That said, it's worrisome, at least to me, that the Dawgs might not put the most talented players out there next year given how the majority of our secondary has seen very little action thus far in their time with the program.

    So here are my thoughts, what are yours?

    Starting exterior CB's:

    Keith Taylor: I think this one is clearly a given. He's probably the most talented corner on the roster if you combine his experience and time in the program. At 6'2 190 he's got the prototypical size of a future NFL corner and his elite length combined with plus ball skills and physicality make him a probable future star at UW. He's going to start at least the next 2 seasons one would think. He's superior to Jordan Miller the second he's handed the starting role in my opinion.

    Elijah Molden: This one is a bit of a question mark for me. I like Molden... I like his smarts, his football IQ is elite, he's clearly a talent... but what do I hate about him? HIS SIZE. There's no way he's the 5'11 190 he's listed unless he's put on a lot of weight since the Rose Bowl and grown 2 inches. He played in the slot when Bryant was banged up and he was hit or miss for me in that role. At least from what I remember, when the opposition put tight ends on him his size was exposed. In the Stanford game Kaden Smith routinely chewed him up and spit him out. Now he's likely to start opposite Taylor on the outside and I'd be lying if I said I wasn't a little worried about how he'll handle bigger wideouts on the outside.

    Who else on the exterior?

    Kyler Gordon: This is where I said I'm concerned that if we start a guy like Molden, we're not starting our most talented players. If Kyler Gordon is as good an athlete as we think he is, how can we justify him sitting on the bench for the first 2, maybe 3 seasons as a Dawg? Elijah Molden is a Jr. and he's not gonna get drafted... so if Taylor is slated to start on the opposite side the next 2 years, where does Gordon get his playing time if he's not starting over Molden? From what I hear this kid is the next coming of Jesus athletically... I want him on the field. I guess the way it might happen is he'll be the primary backup for basically all corner positions, kind of like what Austin Joyner did in his first few years. Then in 2020, seeing as Bryant will be graduated, we could see Gordon take the starting exterior role from Molden... and Molden would move back to the nickel role as a senior.

    Dom Hampton: Again, someone who everyone raves about talent wise. I salivate at the prospect of having 2x 6'2 190 lb corners with a ton of length and athleticism starting outside for the Dawgs. But how can it happen? Outside of injuries we cant forecast... I just don't see a way Hampton gets on the field until at least 2020 and maybe only so in a role where he's playing 5 or so snaps a game like Taylor did while he was blocked. Again, it never hurts to have this much talent... you just hope a kid like Hampton not seeing the field isn't a detriment to our potential as a secondary.

    Starting Slot CB:

    Myles Bryant: This one is pretty much a given. Bryant isn't a fan favorite but the coaches and most fans with football intelligence love him. He's a gritty fighter who plays physical in coverage and hits hard. He's prone to some exposure at times because he plays more with intensity and effort than brains. That's the difference with him and Molden - it seems however, the reason he's better than Molden in the slot because physical will tends to outshine brains at the college level. I don't think anyone is complaining having him start in the slot.

    Who else on the interior?

    Like I said, I think Gordon is going to be the primary backup to all corner positions and I think they'd like to give him time at the position on the inside before putting him out on an island.

    Who else?

    Kamren Fabiculanan: A likely redshirt option and will probably not see any time until maybe 2021 on D.

    Trent McDuffie: Another likely redshirt in 2019. Will likely see time in year in 2020 as the backup slot corner and on special teams.

    Starting Strong Safety:

    Brandon McKinney:It might be a little harsh to judge him on his performance in the Rose Bowl when he spelled Taylor Rapp. Maybe he was playing outside of his natural position? Because his coverage skills left something to be desired. Haskins burned him multiple times with his eyes... looking off wideouts and MicKinney fell for it. He's got good size so maybe he's better suited for strong safety as someone who blitzes and assists in the run game than over the top? He's a junior who has far and away the most experience playing this position so you have to figure he's gonna be the starter going forward.

    Who else at SS?

    Alex Cook: This one is a bit of wild card. Cook maybe should have come to UW as a safety instead of wasting away as a WR his first 2 seasons. A lot of folks figured he'd play safety at the college level and it appears he's seen the writing on the wall. I like his size at SS as well... 6'2 190. Who knows how good he can or can't be here. He's been around for a bit and I wouldn't be upset seeing him get some run given how players who have switched from D to O or O to D have done in this program.

    Starting Free Safety:

    Julius Irvin: Again, another situation where you have to weigh elite talent versus a guy with experience in the system. Irvin was a big-time get out of SoCal with the Dawgs beating out SC, Bama and Notre Dame for the coveted safety. Everything I hear about the kid is that he's next in line to be a star at safety for the Dawgs. I'd like to throw him out there in case he's as good as advertised.

    Who else at FS?

    Isaiah Gilchrist: I almost feel bad slotting him here... and it's likely that he'll see more time than I want or is warranted. Who knows... maybe he's great. He's like Molden in the sense that I'm not sure he's near the talent level of the other guys but he's earned his chance to prove himself. Question is, can we afford to give him that chance? I don't know.

    Who else?

    Cam Williams: Likely see time in a few garbage games. Lake seems to love this kid. I watched a few recruiting tapes and loves this kid's makeup. He's a real leader and my guess is he'll star in special teams until he gets his chance down the road in the secondary.

    Asa Turner: Highly talented but not much space for him this year. Similar path to Williams. Maybe a redshirt.

    My thoughts are you spent way too much time on this post. Where were any of these guys going to play with the guys in front of them?

    Lake loves McKinney BTW.

    If you are questioning Molden in any fashion then I'm respectfully asking you to LEAVE!

    Eh, took me maybe 30 minutes to write it up. Have a degree in journalism.

    I like Molden, question his size and overall ceiling because of his size compared to other players.

    And that's my concern to begin with. Do we just start guys because they have more experience? Or do we let guys with more talent play even though they're less experienced? I hope the latter.
    Nuff said on that.

    https://hardcorehusky.com/discussion/54135/i-love-molden/p1
  • dncdnc Member Posts: 56,614
    First Anniversary First Comment 5 Awesomes 5 Up Votes

    McDuffie needs to be the starting punt returner. I don't want him to redshirt.

    No other big disagreements except I think #MyDom finds his way onto the field somehow. He may not start but he'll get a lot of snaps at the corner opposite Taylor either rotating in for Molden (or starting if Molden moves to safety) or with Molden pushing Bryant to the bench at times.

    First and right
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